its saying the Leafs are taking less risks on low upside picks

or players who have a very small chance of being an nhl player
- senstroll

Why isn't he explaining it that way? The way he presents it is really poor.

i think thats the point of that tweet...the leafs are getting away from picking those players who have a very good chance at sucking.

but also...again...ill wait to see how it plays out..i drank the hunter cool aide initially...cuz he spent more time scouting than anyone in the history of hockey (I was told).
- senstroll

OK, so I get that it's not fair to write off everyone from the last 3 drafts, but if you look at the last 10 drafts, here are the guys who the Leafs picked outside the 1st round who have had more than a cup of coffee in the NHL:

Carl Grundstrom - 2nd round - unknown if he finishes his second cup of coffee

Travis Dermott - 2nd round

Pierre Engvall - 7th round. Jury still out

Andreas Johnsson - 7th round

Connor Brown - 6th round

Josh Leivo - 3rd round.

That's just franking appalling.

Seriously, how the frank can they be that bad at drafting?

Why isn't he explaining it that way? The way he presents it is really poor.
- AdamFrench

umm not sure?

I didnt have a problem understanding what he was saying

Any word on who is the backup tonight?
- Atomic Wedgie

Ville Vilhalainen?

i think thats the point of that tweet...the leafs are getting away from picking those players who have a very good chance at sucking.

but also...again...ill wait to see how it plays out..i drank the hunter cool aide initially...cuz he spent more time scouting than anyone in the history of hockey (I was told).
- senstroll

OK sure, but I read this as saying that the Leafs are trying to draft good players now and not draft bad players.

It still comes down to your scouts best guess.

OK, so I get that it's not fair to write off everyone from the last 3 drafts, but if you look at the last 10 drafts, here are the guys who the Leafs picked outside the 1st round who have had more than a cup of coffee in the NHL:

Carl Grundstrom - 2nd round - unknown if he finishes his second cup of coffee

Travis Dermott - 2nd round

Pierre Engvall - 7th round. Jury still out

Andreas Johnsson - 7th round

Connor Brown - 6th round

Josh Leivo - 3rd round.

That's just franking appalling.

Seriously, how the frank can they be that bad at drafting?
- Atomic Wedgie

you have to look at the entire league, the Leafs are not the worst...there are many teams who have faired worse over the same span.

go look at Vancouver from 2005 on..after rd1 ...Leafs look great compared

OK, so I get that it's not fair to write off everyone from the last 3 drafts, but if you look at the last 10 drafts, here are the guys who the Leafs picked outside the 1st round who have had more than a cup of coffee in the NHL:

Carl Grundstrom - 2nd round - unknown if he finishes his second cup of coffee

Travis Dermott - 2nd round

Pierre Engvall - 7th round. Jury still out

Andreas Johnsson - 7th round

Connor Brown - 6th round

Josh Leivo - 3rd round.

That's just franking appalling.

Seriously, how the frank can they be that bad at drafting?
- Atomic Wedgie

That seems horrid.

I wonder how it compares to other teams.

OK sure, but I read this as saying that the Leafs are trying to draft good players now and not draft bad players.

It still comes down to your scouts best guess.
- Aetherial

I bet the leafs are using some tool like the one Mr Bader has to help in drafting

What determines a high-risk pick? That's ridiculous. 96. 69% of these sports probability metrics are horsepoop content.

Sabourin just beat the piss outta Poolman in the Marlies game.

That seems horrid.

I wonder how it compares to other teams.
- Aetherial

Look at Tampa's 2011 draft:

1st round (27th overall): Namestnikov

2nd round (58th overall): Kucherov

5th round (148th): Nikita Nesterov (still in the NHL with Calgary)

7th round (208th): Ondrej Palat

I bet darts at a board would perform as well at drafting outside the top 10.

you have to look at the entire league, the Leafs are not the worst...there are many teams who have faired worse over the same span.

go look at Vancouver from 2005 on..after rd1 ...Leafs look great compared
- senstroll

The thing is - there aren't many. Vancouver, the Islanders, Colorado are worse. But there is a real ineptitude in this team dating back. You can blame Burke, Nonis, Hunter, or what-have-you - but the point is that they are trying to make meaningful change in the approach, and to be honest, it would be hard to get worse.

Look at Tampa's 2011 draft:

1st round (27th overall): Namestnikov

2nd round (58th overall): Kucherov

5th round (148th): Nikita Nesterov (still in the NHL with Calgary)

7th round (208th): Ondrej Palat
- Atomic Wedgie

Going for the letter N, K and V

You get a hot chick who knows nothing about hockey to pick, she'll assemble a dynasty guaranteed.

Sabourin just beat the piss outta Poolman in the Marlies game.
- GreatGigInTheSky

I was hoping he'd be in the line tonight to go after Kassian.

You get a hot chick who knows nothing about hockey to pick, she'll assemble a dynasty guaranteed.
- Zezel

The Tampa model was picking players with strong puck possession skills that even if they didn't perform had that. They also took players with one elite skill and hoped it would develop. Hit/Miss and they hit high and missed a lot. Hence...drafting. History only remembers the hits and misses, nobody really remembers the "oh yeah...that guy!"'s

I'd go as early as the 4th round to start swinging for the fences.

I like Dubas and his idea for his players. He likes high skill and high skating. I think skating ranks the highest on his list and he is right in that idea I believe.

The way i see it is, you can trade skill. Difficult to trade "physicality". Also it's pretty clear you can get grit for cheap. Bogosian, Thornton to a degree, Simmonds, etc.
- Aaron_85

Bogo won't be so cheap next year. But I'd still like to sign him.

I bet darts at a board would perform as well at drafting outside the top 10.
- Zezel

you are not really wrong.

some teams you can fire the entire scouting staff and do better with darts

https://canucksarmy.com/2...-have-a-scouting-problem/

or just make up some rules and a fake scout and stick to them

say our scout is a summer intern called “Sham Sharron“. Sham will not pick and choose his draft selections. He has no access to game tape, he has seen no games, and he has no fancy stats or analytics to aid his decision. He will select all players by the following rules:

All players selected will be from the Canadian Hockey League.
Goalies are voodoo, they will not be selected at any time.
Defensemen are voodoo, they will not be selected at any time.
The Canucks’ selection will be the player still on the draft board that scored the most points in their 17 year old CHL season that was for-realsies taken between Vancouver’s selection and Vancouver’s subsequent selection.
No other information other than the total number of points a player had in his 17-year old season (his first year of draft eligibility) is considered. This information was freely available at the time each draft was held.
Ties are broken on the basis of points per game.

The thing is - there aren't many. Vancouver, the Islanders, Colorado are worse. But there is a real ineptitude in this team dating back. You can blame Burke, Nonis, Hunter, or what-have-you - but the point is that they are trying to make meaningful change in the approach, and to be honest, it would be hard to get worse.
- Monkeypunk

Iv read lots of articles on the subject, and based on NHL games played from your picks...the leafs usually end up somewhere in the 15-20 range league wide.


so bad drafting and bad GMing...its a deadly combo

you have to look at the entire league, the Leafs are not the worst...there are many teams who have faired worse over the same span.

go look at Vancouver from 2005 on..after rd1 ...Leafs look great compared
- senstroll

It really makes me question the value of the minor league system.

The Marlies are at best developing two guys a year to become regulars in the NHL.

The only guys this year with a hope of being NHL regulars are Liljegren and Sandin, and maybe a goalie.

That seems like an awful lot of money to spend on developing two-three players.

And don't even get me started on the Growlers.

I do like what the Kings have done.

Byron Bader
@ByronMBader
Besides the Leafs, another team that has almost completely pulled away from the low probability draft pick is the LA Kings who, of course, have built one of the best prospect pools in the NHL in a pretty short time.

But what kind of way is that to go through life, being right all the time? Seriously, what’s that like?
- Canada Cup

Let me ask my wife ..err, actually you just go ask yours.

It really makes me question the value of the minor league system.

The Marlies are at best developing two guys a year to become regulars in the NHL.

The only guys this year with a hope of being NHL regulars are Liljegren and Sandin, and maybe a goalie.

That seems like an awful lot of money to spend on developing two-three players.

And don't even get me started on the Growlers.
- Atomic Wedgie

2 - 3 is all a team needs. You trade the other potential. That is 10% of your roster a year stepping up. You can move picks for others. Plus your FA's like Bogosian and your long term deals. Honestly, if it's consistent I don't see a problem.

you are not really wrong.

some teams you can fire the entire scouting staff and do better with darts

https://canucksarmy.com/2...-have-a-scouting-problem/

or just make up some rules and a fake scout and stick to them





- senstroll

There's a lot of money into scouting and it all seems for naught at the end of the day with results like these.