Ha. Point taken on sarcasm.

The sad fact is there are no top six centers in the pipeline. Do you give NS $6M or Duchene $7M? Easy choice for me.
- Return of the Roar

This isn't directed at you, but...

At the beginning of the season people were excited about Schmaltz and calling for Stan to lock him him long term (with a few exceptions). Now 8 games in he has 6 points, which is above his PPG from last year, and now the Hawks should give up on him? Maybe #8 is a better winger than centre, there's no issue with that. Schmaltz may not be the must physical forward but so what, that's not his role. Schmaltz is still developing and needs to improve in some aspects of his game (i.e. face-offs and shooting more), but he has top 6 talent.

Sometimes teams need to take a chance on a player and lock him up long term early in their career to get a break on the cap hit. Look at Josi and Klingberg as examples. For me, I would take a chance on Schmaltz's long term potential.

Without arguing your conclusion based on the study - I wonder if those ages have been increasing over the past 20 years because of (a) better training methods, and (b) higher value contracts giving players incentive to maintain conditioning and continue to improve their skills.

The study was announced 4 years ago, based on stats from 1997-98 through 2011-12. Issues like the salary cap, which creates more competition from younger cheaper players, combined with better training methods and higher valued contracts, may be leading to increasing the ages of peak performance.
- StLBravesFan

good points sage....but i suspect those ages vs peak perf numbers are not that far off...there are always outliers and this study does not take into deep playoff runs like the hawks and pens have had over the last 10 years.

This isn't directed at you, but...

At the beginning of the season people were excited about Schmaltz and calling for Stan to lock him him long term (with a few exceptions). Now 8 games in he has 6 points, which is above his PPG from last year, and now the Hawks should give up on him? Maybe #8 is a better winger than centre, there's no issue with that. Schmaltz may not be the must physical forward but so what, that's not his role. Schmaltz is still developing and needs to improve in some aspects of his game (i.e. face-offs and shooting more), but he has top 6 talent.

Sometimes teams need to take a chance on a player and lock him up long term early in their career to get a break on the cap hit. Look at Josi and Klingberg as examples. For me, I would take a chance on Schmaltz's long term potential.
- DarthKane

Stone him!!!!

Jk, all good points, totally agree!

This isn't directed at you, but...

At the beginning of the season people were excited about Schmaltz and calling for Stan to lock him him long term (with a few exceptions). Now 8 games in he has 6 points, which is above his PPG from last year, and now the Hawks should give up on him? Maybe #8 is a better winger than centre, there's no issue with that. Schmaltz may not be the must physical forward but so what, that's not his role. Schmaltz is still developing and needs to improve in some aspects of his game (i.e. face-offs and shooting more), but he has top 6 talent.

Sometimes teams need to take a chance on a player and lock him up long term early in their career to get a break on the cap hit. Look at Josi and Klingberg as examples. For me, I would take a chance on Schmaltz's long term potential.
- DarthKane

He is not an effective center.
He loses possession of the puck on the boards almost every time.
He is contact averse.
He passes too much and it often results in turnovers.

Bridge deal with a vision for him as LW on a line with guys who can win board battles in the O zone...maybe. Banking on him as a legit top six center in the NHL with the top six money along with it...just don't see it as a wise move.

He is not an effective center.
He loses possession of the puck on the boards almost every time.
He is contact averse.
He passes too much and it often results in turnovers.

Bridge deal with a vision for him as LW on a line with guys who can win board battles in the O zone...maybe. Banking on him as a legit top six center in the NHL with the top six money along with it...just don't see it as a wise move.
- Return of the Roar

Dont forget NMC NTC

Of the current ELC guys you mention, only ADB seems value versus production. Remember NS wants to get paid next year, and his ELC goes away. He and Joki are not "top talent" in the mold of 19, 2 or 88, or any of PB's second wave. They are too young and too inconsistent to make that claim. And a guy in Saad making $6MM a year sure isn't worth anywhere near that in his return tenure with the Hawks.

Not to mention, none of the guys you mentioned except maybe ADB are showing they will outscore AA yet this year.

Also hard to make the argument that SB has managed the cap very well either. Even with the rise in the upper limit, current salaries for premium players are up substantially from a couple of years ago, making meaningful FA additions just as difficult with the combined six salaries of Kane, Toews, Seabrook, Crawford, Saad and Keith eating up $45MM or 57% of the cap.
- Return of the Roar

Toews and Kane were top draft picks, it's really unfair to compare the young guys to their. Keith wasn't a "top talent" when he was drafted but he developed into one. There's no reason to believe that Schmaltz and Jokiharju can't follow the same path. That's not to say they will, but it's possible.

Of the current ELC guys you mention, only ADB seems value versus production. Remember NS wants to get paid next year, and his ELC goes away. He and Joki are not "top talent" in the mold of 19, 2 or 88, or any of PB's second wave. They are too young and too inconsistent to make that claim. And a guy in Saad making $6MM a year sure isn't worth anywhere near that in his return tenure with the Hawks.

Not to mention, none of the guys you mentioned except maybe ADB are showing they will outscore AA yet this year.

Also hard to make the argument that SB has managed the cap very well either. Even with the rise in the upper limit, current salaries for premium players are up substantially from a couple of years ago, making meaningful FA additions just as difficult with the combined six salaries of Kane, Toews, Seabrook, Crawford, Saad and Keith eating up $45MM or 57% of the cap.
- Return of the Roar

I 100% guarantee that Schmaltz will outscore Anisimov this year barring significant injury. And I'd bet a decent amount of money that Jokiharju will as well, he already has 2 points on him. Anisimov produces points at a 4th line rate when he's not with Kane, and even with Kane he can barely squeak past 40.

I've never argued that Bowman has done well with the cap, or that 28, 12, and 8 are the next 2, 88, 19. They are not. The free agent market has been a big old 'overpayment fest' every year, further proving my point that you absolutely shouldn't let go of home grown talent (SCHMALTZ, Terravainen, Saad, Panarin)

Toews and Kane were top draft picks, it's really unfair to compare the young guys to their. Keith wasn't a "top talent" when he was drafted but he developed into one. There's no reason to believe that Schmaltz and Jokiharju can't follow the same path. That's not to say they will, but it's possible.
- DarthKane

And if we lose him and grows into the great player he can be and shines as a top 6 talent, we will never hear the end of the griping and another missed opportunity by that old, inept Stan. OO just made this point above, didn't see it.

I 100% guarantee that Schmaltz will outscore Anisimov this year barring significant injury. And I'd bet a decent amount of money that Jokiharju will as well, he already has 2 points on him. Anisimov produces points at a 4th line rate when he's not with Kane, and even with Kane he can barely squeak past 40.

I've never argued that Bowman has done well with the cap, or that 28, 12, and 8 are the next 2, 88, 19. They are not. The free agent market has been a big old 'overpayment fest' every year, further proving my point that you absolutely shouldn't let go of home grown talent (SCHMALTZ, Terravainen, Saad, Panarin)
- ObeseOprah

But most of our homegrown talent just isn't talented enough. Games like last night offer more than enough evidence to prove that out.

And if we lose him and grows into the great player he can be and shines as a top 6 talent, we will never hear the end of the griping and another missed opportunity by that old, inept Stan
- I Am The Breadman

That's what happened with Teravainen.

That's what happened with Teravainen.
- DarthKane

Danault also ... well, I think he's part of the conversation also.

https://news.ubc.ca/2014/05/15/nhl-study/


"The study by Sauder School of Business Prof. James Brander found that the performance of forwards peaks between the ages of 27 and 28. Defencemen are best between 28 and 29, and the performance of goaltenders varies little by age."
- EnzoD

My next door neighbour's kid is 12 and a very good goalie and is willing to play for just a slight increase on the current allowance his mother gives him. Stan could dump Cro and Ward and use the money to offer sheet Auston Mathews next summer.

The Hawks are lacking top end talent, but part of the problem is where they have been drafting for the last 10 years. You don't find too many blue chippers where the Hawks have been picking. Detroit struck gold with Datsyuk and Zetterberg in late rounds during thier run, but for the most part, players like that are not around. Toews and Kane went 3rd and 1st overall in their respective draft years. You better strike it rich when you pick in those slots, and the Hawks definitely did. The Hawks have found some nice players in the draft, but it is very hard finding real top-end talent if you are picking way down in the draft for a decade.

How long does the waiver process take to get thru all teams?

Danault also ... well, I think he's part of the conversation also.
- I Am The Breadman

Like Danault's game a lot, but I do not him consider top line talent. Teravainen yes, Danault, no in my opinion.

How long does the waiver process take to get thru all teams?
- glennjpawlak22

24 hours?
Don't quote me on it.

Like Danault's game a lot, but I do not him consider top line talent. Teravainen yes, Danault, no in my opinion.
- ChicagoHope

He's a good centre, but people value players differently. Would like him on the team.
Yesterday, Saad was garbage. Today, Schmaltz is garbage. What are you gonna do?

24 hours?
Don't quote me on it.
- I Am The Breadman

I think that is correct.

He's a good centre, but people value players differently. Would like him on the team.
Yesterday, Saad was garbage. Today, Schmaltz is garbage. What are you gonna do?
- I Am The Breadman

I think that is correct.
- DarthKane

11:00 am Eastern or it may be Central, don’t remember lol.

- DarthKane

Haha, okay. Go for it.

The Hawks are lacking top end talent, but part of the problem is where they have been drafting for the last 10 years. You don't find too many blue chippers where the Hawks have been picking. Detroit struck gold with Datsyuk and Zetterberg in late rounds during thier run, but for the most part, players like that are not around. Toews and Kane went 3rd and 1st overall in their respective draft years. You better strike it rich when you pick in those slots, and the Hawks definitely did. The Hawks have found some nice players in the draft, but it is very hard finding real top-end talent if you are picking way down in the draft for a decade.
- ChicagoHope

While a generally accepted explanation (excuse), there are exceptions to that. Take a look at Tampa Bay's roster and look at where Kucherov, Alex Killorn, Brayden Point, Vasilevskiy, Cedric Paquette and Anthony Cirelli were taken in their draft years. That is some serious good work by Yzerman and his scouts.

And how about Sebastian Aho (35), Miles Wood (100), Arvidsson (112) to name a few more.

By comparison, the Hawks have drafted quite poorly thru their great success years and have not so much in the pipeline now.

11:00 am Eastern or it may be Central, don’t remember lol.
- walleyeb1

I think Eastern. I'm screwed up on being Central, but 11 am Eastern sounds right.

Of the current ELC guys you mention, only ADB seems value versus production. Remember NS wants to get paid next year, and his ELC goes away. He and Joki are not "top talent" in the mold of 19, 2 or 88, or any of PB's second wave. They are too young and too inconsistent to make that claim. And a guy in Saad making $6MM a year sure isn't worth anywhere near that in his return tenure with the Hawks.

Not to mention, none of the guys you mentioned except maybe ADB are showing they will outscore AA yet this year.

Also hard to make the argument that SB has managed the cap very well either. Even with the rise in the upper limit, current salaries for premium players are up substantially from a couple of years ago, making meaningful FA additions just as difficult with the combined six salaries of Kane, Toews, Seabrook, Crawford, Saad and Keith eating up $45MM or 57% of the cap.
- Return of the Roar

Thanks for your career synopsis on a 19 year old d-man in Joki. Where was Keith at 19? Pretty sure he wouldn't have been playing solidly in a top 2 roll. Schmaltz has 6 pts, Joki has 5, and Anisimov has 3.

Comparing a 22 year old Schmaltz and 19 year old Joki to 3 Hall of Famers is also a joke man. Both are on the losing end of value vs. production? Give me a break.

I think Eastern. I'm screwed up on being Central, but 11 am Eastern sounds right.
- I Am The Breadman

Actually the more I think about it, it’s 11:00 central.