Moving someone like Marner/Nylander for someone like Lindholm is by no means impatiently under-cutting the rebuild. This is simply a case of you over-valuing your young forwards due to a hot start and under-valuing a stud young RFA D-man in Lindholm.

It's actually excessive to the point of you ignoring the log-jam of top 9 F prospects and the relative weakness of quality D depth in the Leafs system. This would not be a hasty, get better now move. It would be a solid long term move and a prudent one for taking advantage of the Ducks current situation. If you took the homer glasses off and quit seeing Marner as Patrick Kane then you might realize that.
- RonPielep

So what has Lindholm done that makes him such a commodity?
Lindholm is good but lets be clear here. He is no Drew Doughty. He's not even as good as Morgan Reilley. Your dropping Gardiner down to the third pairing to make room for Lindholm. He's not a proven commodity. He is a young prospect who has shown some success in the NHL Is that really worth William Nylander? Especially with Travis Dermott coming, probably next year.... If anything, the Jake Gardiner experience should make leaf fans hesitant to go all in on a trade for a guy who has shown promise.

And sorry, but I believed Marner was the second best player in that draft. He has done nothing since to prove me wrong. He was just too small. NO way he goes for a second pairing dman.

So what has Lindholm done that makes him such a commodity?
Lindholm is good but lets be clear here. He is no Drew Doughty. He's not even as good as Morgan Reilley. Your dropping Gardiner down to the third pairing to make room for Lindholm. He's not a proven commodity. He is a young prospect who has shown some success in the NHL Is that really worth William Nylander? Especially with Travis Dermott coming, probably next year.... If anything, the Jake Gardiner experience should make leaf fans hesitant to go all in on a trade for a guy who has shown promise.
- B-Wforever

Trading away guys like Marner, nylander could come back to bite you hard. Like the poster said they have begun their careers quite well in a very short span. even though it's a short span you don't trade them away as they are just starting and showing promise.

Gotta wonder if the Leafs will ever have room for players like Leipsic, Gauthier, Johnson, Rychel, Kapanen, Bracco, Soshnikov, Lindberg, etc...




- RonPielep

Wrong Bozak is at the top

So what has Lindholm done that makes him such a commodity?
Lindholm is good but lets be clear here. He is no Drew Doughty. He's not even as good as Morgan Reilley. Your dropping Gardiner down to the third pairing to make room for Lindholm. He's not a proven commodity. He is a young prospect who has shown some success in the NHL Is that really worth William Nylander? Especially with Travis Dermott coming, probably next year.... If anything, the Jake Gardiner experience should make leaf fans hesitant to go all in on a trade for a guy who has shown promise.

And sorry, but I believed Marner was the second best player in that draft. He has done nothing since to prove me wrong. He was just too small. NO way he goes for a second pairing dman.
- B-Wforever

You're going to talk to me about how Lindholm is not a proven commodity while trying to convince me it is a bad idea to trade Marner/Nylander for him because Dermott is coming along.

I'm done.

Funny eks on point ,he really is on this one,Anaheim it's fowler, but wants Nylander, toronto lindholm, Nylander and marner are not on the table, but jvr is ,the problem is the plus side (stoner for one)and inclusion of torontos 1st, That's why they shifted away from trouba the 1st pickt killed it! (For now)source yo mama!

You're going to talk to me about how Lindholm is not a proven commodity while trying to convince me it is a bad idea to trade Marner/Nylander for him because Dermott is coming along.

I'm done.
- RonPielep

I agree with you ron

You're going to talk to me about how Lindholm is not a proven commodity while trying to convince me it is a bad idea to trade Marner/Nylander for him because Dermott is coming along.

I'm done.
- RonPielep

You said the leafs don;t have any decent prospects coming. I beg to differ. (Dermott)
Dermott doesn't cost the leafs Marner or Nylander. It just costs them time.
The leafs aren't winning the cup this year, so having a hole in defense this year is not of huge consequence. This year I'd rather see them playing Corrado/MArincin to see if there is anything there worth salvaging.

Once the expansion draft is over, the leafs can look at adding to their roster. Barring a yard sale by a desperate team, zero reason for the leafs to make a move right now.

Are you that desperate for clicks Ek? Grow up.
- gergeswillems

yep, that's why he makes this crap up. what better than to fire up the Leafs fans

You're going to talk to me about how Lindholm is not a proven commodity while trying to convince me it is a bad idea to trade Marner/Nylander for him because Dermott is coming along.

I'm done.
- RonPielep

Leafs don't even know what they have in Marner or nylander. No idea who will be the better of the two. They're a few years away from potentially competing a cup. Way to early to give up on either of them until you have more info to go on. And paying full value or overpaying for a dman isn't exactly taking advantage of a teams situation. I'd offer a package of players picks and prospects not named Matthews Marner or nylander. If they take it great if not wait and see how guys like Nielsen dermott VaLiev zaitsev pan out. Even with Lindholm it's not like they're winning the cup this year so what's he rush. Imagine if the black hawks went and traded kane or toews in their rookie season because they wevent sure what they had in keith seabrook or hjalmerson

You said the leafs don;t have any decent prospects coming. I beg to differ. (Dermott)
Dermott doesn't cost the leafs Marner or Nylander. It just costs them time.
The leafs aren't winning the cup this year, so having a hole in defense this year is not of huge consequence. This year I'd rather see them playing Corrado/MArincin to see if there is anything there worth salvaging.

Once the expansion draft is over, the leafs can look at adding to their roster. Barring a yard sale by a desperate team, zero reason for the leafs to make a move right now.
- B-Wforever

First of all, no I didn't say that, either learn how to read/comprehend better or learn how to quote properly.

Secondly, the fact that you'd rather see them playing Marincin as opposed to filling the hole on D with a quality young RFA like Trouba/Lindholm is a huge red flag.

Lindholm/Trouba for Marner/Nylander makes the Leafs better today and moving forward. Adding one of those guys would be a huge addition to their D core long term. Losing one of Marner/Nylander would not create nearly the same size of hole in the top 9 F as there is plenty of quality in the system today.

First of all, no I didn't say that, either learn how to read/comprehend better or learn how to quote properly.

Secondly, the fact that you'd rather see them playing Marincin as opposed to filling the hole on D with a quality young RFA like Trouba/Lindholm is a huge red flag.

Lindholm/Trouba for Marner/Nylander makes the Leafs better today and moving forward. Adding one of those guys would be a huge addition to their D core long term. Losing one of Marner/Nylander would not create nearly the same size of hole in the top 9 F as there is plenty of quality in the system today.
- RonPielep

There is no guarantee that either of those players will ever be top pairing dmen. Especially trouba.

yep, that's why he makes this crap up. what better than to fire up the Leafs fans
- sliprock65

Tomorrow Ek will have the Leafs acquiring Drew Doughty. Next day it will be Leafs acquiring Erik Karlsson.

Leafs don't even know what they have in Marner or nylander. No idea who will be the better of the two. They're a few years away from potentially competing a cup. Way to early to give up on either of them until you have more info to go on. And paying full value or overpaying for a dman isn't exactly taking advantage of a teams situation. I'd offer a package of players picks and prospects not named Matthews Marner or nylander. If they take it great if not wait and see how guys like Nielsen dermott VaLiev zaitsev pan out. Even with Lindholm it's not like they're winning the cup this year so what's he rush. Imagine if the black hawks went and traded kane or toews in their rookie season because they wevent sure what they had in keith seabrook or hjalmerson
- HealthyScratch6

1. Dealing for Lindholm or Trouba is by no means giving up on them. I'd call it prudent and likely even selling high on an asset.

2. Of course you would omit those players, so would everyone else, I just thought we were working under the assumption that the deal needs to work for both sides...

3. When you allude to Nylander/Marner/Dermott/Nielsen as being the Leafs equivalent to Toews/Kane/Keith/Seabrook you are probably overvaluing your prospects.

Tomorrow Ek will have the Leafs acquiring Drew Doughty. Next day it will be Leafs acquiring Erik Karlsson.
- gergeswillems

Malkin is toronto bound since 2013

1. Dealing for Lindholm or Trouba is by no means giving up on them. I'd call it prudent and likely even selling high on an asset.

2. Of course you would omit those players, so would everyone else, I just thought we were working under the assumption that the deal needs to work for both sides...

3. When you allude to Nylander/Marner/Dermott/Nielsen as being the Leafs equivalent to Toews/Kane/Keith/Seabrook you are probably overvaluing your prospects.
- RonPielep

Maybe you are maybe you're not. It's to early to say. I'm not saying they will turn into those guys because obviously that's best case scenario but keith er was a late second round pick who took 5 years to make it to the show. Not every star player is a top 3 pick who steps into the league at 18 and dominates. Vast majority of number 2 dmen were drafted by their team outside the top 10 and developed. No need to be giving up blue chip prospects this early in a rebuild.

There is no guarantee that either of those players will ever be top pairing dmen. Especially trouba.
- HealthyScratch6

There is just as much of a guarantee on those players being top pairing D as there is on Morgan Reilly. Which is more than the guarantee of Marner/Nylander being top line forwards, not to mention top pairing D are generally more valuable than top line F.

First of all, no I didn't say that, either learn how to read/comprehend better or learn how to quote properly.

Secondly, the fact that you'd rather see them playing Marincin as opposed to filling the hole on D with a quality young RFA like Trouba/Lindholm is a huge red flag.

Lindholm/Trouba for Marner/Nylander makes the Leafs better today and moving forward. Adding one of those guys would be a huge addition to their D core long term. Losing one of Marner/Nylander would not create nearly the same size of hole in the top 9 F as there is plenty of quality in the system today.
- RonPielep

Whooaaa....settle down, Ron. No need to get angry and insult-y

This kid made some decent points. You're the one that's refusing to listen

Your second point is nonsense - you've twisted his words badly. Of course, in isolation of any other moves, we'd rather have Lindholm over Marincin. To suggest otherwise would be insane. But what he's arguing is that sacrificing Marner or Nylander to acquire Lindholm makes no sense at this point. It does make us better today, like you say. But who cares about today? We're interested in competing 2-3 years from now. And at that point, it's very possible that Marner / Nylander could be superior players to Lindholm

And you seem quite high on Toronto's forward prospects. But, outside of the big three (one of which you're suggesting that we trade), they are just as much of a wild card as our prospects on the back end

Maybe you are maybe you're not. It's to early to say. I'm not saying they will turn into those guys because obviously that's best case scenario but keith er was a late second round pick who took 5 years to make it to the show. Not every star player is a top 3 pick who steps into the league at 18 and dominates. Vast majority of number 2 dmen were drafted by their team outside the top 10 and developed. No need to be giving up blue chip prospects this early in a rebuild.
- HealthyScratch6

Yep, just give them all up for nothing, that's what my argument supports.

Yep, just give them all up for nothing, that's what my argument supports.
- RonPielep

Great use of fallacies there. I said to early to be trading blue chip prospects as in any blue chips prospects alluding to either Marner or nylander key word there is "or" which is exactly what your argument was that we should trade one of them for trouba or Lindholm.

Yep, just give them all up for nothing, that's what my argument supports.
- RonPielep

The way I see it is that rather than trading a dollar for dollar now (a trade we can make 2-3 years from now), why not wait and see what the expansion draft holds.

Might be able trade three quarters for a dollar in 8 months.

Whooaaa....settle down, Ron. No need to get angry and insult-y

This kid made some decent points. You're the one that's refusing to listen

Your second point is nonsense - you've twisted his words badly. Of course, in isolation of any other moves, we'd rather have Lindholm over Marincin. To suggest otherwise would be insane. But what he's arguing is that sacrificing Marner or Nylander to acquire Lindholm makes no sense at this point. It does make us better today, like you say. But who cares about today? We're interested in competing 2-3 years from now. And at that point, it's very possible that Marner / Nylander could be superior players to Lindholm

And you seem quite high on Toronto's forward prospects. But, outside of the big three (one of which you're suggesting that we trade), they are just as much of a wild card as our prospects on the back end
- AxlRose91

You wanna talk about twisting words you can go back to the poopty attempt at quoting what I said about Toronto's D prospects.

That's not quite true. People like Leipsic, Brown, Lindberg, Kap, Rychel, etc. are more seasoned at the AHL level than Nielsen or Dermott who are just entering their first pro seasons. Carrick would be the closer comparable but he seems to be at a make or break point this year (waiver eligible?). Not to mention of that lower tier of prospects the Leafs have much more F depth than D.

The way I see it is that rather than trading a dollar for dollar now (a trade we can make 2-3 years from now), why not wait and see what the expansion draft holds.

Might be able trade three quarters for a dollar in 8 months.
- Tumbleweed

Imo that time is essentially now. Especially with the Ducks situation.

Great use of fallacies there. I said to early to be trading blue chip prospects as in any blue chips prospects alluding to either Marner or nylander key word there is "or" which is exactly what your argument was that we should trade one of them for trouba or Lindholm.
- HealthyScratch6

lol what?

My post was in reference to your previous two posts where you say:

Way to early to give up on either of them until you have more info to go on.
- HealthyScratch6

No need to be giving up blue chip prospects this early in a rebuild.
- HealthyScratch6

You make it sound like acquiring Trouba/Lindholm is equivalent to giving up on a blue chip prospect...

As god is my witness, if they trade Nylander, Marner or Matthews (that one unlikely) I will dump this team for good. Why do I have the feeling that the Leafs approach has slowly reverted back to their old ways since Lamoeirelo showed up!!!

As god is my witness, if they trade Nylander, Marner or Matthews (that one unlikely) I will dump this team for good. Why do I have the feeling that the Leafs approach has slowly reverted back to their old ways since Lamoeirelo showed up!!!
- Kayakjack

Bob McKenzie ‏@TSNBurpMcKanzie 49m49 minutes ago
Leafs are talking to Jets about a Marner-for-Trouba deal. More to come later.