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Forums :: NHL Talk :: WHO is in a better situation: LEAFS or SENS?
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top shelf 15
Ottawa Senators
Joined: 11.23.2008

Aug 31 @ 1:39 PM ET
Yup. He's the kinda guy who trades a 2nd and Zibby for Brassard. That's just an example. Not saying it would actually happen.
- systemtool
HUH ,we traded a nhl player for an nhl player,and added a 2nd to offset the difference in skill between the two.

Unless you believe Zibby is going to turn into something more than a 45 to 50 point center ??Which is exactly what he is ,kid is pretty much done developing.He has had 300 games with some pretty good talent on his wings to prove he is something better,add in the very marginal 4 point increase .Added to over a min and half more icetime he recieved after Turris went down .And watching JGP outpreform him with lessor players .Said it all for most in Sens land .
burn
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: GMTM on Eichel: "He certainly won't get his pee pee slapped by me for being a little more outspoken., ON
Joined: 08.02.2006

Aug 31 @ 1:42 PM ET
HUH ,we traded a nhl player for an nhl player,and added a 2nd to offset the difference in skill between the two.

Unless you believe Zibby is going to turn into something more than a 45 to 50 point center ??Which is exactly what he is ,kid is pretty much done developing.He has had 300 games with some pretty good talent on his wings to prove he is something better,add in the very marginal 4 point increase .Added to over a min and half more icetime he recieved after Turris went down .And watching JGP outpreform him with lessor players .Said it all for most in Sens land .

- top shelf 15



Isn't that the problem though? You gave up the same player, only younger, and gave up a 2nd as well.

Tumbleweed
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: tenav for drouin. lol @ canucks
Joined: 03.14.2014

Aug 31 @ 1:47 PM ET
Isn't that the problem though? You gave up the same player, only younger, and gave up a 2nd as well.
- burn


They still don't get it.

But they did get a 7th
burn
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: GMTM on Eichel: "He certainly won't get his pee pee slapped by me for being a little more outspoken., ON
Joined: 08.02.2006

Aug 31 @ 1:52 PM ET
They still don't get it.

But they did get a 7th

- Tumbleweed



I guess you just have to justify anyhow you can, even when the facts are slipping you in the face....... But woohoo a 7th rounder.
top shelf 15
Ottawa Senators
Joined: 11.23.2008

Aug 31 @ 2:13 PM ET
Isn't that the problem though? You gave up the same player, only younger, and gave up a 2nd as well.
- burn

Problem most dont see with Zibby is how bad he is at maintaining puck possesion,the guy plays the puck like a grenade .He doesnt create much of anything for his linemates,he just has that tunnel vision about him.He either dumps the puck in ,or passes it off the moment someone fronts him .He is a decent player,but not one that can drive the play by himself .Brassard ,actually can make plays with the puck other than just giving it away or making a bad pass.He is better fit,to what we need as a second line playmaker .To complement our two shooters that will probably play on the line in Hoffman and Ryan .

Either way ,neither are 1st line centers.So our search continues ,maybe one of White or Brown can develop into one of those .But i guess we have to wait and see
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Aug 31 @ 2:20 PM ET
Problem most dont see with Zibby is how bad he is at maintaining puck possesion,the guy plays the puck like a grenade .He doesnt create much of anything for his linemates,he just has that tunnel vision about him.He either dumps the puck in ,or passes it off the moment someone fronts him .He is a decent player,but not one that can drive the play by himself .Brassard ,actually can make plays with the puck other than just giving it away or making a bad pass.He is better fit,to what we need as a second line playmaker .To complement our two shooters that will probably play on the line in Hoffman and Ryan .

Either way ,neither are 1st line centers.So our search continues ,maybe one of White or Brown can develop into one of those .But i guess we have to wait and see

- top shelf 15

It’s amazing how much of a 180 Sens fans have done on this guy.

Done developing? I’m sure you wouldn’t have said that 6 months ago. And he’s only 6 months older than Ceci. He’s done too, right? Puempel. Pageau. Dzingel. These are guys Sens fans like to claim are part of an up and coming team. All from the same draft.

Even so, Brassard, at 29 going into next season, is going into decline anyway.
top shelf 15
Ottawa Senators
Joined: 11.23.2008

Aug 31 @ 3:10 PM ET
It’s amazing how much of a 180 Sens fans have done on this guy.

Done developing? I’m sure you wouldn’t have said that 6 months ago. And he’s only 6 months older than Ceci. He’s done too, right? Puempel. Pageau. Dzingel. These are guys Sens fans like to claim are part of an up and coming team. All from the same draft.

Even so, Brassard, at 29 going into next season, is going into decline anyway.

- prock
Thats the problem with prospects Prockie,some turn out to be not what most hope for .Leafs fans had Kadri turning out to be a 90 point front line center ,he isnt and likely wont ever be one .Doesnt mean its a fail ,it just didnt work out the way the team had planned .
We need a front line center to push down, Turris into a role that he would excel far better at as an excellent number 2 center.Zibby isnt that ,and finding one through F/A or trade never happens .So we make a trade for another 1b type and try to use depth to succeed until we find what we actually need
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Aug 31 @ 3:33 PM ET
Thats the problem with prospects Prockie,some turn out to be not what most hope for .Leafs fans had Kadri turning out to be a 90 point front line center ,he isnt and likely wont ever be one .Doesnt mean its a fail ,it just didnt work out the way the team had planned .
We need a front line center to push down, Turris into a role that he would excel far better at as an excellent number 2 center.Zibby isnt that ,and finding one through F/A or trade never happens .So we make a trade for another 1b type and try to use depth to succeed until we find what we actually need

- top shelf 15



Let me rephrase. It's amazing how Sens fans have done a 180 on this guy, in one summer, without a single game being played.
burn
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: GMTM on Eichel: "He certainly won't get his pee pee slapped by me for being a little more outspoken., ON
Joined: 08.02.2006

Aug 31 @ 3:51 PM ET
Problem most dont see with Zibby is how bad he is at maintaining puck possesion,the guy plays the puck like a grenade .He doesnt create much of anything for his linemates,he just has that tunnel vision about him.He either dumps the puck in ,or passes it off the moment someone fronts him .He is a decent player,but not one that can drive the play by himself .Brassard ,actually can make plays with the puck other than just giving it away or making a bad pass.He is better fit,to what we need as a second line playmaker .To complement our two shooters that will probably play on the line in Hoffman and Ryan .

Either way ,neither are 1st line centers.So our search continues ,maybe one of White or Brown can develop into one of those .But i guess we have to wait and see

- top shelf 15



So he's a problem, based on how you precive him, and not how he actually performs?


That is kind of the problem being outlined here. You seem to be trying anything and everything to justify this. Over the last 3 years they have the same production.... That's what matters.
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Aug 31 @ 8:14 PM ET
Senstroll............. where is the Derick Brassard. vs Mika Zibanejad thread?
TheCat29
Toronto Maple Leafs
Joined: 02.23.2012

Aug 31 @ 8:47 PM ET
Senstroll............. where is the Derick Brassard. vs Mika Zibanejad thread?
- D0PPELGANGER


Die
systemtool
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Real men always have to poo, ON
Joined: 09.12.2007

Aug 31 @ 9:34 PM ET
HUH ,we traded a nhl player for an nhl player,and added a 2nd to offset the difference in skill between the two.

Unless you believe Zibby is going to turn into something more than a 45 to 50 point center ??Which is exactly what he is ,kid is pretty much done developing.He has had 300 games with some pretty good talent on his wings to prove he is something better,add in the very marginal 4 point increase .Added to over a min and half more icetime he recieved after Turris went down .And watching JGP outpreform him with lessor players .Said it all for most in Sens land .

- top shelf 15


I'd rather zib and a 2nd than Brassard and a 7th. As for the rest of your comments, like Prock, I find it amazing the 180 Sens fans have done on this guy. Problem is you say it says it all but nobody was saying that until he got traded. Which says it all.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Sep 1 @ 8:29 AM ET
I'd rather zib and a 2nd than Brassard and a 7th. As for the rest of your comments, like Prock, I find it amazing the 180 Sens fans have done on this guy. Problem is you say it says it all but nobody was saying that until he got traded. Which says it all.
- systemtool



he said this June 7

Hard to say again our team wasnt healthy ,yet again .Having Turris and Mac back in the lineup should lead to much better all around numbers everywhere .Maybe some improvement from kids like Lazar,Zib,Paul ceci etc could have this team move further up than even we think .So many variables
- top shelf 15
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Sep 1 @ 4:25 PM ET
The Senators are a better team today, with Brassard in the line up, instead of Zibanejad. I you leaf fans think Zibanejad is such a good player, who would you suggest the leafs trade for him?
AustonPowers
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Supreme Manager of the Johnny Boychuk to EDM Thread
Joined: 07.14.2016

Sep 1 @ 4:27 PM ET
The Senators are a better team today, with Brassard in the line up, instead of Zibanejad. I you leaf fans think Zibanejad is such a good player, who would you suggest the leafs trade for him?
- D0PPELGANGER

Auston Matthews and Marane
systemtool
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Real men always have to poo, ON
Joined: 09.12.2007

Sep 1 @ 4:37 PM ET
The Senators are a better team today, with Brassard in the line up, instead of Zibanejad. I you leaf fans think Zibanejad is such a good player, who would you suggest the leafs trade for him?
- D0PPELGANGER

I would suggest not trading younger players for older players when you're a non playoff team. I don't think Zibby is better than Brassard right now but should be over time. In fact I think Turris Zib aND Brassard are all good 2nd line players. I'd suggest not trading picks for something isn't going to put you over the top when you're not even near the top.
systemtool
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Real men always have to poo, ON
Joined: 09.12.2007

Sep 1 @ 4:37 PM ET
Auston Matthews and Marane
- AustonPowers

spatso
Ottawa Senators
Location: jensen beach, FL
Joined: 02.19.2007

Sep 1 @ 7:05 PM ET
Problem most dont see with Zibby is how bad he is at maintaining puck possesion,the guy plays the puck like a grenade .He doesnt create much of anything for his linemates,he just has that tunnel vision about him.He either dumps the puck in ,or passes it off the moment someone fronts him .He is a decent player,but not one that can drive the play by himself .Brassard ,actually can make plays with the puck other than just giving it away or making a bad pass.He is better fit,to what we need as a second line playmaker .To complement our two shooters that will probably play on the line in Hoffman and Ryan .

Either way ,neither are 1st line centers.So our search continues ,maybe one of White or Brown can develop into one of those .But i guess we have to wait and see

- top shelf 15


I think this is exactly right. Pageau has grown his game and is a much more savvy all round player than Zbad. The Senators are very high on Colin White and even more positive about Logan Brown. They wanted more experience in the middle and that explains everything you need to know about the deal for Brassard.

Zbad is weak on the power play, not very good at finding the open man. When Turris went down the power play died. Brassard is all about taking the power play pass from Karlsson and making the next pass.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Sep 1 @ 8:03 PM ET
The Senators are a better team today, with Brassard in the line up, instead of Zibanejad. I you leaf fans think Zibanejad is such a good player, who would you suggest the leafs trade for him?
- D0PPELGANGER


I would say the Senators are maybe a slightly better team than they were last year, with Brassard instead of Zibanejad, assuming Brassard and Zibanejad are both the same player they were last year. With a little bit of improvement from Zibanejad, which is possible, although not a guarantee, and a bit of decline from Brassard, which is also possible (and to be expected at this point, or the near future, in his career), it's a lateral, or losing proposal for the Sens. Past this season, it's likely a losing proposal.

I wouldn't trade anyone on the Leafs for either player.
systemtool
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Real men always have to poo, ON
Joined: 09.12.2007

Sep 1 @ 10:32 PM ET
I would say the Senators are maybe a slightly better team than they were last year, with Brassard instead of Zibanejad, assuming Brassard and Zibanejad are both the same player they were last year. With a little bit of improvement from Zibanejad, which is possible, although not a guarantee, and a bit of decline from Brassard, which is also possible (and to be expected at this point, or the near future, in his career), it's a lateral, or losing proposal for the Sens. Past this season, it's likely a losing proposal.

I wouldn't trade anyone on the Leafs for either player.

- prock


Seems like the kind of trade that bumps them from 11th to 10th or 9th. I think some Sens fans see Brassard as something he isn't.
D0PPELGANGER
Ottawa Senators
Location: Ottawa, ON
Joined: 05.06.2015

Sep 1 @ 10:45 PM ET
It's amazing how Sens fans have done a 180 on this guy, in one summer, without a single game being played.
- prock



It's amazing how leafs fans have done a 180 on Dion, since he was traded.
systemtool
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Real men always have to poo, ON
Joined: 09.12.2007

Sep 1 @ 10:59 PM ET
It's amazing how leafs fans have done a 180 on Dion, since he was traded.
- D0PPELGANGER


It's more amazing that you just made that up and expected leaf fans to believe it. Please. Enjoy him. His contract will be a gift that keeps on giving. Best wallet ever.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Sep 1 @ 11:59 PM ET
Seems like the kind of trade that bumps them from 11th to 10th or 9th. I think some Sens fans see Brassard as something he isn't.
- systemtool

it might. might not. Won't do much more than a spot or two.
systemtool
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Real men always have to poo, ON
Joined: 09.12.2007

Sep 2 @ 12:07 AM ET
No problem talking about Bishop. Not sure he would have given Ottawa any better of a result over the past couple of years. He is probably available cheap right now. I don't think the Sens are interested.
- spatso


Joined: 12.31.1969

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