Same. Him, Buddy Robinson, they just sound like AHLers to me. Hope we’re wrong. Training camp and preseason will be over scrutinized to death, but I can’t wait for it to be hockey time. The Bears are their annual disaster and the Cubs hope isn’t very strong.
- ObeseOprah

Probably, but at this point in the rebuild, it’s all about seeing who is actually useful going forward. Most likely, he isn’t going to be anything special, but many said the same thing about Hagel for a long time.

Probably, but at this point in the rebuild, it’s all about seeing who is actually useful going forward. Most likely, he isn’t going to be anything special, but many said the same thing about Hagel for a long time.
- Chunk

That is a great point

One thing I love about this time of year are the surprises. There are always one or two or three players that just surprise everyone with improvement. There are duds and folks that disappoint, but really enjoy seeing what comes out of left field.
- breadbag

Murphy will be +6 by the end of October.

I hope I'm wrong but I have zero expectations for Guttman, I think he'll be a career AHLer (which isn't a bad thing).
- DarthKane

No red font? I saw flashes of Hagel in Guttman's game last year. He'll be with the big club for at least a year or two.

One thing I love about this time of year are the surprises. There are always one or two or three players that just surprise everyone with improvement. There are duds and folks that disappoint, but really enjoy seeing what comes out of left field.
- breadbag

Yep.... Wasn't Cole Guttman one of those camp/preseason surprises last yr as a rookie FA coming outa U of Denver?

Wonder who the scout that recommended Guttman likes this yr?

I hope I'm wrong but I have zero expectations for Guttman, I think he'll be a career AHLer (which isn't a bad thing).
- DarthKane

I guess we'll see, was very impressed at his time here before he got hurt. He just got out of college so its not like he's older.

Not sure what more he could have done to impress after he was up.

Not saying that's translating to a top 6 player or anything, but i see a bit of Carl Haglin in him. Smaller guy, plays hard, plays fast, non stop motor guy who contributes on the 3rd or the 4th line on a good team.

Yep.... Wasn't Cole Guttman one of those camp/preseason surprises last yr as a rookie FA coming outa U of Denver?

Wonder who the scout that recommended Guttman likes this yr?
- Mr Ricochet

Guttman was signed when Tampa Bay let his signing rights expire, same as how the Hawks signed Hagel. Someone said take a flyer on the Captain of the College champion Denver team, especially since the Hawks had no depth of forwards in the system.

No red font? I saw flashes of Hagel in Guttman's game last year. He'll be with the big club for at least a year or two.
- Dieselhead

Guttman is hungry. He opted not to sign with Tampa, just so he'd maximize his chance to break into the NHL sooner. That's a guy who believes in himself.

Guttman was signed when Tampa Bay let his signing rights expire, same as how the Hawks signed Hagel. Someone said take a flyer on the Captain of the College champion Denver team, especially since the Hawks had no depth of forwards in the system.
- LAHawk

Dang that’s a pretty great backstory. Hope for the best with him.

Probably, but at this point in the rebuild, it’s all about seeing who is actually useful going forward. Most likely, he isn’t going to be anything special, but many said the same thing about Hagel for a long time.
- Chunk

If I recall correctly, when the Hawks signed Hagel I said he was going to be traded for 2 first round picks and 2 roster forwards.

Agreed, I can't see three young defensemen playing at the same time unless necessitated by injuries.
- rpeters01

Generally speaking I agree. But like anything else no two situations are alike. Sheltering, easing in, finding good spots, developing for 2 rookie Dmen on the NHL roster seems fair and doablde but it matters who these Dmen are as to can you go with 3, or more, rookie Dmen.

Lets say Korchinski shows enough to merit a stay past 10 games. Do you go with Vlasic, Kaiser AND KK on the big league roster? That's 3 rooks. Not perfect but are
Kaiser and Vlasic competent enough in their zone to add a weaker defensive rookie like KK?

Or would one of Vlasic or Kaiser have to go to RKF cuz assimilating 3 rookie Dmen is not conducive to proper development? 

I do think Kaiser and Vlasic play the type of game that a 3rd rookie Dmen can reasonably be added to the NHL roster without it creating chaos. ..... At least it merits a try if KK shows he's ready.

I hope I'm wrong but I have zero expectations for Guttman, I think he'll be a career AHLer (which isn't a bad thing).
- DarthKane

Glad you weighed in on Guttman......... I have the benefit of seeing Guttman a good bit in the USHL where he played 70ish games both live and thru az stream.

Kid's is an IQ player with good speed, small, decent hands, 2 way, high motor, never dominant points wise. Gutman is the kinda player you'd say nice play kid 5-6-10 times a game. High IQ, hungry and decisive in jrs playing in all situations.

I saw all that in the NHL but seems to have added some playmaking. This player is 24 yrs old, 70 USHL games, 4 full yrs in the NCAA that included 140 games. He's not a kid and is probably closer to his ceiling than not.

I too could see him as an excellent AHLer or a top end shutdown 4th line PK NHLer on a good team or somewhere in between.

But cuz of his IQ, motor and predictability he'll always be a coaches favorite....... Kid gets it and always has. Just a matter of how far his size and athletic ability will take him.

Guttman was signed when Tampa Bay let his signing rights expire, same as how the Hawks signed Hagel. Someone said take a flyer on the Captain of the College champion Denver team, especially since the Hawks had no depth of forwards in the system.
- LAHawk

Good context, LA. Bet TB would have a place for Guttman on their 23/24 roster.... Point is there are camp surprises and they can come from many different paths. Would think constructing the bottom of a camp roster is a scout's dream as they look into their little black book for guys who had caught their eye at some time/level/yr and make recommendations to the boss.

No red font? I saw flashes of Hagel in Guttman's game last year. He'll be with the big club for at least a year or two.
- Dieselhead

That's a fair comparison as Guttman and Hagel are about the same age and 6th rd picks. Hagel went CHL, Guttman NCAA (good choice as a smallish 5ft 9in kid). Hagel showed more offense but Guttman played center with a strong energized 2 way game, Hagel played wing.

Don't think anyone is saying Guttman will be the next Hagel but there are similarities in the two players.

Agreed, I can't see three young defensemen playing at the same time unless necessitated by injuries.
- rpeters01

And thinking about this how many yrs have many Hawk's fans waited for this camp? To see 3-4-5 rookie Dmen with legit shots to make the NHL roster.

3-4-5 yrs? Since the last Dman they developed thru the system, Hammer?..... Fun times, scary too. Lotta forks in the long rebuild road that management will have to navigate.

Generally speaking I agree. But like anything else no two situations are alike. Sheltering, easing in, finding good spots, developing for 2 rookie Dmen on the NHL roster seems fair and doablde but it matters who these Dmen are as to can you go with 3, or more, rookie Dmen.

Lets say Korchinski shows enough to merit a stay past 10 games. Do you go with Vlasic, Kaiser AND KK on the big league roster? That's 3 rooks. Not perfect but are
Kaiser and Vlasic competent enough in their zone to add a weaker defensive rookie like KK?

Or would one of Vlasic or Kaiser have to go to RKF cuz assimilating 3 rookie Dmen is not conducive to proper development? 

I do think Kaiser and Vlasic play the type of game that a 3rd rookie Dmen can reasonably be added to the NHL roster without it creating chaos. ..... At least it merits a try if KK shows he's ready.
- Mr Ricochet

KD could end up trying to get a vet off waivers or trade like they did adding Tinordi last Oct 10, because right now seems like we are going to have 3 young Dmen on the roster and maybe more once injuries inevitably become a factor. Maybe the coaches like the idea of pairing each vet with a youngster and will just go with it.

And thinking about this how many yrs have many Hawk's fans waited for this camp? To see 3-4-5 rookie Dmen with legit shots to make the NHL roster.

3-4-5 yrs? Since the last Dman they developed thru the system, Hammer?..... Fun times, scary too. Lotta forks in the long rebuild road that management will have to navigate.
- Mr Ricochet

Yeah it's been a progression.

Rookie Dmen by season.

15-16 3 Rookies (TVR, Gus, Svedberg)
16-17 1 Rookie (Forsling)
17-18 2 Rookies (Dahlstrom, Hillman)
18-19 3 Rookies (Jokiharju, Dahlstrom, Gilbert)
19-20 4 Rookies (Boqvist, Gilbert, Carlsson, Beaudin)
20-21 5 Rookies (Mitchell, Kalynuk, Beaudin, Carlsson, Regula)
21-22 6 Rookies (Vlasic, Regula, Galvas, Kalynuk, Philips, Beaudin)
22-23 5 Rookies (Roos, Philips, Kaiser, Vlasic, Regula)

A lot more rookies getting looks as the team dismantled and we started drafting higher. We didn't hold onto many of them, the one that I still wish we had held onto was Forsling, as he has just gotten better each season.

To your point though, this season we are likely to see a high volume of games played by rookies on D. The last two seasons we haven't had a rookie dman play 20 games in a season.

Just for fun, I looked at games played in one season by a rookie Dman over those years on that list.

TVR 82 games
Boqvist 41 games
Gus 41 games
Mitchell 39 Games
Jokiharju 38 games
Forsling 38 games
Dahlstrom 38 games

This season we could see multiple rookie Dmen get 50+ games. It really could be an adventure on the back end.

Yeah it's been a progression.

Rookie Dmen by season.

15-16 3 Rookies (TVR, Gus, Svedberg)
16-17 1 Rookie (Forsling)
17-18 2 Rookies (Dahlstrom, Hillman)
18-19 3 Rookies (Jokiharju, Dahlstrom, Gilbert)
19-20 4 Rookies (Boqvist, Gilbert, Carlsson, Beaudin)
20-21 5 Rookies (Mitchell, Kalynuk, Beaudin, Carlsson, Regula)
21-22 6 Rookies (Vlasic, Regula, Galvas, Kalynuk, Philips, Beaudin)
22-23 5 Rookies (Roos, Philips, Kaiser, Vlasic, Regula)

A lot more rookies getting looks as the team dismantled and we started drafting higher. We didn't hold onto many of them, the one that I still wish we had held onto was Forsling, as he has just gotten better each season.

To your point though, this season we are likely to see a high volume of games played by rookies on D. The last two seasons we haven't had a rookie dman play 20 games in a season.

Just for fun, I looked at games played in one season by a rookie Dman over those years on that list.

TVR 82 games
Boqvist 41 games
Gus 41 games
Mitchell 39 Games
Jokiharju 38 games
Forsling 38 games
Dahlstrom 38 games

This season we could see multiple rookie Dmen get 50+ games. It really could be an adventure on the back end.
- breadbag

Let’s not forget Phillips. Kid has improved every year, and has the most pro experience in the A of all the D prospects. Probably was the #1 defenseman at Rockford last year, and did not look out of place in his 16 NHL games either. He is also big 6’3 210 and can skate. And still only 21 years old.

If I recall correctly, when the Hawks signed Hagel I said he was going to be traded for 2 first round picks and 2 roster forwards.



- DarthKane

Yeah, but you never said anything about Katchouk and Raddysh, you’re slipping.

When did they acquire him? I looked him up and he appears to be Red Wing property.

Personally I'm fond of Finnish defensemen. It's as if the ancient Viking warrior genes reemerge with those guys.



- Rota's Rooter

I just checked Elite prospects

Chicago Blackhawks Chicago Blackhawks / Unsigned

The acquired him sometime back.

I just checked Elite prospects

Chicago Blackhawks Chicago Blackhawks / Unsigned

The acquired him sometime back.
- wiz1901

Saarijärvi was picked up in the Patrick Kane trade, he came from Arizona. Drafted by Detroit and then traded to Arizona, then to Chicago.

I hope I'm wrong but I have zero expectations for Guttman, I think he'll be a career AHLer (which isn't a bad thing).
- DarthKane

Guttman will carve out a decent NHL career mainly because he will be cheap to have on a roster.

In terms of playing style, the guy who reminded me of Hagel is Rolston. Just the way he was somehow around the puck even when he looked about to fall over half the time.

Korchinski has no business being in the NHL right now. He clearly is not ready. He was mediocre on Sunday. I am not going to call him a bust but he is being fitted for a training bra.

Kaiser is a better skater and will be the better player.

Let’s not forget Phillips. Kid has improved every year, and has the most pro experience in the A of all the D prospects. Probably was the #1 defenseman at Rockford last year, and did not look out of place in his 16 NHL games either. He is also big 6’3 210 and can skate. And still only 21 years old.
- LAHawk

But but
But the thing about Phillips is despite his natural ability, and he is strong too
He is not naturally inclined to be nasty or regularly an imposing force defensively. You wish he could be motivated...

Sure he was riding man off the puck last time he was recalled but but but you are left thinking and hoping he could be/do much more ....better
Mr Richochet
Phillios had come a long ways from the underage rookie in the AHL
Question is how good could he become

ADD
Another player I wonder how good could he become
It is Stauber
Darn good looking in.his NHL debut l. So how does Stauber, Comesso and Soderstrom progress when they are sharing net. If Soderstrom is in NHL, then the other two split chores for Rockford

Thus means about 40 AHL gp. Then the following season our 2023 #2 round draft pick might turn pro. Muddied waters for sure
I suppose this season we will figure out how good exactly is Stauber. Sensible that a goaltender added next season means one iof the current crop will change his NHL city
.

But but
But the thing about Phillips is despite his natural ability, and he is strong too
He is not naturally inclined to be nasty or regularly an imposing force defensively. You wish he could be motivated...

Sure he was riding man off the puck last time he was recalled but but but you are left thinking and hoping he could be/do much more ....better
Mr Richochet
Phillios had come a long ways from the underage rookie in the AHL
Question is how good could he become
- jhawk59

I seem to recall that he got into a fight last year.