Who was better and more sought after at the time? there is a reason several teams wanted him,and unlike that punk Gustavsson he was willing to spend time in the minors to adjust to N.A hockey. The leafs just wanted Gustavsson so bad they didn't develop him properly to NA hockey
- FirstClass

Yeah, Burke and Allaire did a great job with him. Just like they're doing with a few guys in the Leafs system now.

Hiller was undrafted.... so, sought after? Depends how you look at things.

That was around the time Enroth broke out though. There's always a few kids putting up mind numbing stats in Europe, like Varlamov did. Tuuka Rask was still over there lighting it up.

Then there are a few journeymen guys that will shock you with what they do. Look up a guy named Travis Scott.

I think you forget that in all those series in the previous century the Leafs were higher rated because they were a better team. Nobody disputes that. However when the Leaf began their decline and finally fell right out of the playoff race is when the Senators were recognized as an elite team. Did the Leafs ever play against the Senators where Spezza was the #1 center with Heatley. I don't think so. In fact, I think that Spezza may have played against the Leafs as a call up from the minors during the playoffs but not as a regular.
- spatso

By all, do you mean one?

So, like, Filatov to the Sens?
- prock

Yes! Finally you appear to be getting it.

I've already told you, I don't care what Sens fans were thinking/doing/whatever.
- prock

I think you may be in denial. For someone that is supposedly indifferent to the Senators you spend an awful lot of time expressing so much frustration about them. You might be best just to ignore them.

I think you may be in denial. For someone that is supposedly indifferent to the Senators you spend an awful lot of time expressing so much frustration about them. You might be best just to ignore them.
- spatso

LOL. In a thread about the Leafs, started by a Sens fan.

I wonder what Burke's back up plan is if both Reimer and Gustavsson don't step up to be a #1 goalie is?

I wonder what Burke's back up plan is if both Reimer and Gustavsson don't step up to be a #1 goalie is?
- sens rock

Scrivens. If not, they tank, and we get ourselves another high pick. (And wilson will probably get fired)

I don't think Leafs fans care nearly that much about the Senators. If there's any backlash it won't be because the Senators made the playoffs first, it'll simply be because it's taking the Leafs way too damn long to make the playoffs themselves.
- daeth

The leafs have not made the playoffs since spring 2004, if they fail to make it this coming spring, that will be 8 years, going on 9...............at what point does it become "way to damn long"?

I wonder what Burke's back up plan is if both Reimer and Gustavsson don't step up to be a #1 goalie is?
- sens rock

Scrivens, Rynnas, Mark From Da Park. The Leafs have as good, if not the best prospect depth in net in the NHL.

No. I don't care about the Sens. .
- prock

You DO care about the Senators. You post in every thread that is Senator related. You claim it's to "taunt" Senator fans, or an inferiority complex of something to justify your continual comparisons between the two teams, and how much better you believe the leafs are.

There is NO other team that you pay so much attention to. Actions speak louder than words.

Leaf fans forget, we dumped the useless Joffrey Lupul on them, he was a 4 million dollar third liner for us.
- FirstClass

And Beauchemin was a useless 3.5 million plug for the Leafs. 21 year-old Aulie took his spot and was better.

Scrivens, Rynnas, Mark From Da Park. The Leafs have as good, if not the best prospect depth in net in the NHL.
- RogerRoeper

prospects won't get the leafs into the playoffs. That's by far the biggest weakness/question mark for the leafs heading into the season. Their goalies only have 102 games combined NHL experience.

A dump is a dump.
- spatso

If Franson is a dump, getting Leba is the runs.

You DO care about the Senators. You post in every thread that is Senator related. You claim it's to "taunt" Senator fans, or an inferiority complex of something to justify your continual comparisons between the two teams, and how much better you believe the leafs are.

There is NO other team that you pay so much attention to. Actions speak louder than words.
- Doppleganger

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

prospects won't get the leafs into the playoffs. That's by far the biggest weakness/question mark for the leafs heading into the season. Their goalies only have 102 games combined NHL experience.
- sens rock

They're cleary going with inexperience in net. Nothing will change. Reimer/Gusty is their duo, and if they fail, it'll be Scrivens or Rynnas.

prospects won't get the leafs into the playoffs. That's by far the biggest weakness/question mark for the leafs heading into the season. Their goalies only have 102 games combined NHL experience.
- sens rock

Agreed, but if they end up great, we have future goaltenders.

If they end up collapsing, we have a top 5 pick

Agreed, but if they end up great, we have future goaltenders.

If they end up collapsing, we have a top 5 pick
- mfreedman

how do you feel about that risk since the leafs are expected to make the playoffs with their improvements at the forward and defense position? Because of Reimers hot finish nobody seems to be talking about goaltending as a potential problem.

how do you feel about that risk since the leafs are expected to make the playoffs with their improvements at the forward and defense position? Because of Reimers hot finish nobody seems to be talking about goaltending as a potential problem.
- sens rock

The Leafs are being predicted by most to miss the playoffs.

And I'm seeing a lot of people questioning Reimer because he only played 37 games in the NHL.

how do you feel about that risk since the leafs are expected to make the playoffs with their improvements at the forward and defense position? Because of Reimers hot finish nobody seems to be talking about goaltending as a potential problem.
- sens rock

Not true

We have talked about it a ton. However, what is there to talk about? Reimer did well, when he was playing, but he could turn out terrible (We have accepted that as a risk)

If he fails, Gustavsson had a 0.951sv% in the AHL after all his health problems sudsided.. He could make a comeback, if he doesn't we turn to Scrivens

If he can't do it, then we finish near the bottom and get a great pick. The thing a lot of leaf fans have wanted for a while.

However, I believe that Reimer seems like the real deal, and will be a very capable goaltender. No one can really say anything more until we see him play more.

Again no reason to discuss, we know the possibilities

The Leafs are being predicted by most to miss the playoffs.

And I'm seeing a lot of people questioning Reimer because he only played 37 games in the NHL.
- RogerRoeper

as they should. its only 37 games.

I think the leafs have the talent in front of him to make it, but the east is full of deep teams and elite goaltenders and i don't think reimer is up to the challenge just yet in his career.

If Franson is a dump, getting Leba is the runs.
- RogerRoeper

This is a pure kool aid issue. You can repeat that as many times as you want but the green guys will just drink more kool aid and honestly believe that it could not be true.
- spatso

Very true spatso, they don't seem to realize Gardiner was a project, he may be a respectable player in the future but he has huge hockey sense issues in terms of offensive ability

They regularly finished ahead of them in the standings as well, in the regular season as well. The only thing the Sens have over that period is a finals appearance, basically every other comparison between the two teams is a win for the Leafs.

Only one of the four series beatings of the Sens was an upset. The other three, the Leafs were the higher seeded team.
- prock

Once again you are living in a Dream world.......and your above statement is FULL of lies I guess you believe.


Since the Senators returned to the NHL, they've won FOUR Divisional Championships, One Conference Championship, One Presidents Trophy, was first NHL in Ontario to exceed 100 points (without benefit of "loser" points) and as you pointed out a berth in the Finals.

In the same time period, the leafs have won one Divisional Championship.

Since they've been Divisional Rivals (playing the same teams and each other the equal amount of games), Ottawa has finished AHEAD of toronto EIGHT times in the regular season standings, twice as many times as the leafs finished ahead of the Senators in the regular season.

Also over the same period of time (since they became Divisional rivals) the Senators have accumulated 47 MORE regular season Wins than the leafs.

And this is why YOU have an inferiority complex about the Senators being the better of the two Ontario based teams, for over a decade now, since the leafs returned to the east, and they've been measured against the same schedule and the same teams.

Otherwise why would you spend such and inordinate about of your time, posting in Senators threads, trying to convince the uniformed that what yow stated in the post I quoted, is true, because it a total fabrication.

Ottawa has been the better team, hands down.

Once again you are living in a Dream world.......and your above statement is FULL of lies I guess you believe.


Since the Senators returned to the NHL, they've won FOUR Divisional Championships, One Conference Championship, One Presidents Trophy, was first NHL in Ontario to exceed 100 points (without benefit of "loser" points) and as you pointed out a berth in the Finals.

In the same time period, the leafs have won one Divisional Championship.

Since they've been Divisional Rivals (playing the same teams and each other the equal amount of games), Ottawa has finished AHEAD of toronto EIGHT times in the regular season standings, twice as many times as the leafs finished ahead of the Senators in the regular season.

Also over the same period of time (since they became Divisional rivals) the Senators have accumulated 47 MORE regular season Wins than the leafs.

And this is why YOU have an inferiority complex about the Senators being the better of the two Ontario based teams, for over a decade now, since the leafs returned to the east, and they've been measured against the same schedule and the same teams.

Otherwise why would you spend such and inordinate about of your time, posting in Senators threads, trying to convince the uniformed that what yow stated in the post I quoted, is true, because it a total fabrication.

Ottawa has been the better team, hands down.
- Doppleganger

He is comparing playoffs, you are comparing regular season

You guys really need to start talking on the same terms, otherwise the argument is pointless

Once again you are living in a Dream world.......and your above statement is FULL of lies I guess you believe.


Since the Senators returned to the NHL, they've won FOUR Divisional Championships, One Conference Championship, One Presidents Trophy, was first NHL in Ontario to exceed 100 points (without benefit of "loser" points) and as you pointed out a berth in the Finals.

In the same time period, the leafs have won one Divisional Championship.

Since they've been Divisional Rivals (playing the same teams and each other the equal amount of games), Ottawa has finished AHEAD of toronto EIGHT times in the regular season standings, twice as many times as the leafs finished ahead of the Senators in the regular season.

Also over the same period of time (since they became Divisional rivals) the Senators have accumulated 47 MORE regular season Wins than the leafs.

And this is why YOU have an inferiority complex about the Senators being the better of the two Ontario based teams, for over a decade now, since the leafs returned to the east, and they've been measured against the same schedule and the same teams.

Otherwise why would you spend such and inordinate about of your time, posting in Senators threads, trying to convince the uniformed that what yow stated in the post I quoted, is true, because it a total fabrication.

Ottawa has been the better team, hands down.
- Doppleganger

I wish you would avoid words like lies, fabrications and other words that go to the character of the person. You can say thing like your wrong, you misunderstand, you have missed the point etc. etc. It is one thing to say a person has made an error it is entirely different to attack another person's character.