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Forums :: NHL Talk :: WHO is in a better situation: LEAFS or SENS?
Author Message
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Aug 21 @ 9:29 AM ET
Going forward there is no debate now the leafs are in a better situation.

Hiring of Kyle Dubas..and then him bringing in
Darryl Metcalf (extra Skater)
Cam Charron (Blogger/analytics)
Rob Pettapiece (analyst/statistician)
Brandon Pridham (capologist)

Leafs are finally using their money wisely

Talk of installing new cameras to track everything. Use Data to help make better decisions

I will take a few years before we start to see results I am sure.
Leafs are on the way to being a solid contending team with these moves.

- senstroll



Has any other NHL team taken this approach in the past? What has the results been like? There are a number of MLB teams that have taken this route, but as far as I know this strategy has yet to be proven in the NHL.

Your point about it taking a number of years to see results might be seen as another way to buy some time with the fan base that is starving for some form of playoff success..............do you think there is enough time before we hear for the firing of the current management team?
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Aug 21 @ 9:37 AM ET
Has any other NHL team taken this approach in the past? What has the results been like? There are a number of MLB teams that have taken this route, but as far as I know this strategy has yet to be proven in the NHL.

Your point about it taking a number of years to see results might be seen as another way to buy some time with the fan base that is starving for some form of playoff success..............do you think there is enough time before we hear for the firing of the current management team?

- Doppleganger



other teams use stats and data tracking systems.. Chicago does.. Stan Bowmen started it like 10 years ago..a lot of teams are pretty quiet about it..and understandably.. if you have an advantage..why share

http://www.cbssports.com/...nalytics-give-team-leg-up

I think chicago has proven it can help.
Now keep in mind there are good and bad ones... the leafs have taken the proper route and avoided the snake oil salesmen

the leafs have left a buffer in Nonis... if the fans demand blood without waiting for the changes to take effect..they still have the "GM" to fire and wont miss anything he brings

prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Aug 21 @ 4:57 PM ET
other teams use stats and data tracking systems.. Chicago does.. Stan Bowmen started it like 10 years ago..a lot of teams are pretty quiet about it..and understandably.. if you have an advantage..why share

http://www.cbssports.com/...nalytics-give-team-leg-up

I think chicago has proven it can help.
Now keep in mind there are good and bad ones... the leafs have taken the proper route and avoided the snake oil salesmen

the leafs have left a buffer in Nonis... if the fans demand blood without waiting for the changes to take effect..they still have the "GM" to fire and wont miss anything he brings

- senstroll


I’d say that also depends on what you feel “this approach” is. Several have used advanced analytics to contribute to building a team. I don’t think any have used them as their sole indicator on players, and I don’t think that would be successful.
daeth
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Drink full, and descend, ON
Joined: 09.15.2005

Aug 21 @ 5:26 PM ET
Basically advanced stats should be used to confirm what scouts, managers, coaches, etc see with their own eyes. The Leafs have near limitless resources and should do whatever it takes to give themselves an advantage regardless of how small it is.

I hope the next step is to steal (ie overpay) top scouts from other organizations
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Aug 21 @ 9:21 PM ET
Odds to win the 2014-15 Stanley Cup

Boston Bruins 8/1
Los Angeles Kings 8/1
Chicago Blackhawks 8/1
Pittsburgh Penguins 12/1
St. Louis Blues 12/1
Anaheim Ducks 12/1
San Jose Sharks 14/1
New York Rangers 18/1
Tampa Bay Lightning 18/1
Colorado Avalanche 18/1
Montreal Canadiens 18/1
Minnesota Wild 22/1
Detroit Red Wings 22/1
Dallas Stars 28/1
Philadelphia Flyers 30/1
Washington Capitals 45/1
Columbus Blue Jackets 45/1
toronto maple leafs 45/1
Vancouver Canucks 55/1
Ottawa Senators 65/1
Edmonton Oilers 65/1
Winnipeg Jets 65/1
Arizona Coyotes 65/1
New Jersey Devils 65/1
New York Islanders 80/1
Carolina Hurricanes 80/1
Florida Panthers 80/1
Calgary Flames 100/1
Nashville Predators 100/1
Buffalo Sabres 100/1
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Aug 21 @ 11:14 PM ET
The Sens are screwed with Melnyk bottom line.
senstroll
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Sens Suck, ON
Joined: 02.22.2008

Aug 22 @ 7:01 AM ET
The Sens are screwed with Melnyk bottom line.
- RogerRoeper


Not with Patrice bergeron 2.0
burn
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Boyle > Marleau :dopes, ON
Joined: 08.02.2006

Aug 22 @ 7:28 AM ET
Not with Patrice bergeron 2.0
- senstroll



You'd think they'd be better team than they are with Bergeron and giroux in the lineup.
burn
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Boyle > Marleau :dopes, ON
Joined: 08.02.2006

Aug 22 @ 7:31 AM ET
@LukePeristy: I'm liking the symbolism of Robin Lehner being seated next to the bright lights as Jared Cowen sits beside fertilizer http://twitter.com/Senato...02539732010934272/photo/1
top shelf 15
Ottawa Senators
Joined: 11.23.2008

Aug 22 @ 8:19 AM ET
@LukePeristy: I'm liking the symbolism of Robin Lehner being seated next to the bright lights as Jared Cowen sits beside fertilizer http://twitter.com/Senato...02539732010934272/photo/1
- burn
WHY YOU*shakes fist in air*
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Aug 22 @ 8:43 AM ET
@LukePeristy: I'm liking the symbolism of Robin Lehner being seated next to the bright lights as Jared Cowen sits beside fertilizer http://twitter.com/Senato...02539732010934272/photo/1
- burn


If only they were red light bulbs.
burn
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Boyle > Marleau :dopes, ON
Joined: 08.02.2006

Aug 22 @ 8:47 AM ET
If only they were red light bulbs.
- prock



Seated by lights = getting lit-up!
the_cause2000
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Not quite my tempo
Joined: 02.26.2007

Aug 22 @ 9:06 AM ET
Odds to win the 2014-15 Stanley Cup

Boston Bruins 8/1
Los Angeles Kings 8/1
Chicago Blackhawks 8/1
Pittsburgh Penguins 12/1
St. Louis Blues 12/1
Anaheim Ducks 12/1
San Jose Sharks 14/1
New York Rangers 18/1
Tampa Bay Lightning 18/1
Colorado Avalanche 18/1
Montreal Canadiens 18/1
Minnesota Wild 22/1
Detroit Red Wings 22/1
Dallas Stars 28/1
Philadelphia Flyers 30/1
Washington Capitals 45/1
Columbus Blue Jackets 45/1
toronto maple leafs 45/1
Vancouver Canucks 55/1
Ottawa Senators 65/1
Edmonton Oilers 65/1
Winnipeg Jets 65/1
Arizona Coyotes 65/1
New Jersey Devils 65/1
New York Islanders 80/1
Carolina Hurricanes 80/1
Florida Panthers 80/1
Calgary Flames 100/1
Nashville Predators 100/1
Buffalo Sabres 100/1

- Doppleganger


so leafs > sens according to science
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Aug 22 @ 3:10 PM ET
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Aug 23 @ 6:30 AM ET
So screwed they finished ahead of the leafs, by four points last year, and perhaps more next season.
- Doppleganger


Irrelevant.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Aug 23 @ 6:34 AM ET
http://sports.nationalpos...s-to-toronto-sports-fans/


Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Aug 25 @ 3:42 PM ET


Craig Anderson has some-long term security with the Ottawa Senators after signing a three-year extension worth US$12.6 million.

Anderson, the Senators’ starting goaltender since being acquired from the Colorado Avalanche in 2011, is now under contract through the 2017-18 season.

The 33-year-old will make $4.75 million in 2015-16 and 2016-17 and then $3.1 million in 2017-18.
Pecafan Fan
Montreal Canadiens
Location: Pacioretty, c'est mou comme d'la marde - Gilbert Delorme
Joined: 01.20.2009

Aug 25 @ 3:45 PM ET


Craig Anderson has some-long term security with the Ottawa Senators after signing a three-year extension worth US$12.6 million.

Anderson, the Senators’ starting goaltender since being acquired from the Colorado Avalanche in 2011, is now under contract through the 2017-18 season.

The 33-year-old will make $4.75 million in 2015-16 and 2016-17 and then $3.1 million in 2017-18.

- Doppleganger


Great news for the rest of the division.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Aug 25 @ 4:01 PM ET
Great news for the rest of the division.
- Pecafan Fan



His stats with the Senators say otherwise SV% .920 / GAA 2.62 (past 4 seasons)


His back up is no slouch either.
Pecafan Fan
Montreal Canadiens
Location: Pacioretty, c'est mou comme d'la marde - Gilbert Delorme
Joined: 01.20.2009

Aug 25 @ 4:11 PM ET
His stats with the Senators say otherwise SV% .920 / GAA 2.62 (past 4 seasons)


His back up is no slouch either.

- Doppleganger


His .941 "season" skews the numbers. You can't give those 24 games the same weight as a full season.

And his full season numbers in Ottawa are .911 and .914 with a GAA hovering around 3.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Aug 25 @ 5:59 PM ET
His .941 "season" skews the numbers. You can't give those 24 games the same weight as a full season.

And his full season numbers in Ottawa are .911 and .914 with a GAA hovering around 3.

- Pecafan Fan



Yeah, I'd say he's probably in the bottom third of starting goalies in the NHL. And 33 years old. He's not a terrible goalie, but he really hasn't had much full season success over his entire career. It makes you wonder, maybe he's just better suited to be a backup.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Aug 25 @ 7:44 PM ET
Yeah, I'd say he's probably in the bottom third of starting goalies in the NHL. And 33 years old. He's not a terrible goalie, but he really hasn't had much full season success over his entire career. It makes you wonder, maybe he's just better suited to be a backup.
- prock



I think you're right about a reduction in the number of games, and I believe this to be the strategy for the future. Lehner will play more games and at some point in time management will make him a starter by trading Anderson.............but only when they have a back up for Lehner...........perhaps Marcus Högberg who is a few years from the NHL.
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Aug 26 @ 7:15 AM ET
http://sports.nationalpost.com/2014/08/22/tim-leiwekes-one-regret-talking-about-parade-routes-to-toronto-sports-fans/



- Doppleganger

Melnyk's one regret? That he didn't pinch more pennies.
At least he has time to fix that though.
Pecafan Fan
Montreal Canadiens
Location: Pacioretty, c'est mou comme d'la marde - Gilbert Delorme
Joined: 01.20.2009

Aug 26 @ 7:16 AM ET
Yeah, I'd say he's probably in the bottom third of starting goalies in the NHL. And 33 years old. He's not a terrible goalie, but he really hasn't had much full season success over his entire career. It makes you wonder, maybe he's just better suited to be a backup.
- prock


Yup.
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Aug 26 @ 7:17 AM ET
Odds to win the 2014-15 Stanley Cup

Boston Bruins 8/1
Los Angeles Kings 8/1
Chicago Blackhawks 8/1
Pittsburgh Penguins 12/1
St. Louis Blues 12/1
Anaheim Ducks 12/1
San Jose Sharks 14/1
New York Rangers 18/1
Tampa Bay Lightning 18/1
Colorado Avalanche 18/1
Montreal Canadiens 18/1
Minnesota Wild 22/1
Detroit Red Wings 22/1
Dallas Stars 28/1
Philadelphia Flyers 30/1
Washington Capitals 45/1
Columbus Blue Jackets 45/1
toronto maple leafs 45/1
Vancouver Canucks 55/1
Ottawa Senators 65/1
Edmonton Oilers 65/1
Winnipeg Jets 65/1
Arizona Coyotes 65/1
New Jersey Devils 65/1
New York Islanders 80/1
Carolina Hurricanes 80/1
Florida Panthers 80/1
Calgary Flames 100/1
Nashville Predators 100/1
Buffalo Sabres 100/1

- Doppleganger

Season hasnt even started, and you're conceding that the leafs are better than the sens. Good stuff.
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