If I'm GMJR my chat with Fleury would include "listen, you can waive your NTC and go here or there, or you can probably end up in Vegas, choice is yours"
- MattStrat

This is so frustrating with the lack of consistency with expansion rules. Last I heard, Fleury cannot go to Vegas as his NTC automatically means he is protected (meaning Murray is exposed).

The why is extremely easy... aside from a handful of games in this postseason, hes looked done for the bulk of the season, and most of last season. Hes not worth even half the cap hit now. 3.85 million is not worth 4 games in the playoffs.

I'd take a mid round pick, or a B prospect.
- Guile

Thats not the question. If you were another GM....what would you give up to take Kunitz and why?

If you're not a playoff team, 1 yr of Kunitz offers nothing of value vs picks and prospects. If you're contender you most likely dont have the cap space to take him on and it you wanted his playoff experience you are unloading something back that has a cap hit you dont value anymore. I just dont see a scenario where you can unload all of his cap hit.

This is so frustrating with the lack of consistency with expansion rules. Last I heard, Fleury cannot go to Vegas as his NTC automatically means he is protected (meaning Murray is exposed).
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Ohhh...admittedly, I'm not looking much into the expansion rules. I just feel really strongly against expeanding to Vegas. Its a sh!t show.

Why hasnt any other major league had a team there yet?

The why is extremely easy... aside from a handful of games in this postseason, hes looked done for the bulk of the season, and most of last season. Hes not worth even half the cap hit now. 3.85 million is not worth 4 games in the playoffs.

I'd take a mid round pick, or a B prospect.
- Guile

I can only think of Anaheim as a team that might make sense that would want him. They've got a lot of cap space...a lot of expiring contracts to consider...but a lot of cap space to play with.

I can only think of Anaheim as a team that might make sense that would want him. They've got a lot of cap space...a lot of expiring contracts to consider...but a lot of cap space to play with.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Yeah and he already has a cup ring with them playing the left side of Getzlaf and Perry.

Ohhh...admittedly, I'm not looking much into the expansion rules. I just feel really strongly against expeanding to Vegas. Its a sh!t show.

Why hasnt any other major league had a team there yet?
- MattStrat

That and theres not enough NHL talent to fill the teams in the league now. Also many teams struggle with ticket sales and some can't sell out playoff games.

Ohhh...admittedly, I'm not looking much into the expansion rules. I just feel really strongly against expeanding to Vegas. Its a sh!t show.

Why hasnt any other major league had a team there yet?
- MattStrat

I hear you...but it's a reality and it does majorly impact the Fleury situation.

Imagine if Fleury was as leaky as Murray this past post season. Everyone on herr would be female doging about it.
- Grinder47

Fleury usually is as leaky as Murray. That's why you move him and get the same leaky goaltending for a fraction of the cost.

Thats not the question. If you were another GM....what would you give up to take Kunitz and why?

If you're not a playoff team, 1 yr of Kunitz offers nothing of value vs picks and prospects. If you're contender you most likely dont have the cap space to take him on and it you wanted his playoff experience you are unloading something back that has a cap hit you dont value anymore. I just dont see a scenario where you can unload all of his cap hit.
- sammy87

Ah my bad, you are asking from the other side.

There are teams that have cap space and still love the veteran leadership and grit styles... Colorado and Anaheim would be my first two calls.

Florida also could have a huge amount of cap space to play with, and they are doing the old man club down there with vets.

Also might phone over to Arizona, them purusing Goli, might be wanting to start making a strong push.

I hear you...but it's a reality and it does majorly impact the Fleury situation.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Someone estimated 1800 USA Hockey registered amateur hockey players in the entire state of Nevada. Not a great amount of interested youth. Also, I think a minor league franchise did not do that well there either and folded?

This is about a really rich guy offering the NHL $500 million as an expansion fee, and the NHL taking it without thinking about the long term.

I really think Vegas is a terrible idea. I think its going to be a hard place for the players to play. Think about it, they are going to be living in Vegas. A lot of these players like the night life, especially the younger ones. Also...Malone and Stoll arnt the only NHL'rs who indulge in coke....not even close.


Why would Vegas have a stronger fan base than Arizona, especially in the first few years? They wont. The arena will be filled (or partially filled) every game with drunken tourists who dont give a sh!t about hockey or fans of the opposing team on vacation there. I feel like it will be a loud arena but not so much because everyone will be cheering at once but because everyone will be talking at once.

With regards to Fleury...I really wouldnt be surprised if he's a Penguin opening night.
- MattStrat

Being an East Coast transplant here in Vegas I can tell you hockey will thrive out here. There are a lot of East Coast people living out here plus more coming each day. Vegas has also been clammoring for a pro sport, so people will come just based on that. I think it will be a better market than AZ.

The ball is entirely in Fleury's court.... If he want's to be a starter somewhere (very few spots), he and his agent can grease those wheels and make a trade happen. If he wants to stay and try to win him starter job back, he can easily structure his "no trade" list to force that to happen.

I just can't imagine staying would be a good situation for him. Even if he wins the starter job out of camp, he's gotta feel like Sullivan would have a very little patience before going back to his guy.

But besides Yohe's comment, none of us know what MAF's motivation is.

Someone estimated 1800 USA Hockey registered amateur hockey players in the entire state of Nevada. Not a great amount of interested youth. Also, I think a minor league franchise did not do that well there either and folded?

This is about a really rich guy offering the NHL $500 million as an expansion fee, and the NHL taking it without thinking about the long term.
- PensFan1962

The minor league franchise folded because it was ran poorly, no other reason.

Ah my bad, you are asking from the other side.

There are teams that have cap space and still love the veteran leadership and grit styles... Colorado and Anaheim would be my first two calls.

Florida also could have a huge amount of cap space to play with, and they are doing the old man club down there with vets.

Also might phone over to Arizona, them purusing Goli, might be wanting to start making a strong push.
- Guile

AV's are stupid but they have Iggy for vet experience and they need D not Offense. Desperately! They have Ratatenen as a top prospect but they will need him and all the picks they have. PHX same situation. 1 year of Kunitz doesn't do much for those teams.

Its easy to say yeah Id take a 1st or 2nd for MAF and a bag of pucks for Kunitz.....but you also have to ask what you give up....no body here ever does.

Lets package Honrquest, MAF and BB for Sam Bennett and a 1st.....stupid.

Being an East Coast transplant here in Vegas I can tell you hockey will thrive out here. There are a lot of East Coast people living out here plus more coming each day. Vegas has also been clammoring for a pro sport, so people will come just based on that. I think it will be a better market than AZ.
- Rinosaur

Isn't the arena behind Caesars? I always heard locals avoid the strip at all cost...I could see hockey being popular since its like 200 degrees in the summer.

I always have fun in Vegas...for 3 nights thats it!

Someone estimated 1800 USA Hockey registered amateur hockey players in the entire state of Nevada. Not a great amount of interested youth. Also, I think a minor league franchise did not do that well there either and folded?

This is about a really rich guy offering the NHL $500 million as an expansion fee, and the NHL taking it without thinking about the long term.
- PensFan1962

I'm sure USA Hockey numbers in most southern/western markets were similar before NHL teams went there. An NHL team will improve those numbers.

And I have no idea of an NHL franchise will work there or not, but you can't compare the success (or lack or it) for a past minor league team.

Like most non-traditional markets, it all depends on how successful the team is in the early years. Look at Dallas, Tampa and even Florida and Carolina.... Winning (or even almost winning) buys you a lot of time, and builds a young fan base. But markets who have struggled to win, are in trouble (like Arizona is and Atlanta was).

Nashville seems to be the biggest success story, that market has really embraced that team and has grown with them, even without major success.

AV's are stupid but they have Iggy for vet experience and they need D not Offense. Desperately! They have Ratatenen as a top prospect but they will need him and all the picks they have. PHX same situation. 1 year of Kunitz doesn't do much for those teams.

Its easy to say yeah Id take a 1st or 2nd for MAF and a bag of pucks for Kunitz.....but you also have to ask what you give up....no body here ever does.

Lets package Honrquest, MAF and BB for Sam Bennett and a 1st.....stupid.
- sammy87

Colorado is losing Boedker (unless they want to overpay for that rental), and their GM is just bad. I could see a trade with them.


But hey, if you want to find a way to get Sam Bennett, lets do it


Also, you neglected the Florida option, who i doubt is keeping Campbell (or at least, no where near that cost for a 38 year old Dman). They could swing to have a 3 Cup winner try to help them make a push this upcoming year.
Judler and Purcell were also rentals... they could have near 20 mil opened from 3 players.

Leverage is a myth in the NHL. Every year we hear how a team is screwed because they have no leverage to move a player then a week later they get a great deal for the player.
- jaydogg1974

Leverage isn't a myth. But its a myth that are leverage decreases with fleury. We know our leverage right now. Its a one team market with Calgary. With Dallas a 2nd option but cap issues are a mess.

Maybe Chicago is having a good year next year. Crawford gets hurt (or pick your team). Sudden TDL deal for Fleury we have a ton of leverage. Or after next season. Dallas buys out there 2 goalies after flopping again and is willing to make a move on fleury. Or Toronto signs stamkos; sucks for one more year; and then needs a franchise goalie. Buffalo gives up on lehner. Needs franchise goalie. Or expansion draft rules come out that only full NMC are auto protect. Pouliot has a big year. Turns out our best bet is to lose Fleury in expansion and keep our roster intact. Too many variables between now and then to decide how much leverage we have.

Or Murray suffers career ending injury. And we need to keep fleury. Last minute 25th hour before the expansion draft trade may have zero leverage, but we really don't know the variables.

Colorado is losing Boedker (unless they want to overpay for that rental), and their GM is just bad. I could see a trade with them.


But hey, if you want to find a way to get Sam Bennett, lets do it


Also, you neglected the Florida option, who i doubt is keeping Campbell (or at least, no where near that cost for a 38 year old Dman). They could swing to have a 3 Cup winner try to help them make a push this upcoming year.
Judler and Purcell were also rentals... they could have near 20 mil opened from 3 players.
- Guile

FLA could be an option. I dont know their makeup that well other than Ekblad might be the next Lidstrom and Barkov looks like he could be a stud.

The why is extremely easy... aside from a handful of games in this postseason, hes looked done for the bulk of the season, and most of last season. Hes not worth even half the cap hit now. 3.85 million is not worth 4 games in the playoffs.

I'd take a mid round pick, or a B prospect.
- Guile

Me too, but problem with Kunitz is the cap isn't an issue this year. UFA mkt isn't great so replacing him for one year will be tough. He's still solid depth. More than capable of being a stud 4th liner.

Ohhh...admittedly, I'm not looking much into the expansion rules. I just feel really strongly against expeanding to Vegas. Its a sh!t show.

Why hasnt any other major league had a team there yet?
- MattStrat

Vegas full-time population has grown a lot. The city may have been fringy in terms of size before.

Colorado is losing Boedker (unless they want to overpay for that rental), and their GM is just bad. I could see a trade with them.


But hey, if you want to find a way to get Sam Bennett, lets do it


Also, you neglected the Florida option, who i doubt is keeping Campbell (or at least, no where near that cost for a 38 year old Dman). They could swing to have a 3 Cup winner try to help them make a push this upcoming year.
Judler and Purcell were also rentals... they could have near 20 mil opened from 3 players.
- Guile

Boedker will probably get overpaid but he would be a tremendous fit here.

Colorado is losing Boedker (unless they want to overpay for that rental), and their GM is just bad. I could see a trade with them.


But hey, if you want to find a way to get Sam Bennett, lets do it


Also, you neglected the Florida option, who i doubt is keeping Campbell (or at least, no where near that cost for a 38 year old Dman). They could swing to have a 3 Cup winner try to help them make a push this upcoming year.
Judler and Purcell were also rentals... they could have near 20 mil opened from 3 players.
- Guile

BTW I think BOedker would be an excellent fit with the Pens and Sullivan.

Me too, but problem with Kunitz is the cap isn't an issue this year. UFA mkt isn't great so replacing him for one year will be tough. He's still solid depth. More than capable of being a stud 4th liner.
- sditulli

We were mad at paying Adams ~1 mil being on the 4th line... you want 3.85 mil for a 4 liner?

BTW I think BOedker would be an excellent fit with the Pens and Sullivan.
- sammy87

He could be... but hes looking like a 5mil+ contract demander.

We were mad at paying Adams ~1 mil being on the 4th line... you want 3.85 mil for a 4 liner?



He could be... but hes looking like a 5mil+ contract demander.
- Guile

It would be nice if they could target him if MAF or KUni are gone. There aren't too many holes on the club. I think Fehr and Cole are replaceable as well.