Toronto Should have traded for Marleau

You are correct Laine will want a ton,

Thankful Jets have some unbelievable deals in place with guys like Shiefele, Ehlers and Morrisey. I also have no issue with Connor or Helly’s deal.
This is a set back year for Winnipeg no doubt but the future is still very bright. Would be better without Maurice but that’s a topic for another day.

The jets and Leafs are actually extremely similar. Great forwards, goal scoring not an issue. D sucks and are too reliant on great goaltending.

Our D should look different next year. I’m excited for Samberg and Heinola and see who else we bring in.
- Ross77

A "set back year". LOL. Their defense walked en masse. I always said there would be problems there, with Buff being so old, Trouba a malcontent. I suspect you'll see further decline out of Wheeler too, given his age.

I think the Jets will need a retool, that will last at least a couple of years.

Toronto Should have traded for Marleau



- classic321

What a disaster that signing was.

yeah, but he's 27. And this year's output is the highest he's ever had, by a wide margin. What do you really think the chances are he's transformed from a 35 point player to a 60 point 30 goal scorer? and what do you think the chances are he had a hot streak?

It wouldn't matter too much if it was JUST a rental, but the contract could be a problem. I'm not saying it will, because $5M isn't too out of control.

Playing on teams that don't have proper top line players can often have the effect of pumping up some players stats. When you have no one else to give PP time other than a mediocre player that doesn't deserve the time, it has the effect of pumping up that players stats. Think of it as the Karlsson effect. The guy was getting like 6 minutes of PP time, and enormous amounts of OZ starts, at times of his career in Ottawa. That's bound to have an impact on a players point totals...... The claims were that if he went to a better team, he'd score more. But that doesn't seem to be coming to fruition, does it?

It often doesn't. Because they don't get all the same ice time.
- prock

We go through this every year. Last year Brock Nelson got $6M and it was a hilarious overpayment and oh would you look at that it turns out that it's not even close to that.

The cap creeps up a little every year and every year someone gets a raise and the masses judge their contract based off of their perception of either the current or older cap hits. I've seen enough coverage about it going up the max 5% this year, which adds over $4M to the upper limit.

Pageau's $5M AAV is hardly an overpayment at under 6% of that and that percentage is only going to go down over time.

He's versatile, he's a right shot centerman that kills penalties and can probably play 2nd PP unit and is good off the draw. He's exactly the type of player the Islanders needed. He's a complete swiss army knife that won't be obsolete when he starts to decline.

The argument about his career offensive year is irrelevant. The Islanders didn't bring him in because they expected him to score 30 riding shotgun with Barzal. He fills a multitude of needs for them. You could make a more-than-fair argument that the Islanders have the most well-rounded center group in the Metro. Not the most skilled or the highest scoring or one that features the most exciting superstar, but the top-to-bottom deepest four centers, when healthy, that get trotted out there on a nightly basis.

yeah, but he's 27. And this year's output is the highest he's ever had, by a wide margin. What do you really think the chances are he's transformed from a 35 point player to a 60 point 30 goal scorer? and what do you think the chances are he had a hot streak?

It wouldn't matter too much if it was JUST a rental, but the contract could be a problem. I'm not saying it will, because $5M isn't too out of control.

Playing on teams that don't have proper top line players can often have the effect of pumping up some players stats. When you have no one else to give PP time other than a mediocre player that doesn't deserve the time, it has the effect of pumping up that players stats. Think of it as the Karlsson effect. The guy was getting like 6 minutes of PP time, and enormous amounts of OZ starts, at times of his career in Ottawa. That's bound to have an impact on a players point totals...... The claims were that if he went to a better team, he'd score more. But that doesn't seem to be coming to fruition, does it?

It often doesn't. Because they don't get all the same ice time.
- prock

Steve Sullivan Syndrome? Rack up a ton of points getting a ton of ice time playing on a bad team? On a good team his points decline with less ice time and PP time? Perhaps. Or maybe he's who he is right now. A 25-30 goal scorer who's best years are ahead of him. I think Pageau has 3 more productive seasons before his play drops off. We'll see. I think the Isles are a good fit for him. Trotz makes players better by allowing them to succeed in proper roles.

I love Ek's uneducated short term view of the trade deadline for the Hurricanes. This is a team that understands they will get Mrazek back and, rather than pursue pure rentals, went and got players with term that will help them beyond this year when they once again have 2 healthy goalies.

Go ahead, tell us more. How about the one where Kane and Keith were being packaged together?

I love Ek's uneducated short term view of the trade deadline for the Hurricanes. This is a team that understands they will get Mrazek back and, rather than pursue pure rentals, went and got players with term that will help them beyond this year when they once again have 2 healthy goalies.

Go ahead, tell us more. How about the one where Kane and Keith were being packaged together?
- rmull905

Ek is still bitter Carolina made the playoffs last season and the Flyers didn't. Canes even won a couple of playoff rounds.

We go through this every year. Last year Brock Nelson got $6M and it was a hilarious overpayment and oh would you look at that it turns out that it's not even close to that.

The cap creeps up a little every year and every year someone gets a raise and the masses judge their contract based off of their perception of either the current or older cap hits. I've seen enough coverage about it going up the max 5% this year, which adds over $4M to the upper limit.

Pageau's $5M AAV is hardly an overpayment at under 6% of that and that percentage is only going to go down over time.

He's versatile, he's a right shot centerman that kills penalties and can probably play 2nd PP unit and is good off the draw. He's exactly the type of player the Islanders needed. He's a complete swiss army knife that won't be obsolete when he starts to decline.

The argument about his career offensive year is irrelevant. The Islanders didn't bring him in because they expected him to score 30 riding shotgun with Barzal. He fills a multitude of needs for them. You could make a more-than-fair argument that the Islanders have the most well-rounded center group in the Metro. Not the most skilled or the highest scoring or one that features the most exciting superstar, but the top-to-bottom deepest four centers, when healthy, that get trotted out there on a nightly basis.
- eichiefs9

Basically it's ok if my team signs that contract. But if any other team does it's an overpayment. Nylander's deal looks very good right now. Roeper is right about that. I like Pageau's all around game and think he's an excellent fit for the Isles. The Isles don't rely on one or two players to carry them. It's Trotz's system and the complete buy in from the players which makes them successful. They don't wow anyone with star power like the Leafs do. But they have alot of very good players who play a solid team game.

We go through this every year. Last year Brock Nelson got $6M and it was a hilarious overpayment and oh would you look at that it turns out that it's not even close to that.

The cap creeps up a little every year and every year someone gets a raise and the masses judge their contract based off of their perception of either the current or older cap hits. I've seen enough coverage about it going up the max 5% this year, which adds over $4M to the upper limit.

Pageau's $5M AAV is hardly an overpayment at under 6% of that and that percentage is only going to go down over time.

He's versatile, he's a right shot centerman that kills penalties and can probably play 2nd PP unit and is good off the draw. He's exactly the type of player the Islanders needed. He's a complete swiss army knife that won't be obsolete when he starts to decline.

The argument about his career offensive year is irrelevant. The Islanders didn't bring him in because they expected him to score 30 riding shotgun with Barzal. He fills a multitude of needs for them. You could make a more-than-fair argument that the Islanders have the most well-rounded center group in the Metro. Not the most skilled or the highest scoring or one that features the most exciting superstar, but the top-to-bottom deepest four centers, when healthy, that get trotted out there on a nightly basis.
- eichiefs9

I still think Brock Nelson and Lee deals are not good at all. The issue is they are paid for years after their prime ones.

It's funny how much crap Dubas gets for his deals.

Isles have so many aging grinders on their roster. And the big young"Star" has been a 60 point player the past 2 years.

Ek is still bitter Carolina made the playoffs last season and the Flyers didn't. Canes even won a couple of playoff rounds.
- gergeswillems

I am surprised often times that Ek can spell team names outside of the Flyers...

I mean, don't get me wrong, I love coming here for the comedy, but jesus, the guy puts himself out there like he has sources or has a baseline understanding of the game of hockey... or finance... or how trades work...

With the sheer volume of inaccurate "information" he spreads, he should/will run for president and win.

I still think Brock Nelson and Lee deals are not good at all. The issue is they are paid for years after their prime ones.

It's funny how much crap Dubas gets for his deals.

Isles have so many aging grinders on their roster. And the big young"Star" has been a 60 point player the past 2 years.
- RogerRoeper

Dubas is in the biggest hockey market so he gets the most criticism.You know that. The Isles are a niche fanbase trying to exist being surrounded by an army of Rangers fans. Apples and oranges.

Dubas is in the biggest hockey market so he gets the most criticism.You know that. The Isles are a niche fanbase trying to exist in an army of Rangers fans. Apples and oranges.
- gergeswillems

Eh, all signings should be viewed equal as market value.

Basically it's ok if my team signs that contract. But if any other team does it's an overpayment. Nylander's deal looks very good right now. Roeper is right about that. I like Pageau's all around game and think he's an excellent fit for the Isles. The Isles don't rely on one or two players to carry them. It's Trotz's system and the complete buy in from the players which makes them successful. They don't wow anyone with star power like the Leafs do. But they have alot of very good players who play a solid team game.
- gergeswillems

Trotz's entire system is predicated on being able to roll four lines. The Isles aren't beating anyone on skill alone and very clearly have trouble signing the bigger name UFA's. They've bought in wholesale to everything Trotz preaches and it's clearly working. Pageau is a luxury on the third line.

They'll have to figure out how to add another middle-six RW and a third line LW into the fold over the next year or two, assuming they don't extend Brassard and I don't think they will. I'd like to see them take a stab at acquiring Labanc to fill that one of those spots, personally.

Trotz's entire system is predicated on being able to roll four lines. The Isles aren't beating anyone on skill alone and very clearly have trouble signing the bigger name UFA's. They've bought in wholesale to everything Trotz preaches and it's clearly working. Pageau is a luxury on the third line.

They'll have to figure out how to add another middle-six RW and a third line LW into the fold over the next year or two, assuming they don't extend Brassard and I don't think they will. I'd like to see them take a stab at acquiring Labanc to fill that one of those spots, personally.
- eichiefs9

Labanc would be a good fit. He'll likely want to cash in this summer after he did Doug Wilson a favour by accepting a lowball contract.

I am surprised often times that Ek can spell team names outside of the Flyers...

I mean, don't get me wrong, I love coming here for the comedy, but jesus, the guy puts himself out there like he has sources or has a baseline understanding of the game of hockey... or finance... or how trades work...

With the sheer volume of inaccurate "information" he spreads, he should/will run for president and win.
- rmull905

I honestly don't believe Ek watches any hockey but Flyers games.

I love Ek's uneducated short term view of the trade deadline for the Hurricanes. This is a team that understands they will get Mrazek back and, rather than pursue pure rentals, went and got players with term that will help them beyond this year when they once again have 2 healthy goalies.

Go ahead, tell us more. How about the one where Kane and Keith were being packaged together?
- rmull905

that's the thing. Even if the whole thing falls apart this year, the players they got will help them next year as well (With the possible exception of Vatanen).

Labanc would be a good fit. He'll likely want to cash in this summer after he did Doug Wilson a favour by accepting a lowball contract.
- gergeswillems

He probably will, but his output took a big dip this season. Obviously some of that is because the Sharks are a tire-fire, but he's not exactly going to have a lot of leverage working in his favor. While it's far from a sure thing, I wouldn't be the slightest bit surprised to see them shop Leddy this summer.

We go through this every year. Last year Brock Nelson got $6M and it was a hilarious overpayment and oh would you look at that it turns out that it's not even close to that.

The cap creeps up a little every year and every year someone gets a raise and the masses judge their contract based off of their perception of either the current or older cap hits. I've seen enough coverage about it going up the max 5% this year, which adds over $4M to the upper limit.

Pageau's $5M AAV is hardly an overpayment at under 6% of that and that percentage is only going to go down over time.

He's versatile, he's a right shot centerman that kills penalties and can probably play 2nd PP unit and is good off the draw. He's exactly the type of player the Islanders needed. He's a complete swiss army knife that won't be obsolete when he starts to decline.

The argument about his career offensive year is irrelevant. The Islanders didn't bring him in because they expected him to score 30 riding shotgun with Barzal. He fills a multitude of needs for them. You could make a more-than-fair argument that the Islanders have the most well-rounded center group in the Metro. Not the most skilled or the highest scoring or one that features the most exciting superstar, but the top-to-bottom deepest four centers, when healthy, that get trotted out there on a nightly basis.
- eichiefs9

I mean, you can argue that those aren't overpayments based on other mediocre players with big contracts, but neither are good contracts. I don't really think 53 points warrants $6M. And if Pageau keeps up his 50 to 60 point play, going forward, then sure. But I have a hard time seeing it. it's rare 27 year old players suddenly figure it out and take steps forward like that.

As I said originally, it's not a horrendous contract, but it's not really a good one either. If he reverts to being a 35 to 40 point player, which I think it's more likely he does than he doesn't, it's definitely an overpayment.

I honestly don't believe Ek watches any hockey but Flyers games.
- gergeswillems

I don't even know that he watches those... I think he knows there's a team there that goes by the Flyers and that's where his hockey knowledge ends

I mean, you can argue that those aren't overpayments based on other mediocre players with big contracts, but neither are good contracts. I don't really think 53 points warrants $6M. And if Pageau keeps up his 50 to 60 point play, going forward, then sure. But I have a hard time seeing it. it's rare 27 year old players suddenly figure it out and take steps forward like that.

As I said originally, it's not a horrendous contract, but it's not really a good one either. If he reverts to being a 35 to 40 point player, which I think it's more likely he does than he doesn't, it's definitely an overpayment.
- prock

One big issue is signing guys for so many years in their 30;'s.

https://youtu.be/q24w0OaXfa0
- gergeswillems

what a legend

what a legend
- mgriffen

You know I always felt bad for Steve Smith. Sure. He screwed up in a big playoff game. That goal eliminated the Oilers. He took alot of abuse from Oilers fans that summer. But they had plenty of time to tie the game up and they didn't. That's on the team. I was happy to see Gretzky hand Smith the Cup first when the Oilers won it the next season. 😊 That 85-86 Oilers team may have been one of the best teams to not win the Cup. The Flames were likely the only team who could've eliminated them that year.

that's the thing. Even if the whole thing falls apart this year, the players they got will help them next year as well (With the possible exception of Vatanen).
- BINGO!

Exactly... or to be more precise... BINGO!

I'm of the opinion that this is EXACTLY what you do when you lose 2 goales and one is for an unknown period of time. Everyone and their dog expected them to chase a goalie, and the price was probably stupid because they knew the injury situation. He got Trochek basically for free in my view, and Skjei is well worth a 1st - Vatanen - meh, but the cost seems pretty low there in my view too

You know I always felt bad for Steve Smith. Sure. He screwed up in a big playoff game. That goal eliminated the Oilers. He took alot of abuse from Oilers fans that summer. But they had plenty of time to tie the game up and they didn't. That's on the team. I was happy to see Gretzky hand Smith the Cup first when the Oilers won it the next season. 😊 That 85-86 Oilers team may have been one of the best teams to not win the Cup. The Flames were likely the only team who could've eliminated them that year.
- gergeswillems

That Wayne is one swell dude

I mean, you can argue that those aren't overpayments based on other mediocre players with big contracts, but neither are good contracts. I don't really think 53 points warrants $6M. And if Pageau keeps up his 50 to 60 point play, going forward, then sure. But I have a hard time seeing it. it's rare 27 year old players suddenly figure it out and take steps forward like that.

As I said originally, it's not a horrendous contract, but it's not really a good one either. If he reverts to being a 35 to 40 point player, which I think it's more likely he does than he doesn't, it's definitely an overpayment.
- prock

Nelson is three points away from last season's 82 game total in 62 games this year. That contract is more than fine. And Pageau doesn't need to be posting 60 point seasons to be earning that money.

I'm not sitting here saying either contract is some sort of home-run deal made by Lou, but he's paying fair market value. Pageau would have easily gotten $5M or more on the open market in July.