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Forums :: NHL Talk :: WHO is in a better situation: LEAFS or SENS?
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Mr_Squeaks
Ottawa Senators
Location: Location: Location: Glitch in
Joined: 06.26.2006

Apr 11 @ 8:14 AM ET
okay, and it quite clearly does not mean he thought they were going to win the cup this year. He's saying that is his goal, and he fully intends that to happen in his tenure.
- prock


To be fair, that's what it sounded like to me, too... I think by page 471 of this thread we might be running out of ammo just a little bit.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Apr 11 @ 8:21 AM ET
To be fair, that's what it sounded like to me, too... I think by page 471 of this thread we might be running out of ammo just a little bit.
- Mr_Squeaks


Blasphemy. Can you believe he would suggest that the goal of the team is a Stanley Cup?
sensarmy_11
Ottawa Senators
Location: If Ottawa traded ryan for clarkson sens would need to add a pick - Prock, NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Apr 11 @ 8:23 AM ET
Blasphemy. Can you believe he would suggest that the goal of the team is a Stanley Cup?
- prock


saying that the goal of the team is to win the cup............and coming out the the TORONTO MEDIA, and stating that you've already planned the parade route, before the season started (and following perhaps the most epic colapse in NHL history)........are two COMPLETELY different things.

if melnyk had said that, you wouldn't let it go for about 3 decades, and you know it.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Apr 11 @ 8:25 AM ET
saying that the goal of the team is to win the cup............and coming out the the TORONTO MEDIA, and stating that you've already planned the parade route, before the season started (and following perhaps the most epic colapse in NHL history)........are two COMPLETELY different things.

if melnyk had said that, you wouldn't let it go for about 3 decades, and you know it.

- sensarmy_11



What does whether the season started or not have to do with it, given that he wasn't talking of this season? Seriously, smarten up. It's not like he told everyone players had to take a Stanley Cup discount to play for the Leafs.
sensarmy_11
Ottawa Senators
Location: If Ottawa traded ryan for clarkson sens would need to add a pick - Prock, NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Apr 11 @ 8:35 AM ET
What does whether the season started or not have to do with it, given that he wasn't talking of this season? Seriously, smarten up. It's not like he told everyone players had to take a Stanley Cup discount to play for the Leafs.
- prock


you're right..........instead he said "i know you're only an average 3rd line player, but instead of paying you like one, i'll give you an organization crippling contract......here you go mr clarkson"

and how do you know he wasn't talking about this season? he seemed pretty confident, at the beginning of the year, that this team was gonna be right there
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Apr 11 @ 8:42 AM ET
you're right..........instead he said "i know you're only an average 3rd line player, but instead of paying you like one, i'll give you an organization crippling contract......here you go mr clarkson"
- sensarmy_11


Could be worse. They could refuse to actually offer contracts to spend what they can, leaving the team as a permanent "also ran". Do you think he signs someone in free agency to replace Bobby Ryan next summer, or just pockets the savings?

and how do you know he wasn't talking about this season? he seemed pretty confident, at the beginning of the year, that this team was gonna be right there
- sensarmy_11


because I read it. Maybe you need to brush up on your comprehension skills.

sensarmy_11
Ottawa Senators
Location: If Ottawa traded ryan for clarkson sens would need to add a pick - Prock, NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Apr 11 @ 8:44 AM ET
Could be worse. They could refuse to actually offer contracts to spend what they can, leaving the team as a permanent "also ran". Do you think he signs someone in free agency to replace Bobby Ryan next summer, or just pockets the savings?



because I read it. Maybe you need to brush up on your comprehension skills.

- prock


i'm gonna love throwing it in your face when ryan re-signs.............it's gonna be even better when every free agent looks at offers from the leafs, laugh, and then sign somewhere else.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Apr 11 @ 8:46 AM ET
i'm gonna love throwing it in your face when ryan re-signs.............it's gonna be even better when every free agent looks at offers from the leafs, laugh, and then sign somewhere else.
- sensarmy_11



Why would he re-sign? There is literally no reason to sign in Ottawa.
sensarmy_11
Ottawa Senators
Location: If Ottawa traded ryan for clarkson sens would need to add a pick - Prock, NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Apr 11 @ 9:12 AM ET
Why would he re-sign? There is literally no reason to sign in Ottawa.
- prock


explain?

why the hell would anyone want to sign in toronto?
the_cause2000
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Not quite my tempo
Joined: 02.26.2007

Apr 11 @ 9:16 AM ET
explain?

why the hell would anyone want to sign in toronto?

- sensarmy_11

cash monay, playa
spatso
Ottawa Senators
Location: jensen beach, FL
Joined: 02.19.2007

Apr 11 @ 9:18 AM ET
Why would he re-sign? There is literally no reason to sign in Ottawa.
- prock


I think the Senators will be making a mistake. I like Ryan but he is not a franchise player. It looks like he resigns but I fear Murray overplays. I would rather see Ottawa deal Ryan and use the return to go after Evander Kaine. Kaine is going to be traded. He is a great young talent. It is worth the risk. If the change of scenery makes a difference he has the potential to be the best young power forward in the game. But, he only has one chance left and he could be a total bust.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Apr 11 @ 9:18 AM ET
explain?

why the hell would anyone want to sign in toronto?

- sensarmy_11



Explain? Pretty self-explanatory. Ottawa doesn't really have anything going for it. Not a very good city. Bad team. Will never compete on their budget. Canadian taxes. He's American.

I suspect he ends up in Philly or New Jersey.
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Apr 11 @ 9:19 AM ET
I think the Senators will be making a mistake. I like Ryan but he is not a franchise player. It looks like he resigns but I fear Murray overplays. I would rather see Ottawa deal Ryan and use the return to go after Evander Kaine. Kaine is going to be traded. He is a great young talent. It is worth the risk. If the change of scenery makes a difference he has the potential to be the best young power forward in the game. But, he only has one chance left and he could be a total bust.
- spatso



I suspect the biggest mistake is made when Melnyk thinks your team is a playoff team, wants the playoff revenue, and doesn't deal him at the deadline, and he walks.
sensarmy_11
Ottawa Senators
Location: If Ottawa traded ryan for clarkson sens would need to add a pick - Prock, NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Apr 11 @ 9:28 AM ET
Explain? Pretty self-explanatory. Ottawa doesn't really have anything going for it. Not a very good city. Bad team. Will never compete on their budget. Canadian taxes. He's American.

I suspect he ends up in Philly or New Jersey.

- prock


bad team that's currently ahead of the leafs in the standings.

bad city that's voted consistently as one of, if not the best place to live in canada

budget, didn't realize you already knew what the budget is for next season. good on you for getting the scoop.

everything he's said has indicated that he's happy in ottawa, and wants to continue playing there...........but by all means, keep on spewing your hate. it's beautiful to hear.

spatso
Ottawa Senators
Location: jensen beach, FL
Joined: 02.19.2007

Apr 11 @ 9:30 AM ET
I suspect the biggest mistake is made when Melnyk thinks your team is a playoff team, wants the playoff revenue, and doesn't deal him at the deadline, and he walks.
- prock


Nobody has been more critical of Melnyk than me. But people misunderstand. The Senators do not have the financial squeeze. It is Melnyk who is in financial trouble and he is pulling cash out of the Senators.

But, a team's value is significantly shaped by the success of the players. So Melnyk cannot afford to lose players. No doubt he wants to sell the team in whole, or in part. Or, he wants to redo the equity financing. In order to pull off any of those he needs to keep in place the "star" players that drive ticket sales. He badly messed up on Alfredsen last year. The risk is not in letting Ryan or Spezza go in trades or even at the end of their contracts. The risk is inking them to long term deals when the future of the team is so clearly best achieved by moving the young guys into more substantial roles.
Morris
Referee
Edmonton Oilers
Location: Hall looks disengaged, NS
Joined: 07.18.2007

Apr 11 @ 9:41 AM ET
Nobody has been more critical of Melnyk than me. But people misunderstand. The Senators do not have the financial squeeze. It is Melnyk who is in financial trouble and he is pulling cash out of the Senators.

But, a team's value is significantly shaped by the success of the players. So Melnyk cannot afford to lose players. No doubt he wants to sell the team in whole, or in part. Or, he wants to redo the equity financing. In order to pull off any of those he needs to keep in place the "star" players that drive ticket sales. He badly messed up on Alfredsen last year. The risk is not in letting Ryan or Spezza go in trades or even at the end of their contracts. The risk is inking them to long term deals when the future of the team is so clearly best achieved by moving the young guys into more substantial roles.

- spatso

maybe spezza, but you've got no one who can take over Ryan's role after next year.

I think he's a pretty necessary re-sign/
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Apr 11 @ 9:45 AM ET
Nobody has been more critical of Melnyk than me. But people misunderstand. The Senators do not have the financial squeeze. It is Melnyk who is in financial trouble and he is pulling cash out of the Senators.

But, a team's value is significantly shaped by the success of the players. So Melnyk cannot afford to lose players. No doubt he wants to sell the team in whole, or in part. Or, he wants to redo the equity financing. In order to pull off any of those he needs to keep in place the "star" players that drive ticket sales. He badly messed up on Alfredsen last year. The risk is not in letting Ryan or Spezza go in trades or even at the end of their contracts. The risk is inking them to long term deals when the future of the team is so clearly best achieved by moving the young guys into more substantial roles.

- spatso



Ottawa already has a lot of "young guys" in their projected line up for next season.

You can't just go 100% young in the middle of re-build, you need enough veterans in the line up to help with mentoring and progressing through the re-build.

If, as you suggest, the Senators trade Spezza and Ryan, for younger players/prospects, that leaves MacArthur as the only "veteran" forward signed for next year.




prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Apr 11 @ 10:05 AM ET
bad team that's currently ahead of the leafs in the standings.

bad city that's voted consistently as one of, if not the best place to live in canada

budget, didn't realize you already knew what the budget is for next season. good on you for getting the scoop.

everything he's said has indicated that he's happy in ottawa, and wants to continue playing there...........but by all means, keep on spewing your hate. it's beautiful to hear.


- sensarmy_11


I think you're delusional if you think Ottawa has much to offer a young millionaire. I'm sure those surveys conclude it's great for a 50k a year chump he can't afford a house in a better city. But did you ever stop to think why it's cheaper to live there? No demand.

And if melnyk wouldn't move on budget for the twenty year team captain, what makes you think he'd move for Ryan?
prock
Vegas Golden Knights
Location: Bobby Ryan + 1st rounder for Clarkson, ON
Joined: 08.30.2007

Apr 11 @ 10:06 AM ET
Nobody has been more critical of Melnyk than me. But people misunderstand. The Senators do not have the financial squeeze. It is Melnyk who is in financial trouble and he is pulling cash out of the Senators.

But, a team's value is significantly shaped by the success of the players. So Melnyk cannot afford to lose players. No doubt he wants to sell the team in whole, or in part. Or, he wants to redo the equity financing. In order to pull off any of those he needs to keep in place the "star" players that drive ticket sales. He badly messed up on Alfredsen last year. The risk is not in letting Ryan or Spezza go in trades or even at the end of their contracts. The risk is inking them to long term deals when the future of the team is so clearly best achieved by moving the young guys into more substantial roles.

- spatso



I don't really care WHY the team has no budget to work with.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Apr 11 @ 10:12 AM ET
BOSTON .719
TAMPA BAY .606
MONTREAL .605
DETROIT .569

OTTAWA .525
toronto .519
BUFFALO .319
sensarmy_11
Ottawa Senators
Location: If Ottawa traded ryan for clarkson sens would need to add a pick - Prock, NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Apr 11 @ 10:13 AM ET
I think you're delusional if you think Ottawa has much to offer a young millionaire. I'm sure those surveys conclude it's great for a 50k a year chump he can't afford a house in a better city. But did you ever stop to think why it's cheaper to live there? No demand.

And if melnyk wouldn't move on budget for the twenty year team captain, what makes you think he'd move for Ryan?

- prock


cuz the 20 year captain was 40, and had a year left of good hockey

ryan is 27, and has lots of years left. plus they gave up assets to get him.

if you don't understand common sense, there much point in having this conversation.

and if you think ottawa is a crappy place to live, then you obviously have never been to places like philly, pittsburgh, new jersey, or even toronto.

Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Apr 11 @ 10:21 AM ET
BOSTON .719
TAMPA BAY .606
MONTREAL .605
DETROIT .569

OTTAWA .525
toronto .519
BUFFALO .319

- Doppleganger

hopefully it drops a bit more.

can't get into top-5 range, but we can get to 6th if other teams win out.
Feeling Glucky?
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tanktown, ON
Joined: 10.08.2008

Apr 11 @ 10:24 AM ET
cuz the 20 year captain was 40, and had a year left of good hockey

ryan is 27, and has lots of years left. plus they gave up assets to get him.

if you don't understand common sense, there much point in having this conversation.

and if you think ottawa is a crappy place to live, then you obviously have never been to places like philly, pittsburgh, new jersey, or even toronto.

- sensarmy_11

Listen, lets not make this an argument about cities, but Toronto is objectively a better place for young millionaires to live than Ottawa. If you're going to preach using common sense, don't try comparing Ottawa to Toronto a couple of sentences later.

I'm sure retirees who just want to settle down in a quiet city would prefer Ottawa. But outside of that, Montreal, Toronto, Vancouver... those are the places people with lots of money would go in Canada.


Not that I think Toronto is interested in signing Ryan, unless they're trading Lupul.
Doppleganger
Ottawa Senators
Location: Reality
Joined: 08.25.2006

Apr 11 @ 10:41 AM ET
Listen, lets not make this an argument about cities, but Toronto is objectively a better place for young millionaires to live than Ottawa. If you're going to preach using common sense, don't try comparing Ottawa to Toronto a couple of sentences later.

I'm sure retirees who just want to settle down in a quiet city would prefer Ottawa. But outside of that, Montreal, Toronto, Vancouver... those are the places people with lots of money would go in Canada.


Not that I think Toronto is interested in signing Ryan, unless they're trading Lupul.

- Feeling Glucky?



Not trying to start anything, but was just wondering how many leaf players live in toronto year round?

I assume those with families would (school) be more likely to, than single player would.

sensarmy_11
Ottawa Senators
Location: If Ottawa traded ryan for clarkson sens would need to add a pick - Prock, NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Apr 11 @ 10:44 AM ET
Listen, lets not make this an argument about cities, but Toronto is objectively a better place for young millionaires to live than Ottawa. If you're going to preach using common sense, don't try comparing Ottawa to Toronto a couple of sentences later.

I'm sure retirees who just want to settle down in a quiet city would prefer Ottawa. But outside of that, Montreal, Toronto, Vancouver... those are the places people with lots of money would go in Canada.


Not that I think Toronto is interested in signing Ryan, unless they're trading Lupul.

- Feeling Glucky?


i don't doubt that a 22 year old, single guy, would love those cities. a 27 year old, who's getting married and starting a family.........might be a different story.

and you talk about ottawa like it were kingston or barrie or something.....it's the 4th biggest city in the country (more people then vancouver)

i'm not trying to get into a pissing match about cities..........but to claim that ottawa is a crappy place to live (and i don't even live there) is just stupid and ignorant (which is pretty much all that prock knows)
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