Brannstrom has no value and Joseph has negative value with his contract. You would likely have to give up a 1st or 2nd round pick just to get rid of Joseph. Nobody would claim him on waivers for free.
- dcz28

I had meant to throw a 2nd round pick into the mix. While Laughton is a decent player, and has 3 million for 3 more years .... he is not the second coming. He is not a star. A first round pick for what ostensibly is a 3rd line player who basically had a career year at age 29 ..... have to be careful not to overpay for this type of player.
Brannstrom .... would essentially run the back end of Philly's powerplay and is a decent puck moving d-man who never was given much of a chance in Ottawa (until injuries hit the defence). As for Joseph .... a very capable penalty killer and 3rd line player. Toss in a 2nd round pick and voila.

Brannstrom has no value and Joseph has negative value with his contract. You would likely have to give up a 1st or 2nd round pick just to get rid of Joseph. Nobody would claim him on waivers for free.
- dcz28

You didn't watch the Sens. Brannstrom had his best year

I had meant to throw a 2nd round pick into the mix. While Laughton is a decent player, and has 3 million for 3 more years .... he is not the second coming. He is not a star. A first round pick for what ostensibly is a 3rd line player who basically had a career year at age 29 ..... have to be careful not to overpay for this type of player.
Brannstrom .... would essentially run the back end of Philly's powerplay and is a decent puck moving d-man who never was given much of a chance in Ottawa (until injuries hit the defence). As for Joseph .... a very capable penalty killer and 3rd line player. Toss in a 2nd round pick and voila.
- OttawaB

Laughton is what you wish a middle 6 player can produce (30 to 40 points) for 3 million a year with some physical edge. Joseph is not...the reason Sens fans want to get rid of him so bad. Like i said, Joseph has negative value.

Brannstrom is an offensive defenseman that doesn't produce offense. He really doesn't bring much of anything.

You didn't watch the Sens. Brannstrom had his best year
- AlfieisKing

I have watched him more than enough. 18 points for an offensive defenseman that isn't really good at anything else isn't good.

Brannstrom had 10 points more than defensive Lindstrom did for the Wings in twice the games that Lindstrom played. I thought the Wings were just not going to qualify Lindstrom and let him go back to Sweden. I really don't know why the Sens are paying Brannstrom 2 mil. He's a 6th or 7th dman and the Sens have better youngsters they could be playing instead of wasting their time with him.

My guess is Dorion is beating that dead horse because he has nothing else really to show for trading Stone and letting Branstrom walk or getting rid of him would just show even more how he got bent over in that trade.

Tarasenko is a strong add as long as it does not impact on the Sens ability to resign Pinto. Obviously I prefer Tarasenko over DeBrincat on the size factor alone. And, I love the short term (1 year deal).

Would you give up 2 first round picks (2024) plus Branstrom and Joseph for Logan Cooley?

Tarasenko is a strong add as long as it does not impact on the Sens ability to resign Pinto. Obviously I prefer Tarasenko over DeBrincat on the size factor alone. And, I love the short term (1 year deal).

Would you give up 2 first round picks (2024) plus Branstrom and Joseph for Logan Cooley?
- spatso

Spatso.
You're generally a pretty smart dude. How do you figure they get Pinto, Brannstrom and Soko done with 895,000 in cap space?

Spatso.
You're generally a pretty smart dude. How do you figure they get Pinto, Brannstrom and Soko done with 895,000 in cap space?
- Octavarium

I would give up Bransstrom ($2M), Joseph ($2.95M) and 2 1st round picks for Logan Cooley ($.95M). The math works just as long as Cooley does not have a Calder type rookie season and kill you on the bonus costs.

Tarasenko has the reputation of being a really good veteran playmaker. Ottawa is loaded with shooters. Adding Giroux last year to skate with Stutzle and Tkachuk was a really strong move. Another veteran that is also a strong playmaker should give a substantial boost to the Sens second line.

I think we are really going to love this team.

Tarasenko has the reputation of being a really good veteran playmaker. Ottawa is loaded with shooters. Adding Giroux last year to skate with Stutzle and Tkachuk was a really strong move. Another veteran that is also a strong playmaker should give a substantial boost to the Sens second line.

I think we are really going to love this team.
- spatso

They lost Debrinicat, but will add Tarasenko, Norris, and Kubalik

So... assuming they are able to sign Pinto.

Tkcachuk Stutzle Giroux
Kubalik Norris Tarasenko
Greig Pinto Batherson


Would prefer to see Batheron in the top six. But there is a log jam at right wing now, unless you put Tarasenko at LW.

Or do you try him out with Stutzle?

Sens have 6 players that have scored 30g in a season since 19-20:

Tim Stutzle
Brady Tkachuk
Vladimir Tarasenko
Dominik Kubalik
Josh Norris
Claude Giroux

Players that have score 20:

Drake Batherson
Shane Pinto

I don't think we should miss Alex DeBrincat one bit. And we have 2 1sts next year - Dorion should make use of them

I would give up Bransstrom ($2M), Joseph ($2.95M) and 2 1st round picks for Logan Cooley ($.95M). The math works just as long as Cooley does not have a Calder type rookie season and kill you on the bonus costs.
- spatso

Arizona does not want those salaries. It would cost a 1st just to get someone to take Joseph so you think Arizona would trade Cooley for an overpaid depth defenseman in Brannstrom and a later 1st.

There would be plenty of team offering much better deals than that for Cooley. Hell Yzerman should be offering Kasper or Danielson plus another prospect and/or pick. That's much better than taking 2 players they don't want to pay and 2 later first round picks.

You want Joseph and Brannstrom gone it would be with the Ducks or Hawks and they wouldn't do it for free.

Arizona does not want those salaries. It would cost a 1st just to get someone to take Joseph so you think Arizona would trade Cooley for an overpaid depth defenseman in Brannstrom and a later 1st.

There would be plenty of team offering much better deals than that for Cooley. Hell Yzerman should be offering Kasper or Danielson plus another prospect and/or pick. That's much better than taking 2 players they don't want to pay and 2 later first round picks.

You want Joseph and Brannstrom gone it would be with the Ducks or Hawks and they wouldn't do it for free.
- dcz28

Sens are loaded with firepower. Six guys who have scored 30 goals recently and 2 more who have scored 20. They are really solid on the back. Plus they have made the team a lot bigger (physically). They are not really looking for anything other than being able to balance the books. Folks assume they should just move either Brannstrom or Joseph. My thought is they should move both those players plus add two first round picks and try to take back a top prospect on an entry level contract.

A strong case can be made for doing nothing. Every year the Sens have had a major injury early in the season and the issues of salary cap might be self regulating.

Tarasenko is a strong add as long as it does not impact on the Sens ability to resign Pinto. Obviously I prefer Tarasenko over DeBrincat on the size factor alone. And, I love the short term (1 year deal).

Would you give up 2 first round picks (2024) plus Branstrom and Joseph for Logan Cooley?
- spatso

I was thinking about this as a trade if Cooley is really on the trading blocks.
I would consider the trade as Cooley is still very young and would be considered a grand slam 1rst round pick in any draft. He could probably start right away on the Sens 3rd line. And he would be locked up for 5 more years (or 6?). Ottawa would never, and in the forseeable future, drafted high enough to grab a player of this stature. I might even throw in a Sokolov as a sweetener as I don't know if he will ever be able to crack the Sens lineup as anything other then an occasional 3rd or fourth liner.

I was thinking about this as a trade if Cooley is really on the trading blocks.
I would consider the trade as Cooley is still very young and would be considered a grand slam 1rst round pick in any draft. He could probably start right away on the Sens 3rd line. And he would be locked up for 5 more years (or 6?). Ottawa would never, and in the forseeable future, drafted high enough to grab a player of this stature. I might even throw in a Sokolov as a sweetener as I don't know if he will ever be able to crack the Sens lineup as anything other then an occasional 3rd or fourth liner.
- OttawaB

"Logan is an incredibly skilled player who had an excellent season with the Golden Gophers last year. He has established himself as one of the top prospects in the world. He is a very important player for us, and he has an extremely bright future ahead. We look forward to watching him play for the Coyotes for many years to come.”
Bill Armstrong.

These are not words used for a player that expects to be traded, or is expected to be traded. Cooley is not on any blocks - that's just Ek blowing smoke. Good on Armstrong for getting the kid to commit - it's dollars and cents, the sooner he's in the show, the sooner he's earning. Plus he'll get dynamite amounts of opportunity in the desert.

The reality is Ottawa is going to have some potential issues coming in the next few years regarding player development. Either players are going to find room or they will eventually leave for nothing. They may still be NHL calibre players, just not good enough to crack the Senators.

I think Greig, Bernard-Docker, Kleven, Kastelik are all good to play on the Sens.

Lassi Thomson, Sokolov, Crookshank, Kelly, Guenette ..... its decision time.

Halliday, Jarventie, Boucher, Ostapchuk, Nordberg, Merilainen, Sogaard ... all have time to develop more.

Sobrengo, Smejkal, Mantinpalo ..... the jury is out still.

Don't sleep on the goalies Nikitin and Reidler.

I don't think any of the players have top 3 abilities (or top pairing d-men). Kleven and JBD are at best 4-6th d-men capabilities. Maybe a group of the forwards are 2nd or 3rd line in abilities (but we have Stutzle, Tkachuk, Norris, et al locked up long term so not an issue).

So "deconstruction" of the team as one person put it. Hardly. We have the talent to make the trades and sacrifice some draft capital if it means adding meaningful pieces like Cooley (if he is truly available .... and would be the big splash a new ownership group would love to make). I still think it will be a smaller splash with a player like Laughton to play on the 3rd line.

Sens are loaded with firepower. Six guys who have scored 30 goals recently and 2 more who have scored 20. They are really solid on the back. Plus they have made the team a lot bigger (physically). They are not really looking for anything other than being able to balance the books. Folks assume they should just move either Brannstrom or Joseph. My thought is they should move both those players plus add two first round picks and try to take back a top prospect on an entry level contract.

A strong case can be made for doing nothing. Every year the Sens have had a major injury early in the season and the issues of salary cap might be self regulating.
- spatso

Arizona is not trading Cooley to take on salary they don't want to pay for two later first round picks when Cooley was a 3rd overall pick just over a year ago. This trade of yours only makes sense for the Sens.

You can't possibly tell me that if you are the GM of Arizona, you would even consider this trade seriously.

The addition of Tarasenko is intriguing. There are a couple of possible scenarios that could result in fallout. The ugly one is that the Hockey Canada situation could mean a shake up to the roster but would alleviate cap issues.

The other is the possible movement of players taking up valuable cap room. Joseph immediately comes to mind. Brannstrom and Forsberg are other possible trade candidates. This was something that was likely being evaluated in any Debrincat brainstorming and shouldn’t be any different now.

I am not sure how smoothly Tarasenko will transition to this lineup. Natural right winger but shoots left. For powerplays, I am an advocate of having a good mix of left- and right-hand shots to help with creativity and minimize predictability. Will be interesting how things shape out.

The addition of Tarasenko is intriguing. There are a couple of possible scenarios that could result in fallout. The ugly one is that the Hockey Canada situation could mean a shake up to the roster but would alleviate cap issues.

The other is the possible movement of players taking up valuable cap room. Joseph immediately comes to mind. Brannstrom and Forsberg are other possible trade candidates. This was something that was likely being evaluated in any Debrincat brainstorming and shouldn’t be any different now.

I am not sure how smoothly Tarasenko will transition to this lineup. Natural right winger but shoots left. For powerplays, I am an advocate of having a good mix of left- and right-hand shots to help with creativity and minimize predictability. Will be interesting how things shape out.
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

Agreed re: Tarasenko - he's not necessarily an intuitive fit for a team that's preaching work ethic, but he should be able to help replace some of the lost scoring punch. Given the quality of the Senators' PP, I think it's reasonable to expect something like a 20G-40A scoring pace. He could also be a very interesting mentor for a young player like Sokolov. The cumulative effect of adding Tarasenko, Norris, Kubalik, and Sokolov to the lineup will also be interesting to watch, as it implies quite a bit more skill in the bottom-6 than has been present for quite some time.

The major question remains, though... how will the team accommodate this additional $5M AAV for the coming season? CapFriendly shows the Senators payroll now at $82.6M for the 2023/24 season, with just 10 forwards under contract and RFA deals still needed for both Pinto and Sokolov. Now, Sokolov could probably fit in still under the cap, as there's no reason for him to get more than $0.8M-$0.9M. But Pinto will be getting a more substantial deal, and it's now a clear matter of which player(s) it will come at the expense of. The short-list definitely includes Batherson, Forsberg, Joseph, and Brannstrom, but it's highly unclear whether those could be part of larger moves, or just a straight salary removal in order to get themselves under the $83.5M bar.

Agreed re: Tarasenko - he's not necessarily an intuitive fit for a team that's preaching work ethic, but he should be able to help replace some of the lost scoring punch. Given the quality of the Senators' PP, I think it's reasonable to expect something like a 20G-40A scoring pace. He could also be a very interesting mentor for a young player like Sokolov. The cumulative effect of adding Tarasenko, Norris, Kubalik, and Sokolov to the lineup will also be interesting to watch, as it implies quite a bit more skill in the bottom-6 than has been present for quite some time.

The major question remains, though... how will the team accommodate this additional $5M AAV for the coming season? CapFriendly shows the Senators payroll now at $82.6M for the 2023/24 season, with just 10 forwards under contract and RFA deals still needed for both Pinto and Sokolov. Now, Sokolov could probably fit in still under the cap, as there's no reason for him to get more than $0.8M-$0.9M. But Pinto will be getting a more substantial deal, and it's now a clear matter of which player(s) it will come at the expense of. The short-list definitely includes Batherson, Forsberg, Joseph, and Brannstrom, but it's highly unclear whether those could be part of larger moves, or just a straight salary removal in order to get themselves under the $83.5M bar.
- khawk

As part of a larger move by the Senators ........

Ottawa sends Batherson, Brannstrom, Joseph, Tompson, a first and a second round pick to Philly. Maybe kick in a Sokolov or Jarventie as well.
Philly sends Konecny and Laughton to Ottawa.

The classic, ‘two pieces of garbage and a second round pick for a good player’ is getting thrown around a lot here. It’s not going to happen. The name of the game is losing as little assets as possible to sign Pinto and stay under the cap.

Brannstrom has no value outside of Ottawa. He’s a 2mil third pairing defeneman who’s small and hasn’t lived up to potential. I think he’s changed his game to suit his spot and makes sense for Ottawa, but no team is a third pairing defender away from contending.

Joseph is a 3mil fourth liner and the only way you can move him is with a sweetner.

Batherson is in hockey Canada limbo and no team will touch him if there’s a chance he gets suspended (same with Formenton). If he does get suspended it solves the cap problem but leaves a hole that needs to be fixed.

Sokolov and Thompson are ‘C’ list prospects and not going to move the needle much. Either is a toss in.

If Forsberg is injured, that helps with cap, but hurts goalie depth.

Also keep in mind that everyone knows Ottawa needs to clear space for Pinto, so they’re less likely to help Dorion out and more likely to bend him over.

Best case scenario, Joseph and a second go for future considerations. The ‘trade’ becomes a second for Tarasenko and not having Joseph. I think given the leverage, that sadly becomes a first.

Ottawa is not getting Laughton or Konecny and certainly not Cooley without giving up actual assets (START with Grieg or Pinto). And even if you do get one of these guys back, you still need to fix the cap problem both now and in the future so it doesn’t make any sense.

The classic, ‘two pieces of garbage and a second round pick for a good player’ is getting thrown around a lot here. It’s not going to happen. The name of the game is losing as little assets as possible to sign Pinto and stay under the cap.

Brannstrom has no value outside of Ottawa. He’s a 2mil third pairing defeneman who’s small and hasn’t lived up to potential. I think he’s changed his game to suit his spot and makes sense for Ottawa, but no team is a third pairing defender away from contending.

Joseph is a 3mil fourth liner and the only way you can move him is with a sweetner.

Batherson is in hockey Canada limbo and no team will touch him if there’s a chance he gets suspended (same with Formenton). If he does get suspended it solves the cap problem but leaves a hole that needs to be fixed.

Sokolov and Thompson are ‘C’ list prospects and not going to move the needle much. Either is a toss in.

If Forsberg is injured, that helps with cap, but hurts goalie depth.

Also keep in mind that everyone knows Ottawa needs to clear space for Pinto, so they’re less likely to help Dorion out and more likely to bend him over.

Best case scenario, Joseph and a second go for future considerations. The ‘trade’ becomes a second for Tarasenko and not having Joseph. I think given the leverage, that sadly becomes a first.

Ottawa is not getting Laughton or Konecny and certainly not Cooley without giving up actual assets (START with Grieg or Pinto). And even if you do get one of these guys back, you still need to fix the cap problem both now and in the future so it doesn’t make any sense.
- CooCooKaChoo

A+.

I do not think the Sens need to do anything between now and training camp. They can sign Pinto to a fair contract. The small cap overage will be absorbed in the normal course of injuries and payroll adjustment. Lots of ways to move salary.

But I believe Dorion can do one more big deal.

If it were not for escrow, the cap this year would be $93.75m. ($6b/32x.50 = 93.75M)

Escrow is gone next year. So, are $5m in dead cap costs (Ryan, Murray, Del Zotto)

Tarasenko and Kubalik are on one year deals that could free another $7.5m. Giroux comes off the books ($6.5m) the following year.

Dorion has about $30m to work with. Chychrun $4.6m. and Sanderson .95m combined should cost about $11m. more on long term deals.

Dorion has the space to do one more blockbuster deal as long as he is able to effectively transition the added costs through this year. Watch him. I believe there is one more big deal coming (not Karlsson).

He is not afraid to pay the price and I think he will offer up both 1st round picks and/or prospects to give this team a chance to race the Devils to the finish line.

A+.

I do not think the Sens need to do anything between now and training camp. They can sign Pinto to a fair contract. The small cap overage will be absorbed in the normal course of injuries and payroll adjustment. Lots of ways to move salary.

But I believe Dorion can do one more big deal.
- spatso

This doesn’t make sense. They are at the cap and still need two more forwards. Pinto will be signed, but whatever he sogns for needs to be subtracted elsewhere.

I don’t see how Dorion can make even a decent hockey deal, let alone a ‘blockbuster’.

Maybe Forsberg is on the IR to start the season and that's how they get cap compliant with Pinto. Or maybe they out Joseph on waivers and dare someone to take him.

They have moves and should be in no hurry to make them.

Patience netted them Chychrun. Patience netted them Tarasenko at a reasonable rate.

Just need an improvement at the goaltending and coaching positions.

This doesn’t make sense. They are at the cap and still need two more forwards. Pinto will be signed, but whatever he sogns for needs to be subtracted elsewhere.

I don’t see how Dorion can make even a decent hockey deal, let alone a ‘blockbuster’.
- CooCooKaChoo

So, let's say strictly for the purpose of discussion we do the deal for a player that is long rumoured to want to be moved like Clayton Keller at $7.15m on the cap. It is a great long term contract.

How do you move out equivalent salary? If Pinto is part of the package you probably only need to find another $4m. I have no interest in dealing Pinto. But, the point remains. The Sens have the assets to pull off a blockbuster.

The Sens can do Kocecny or Laughton.

I think a deal is still combining.