Things don't always go the way you think. Take Chicago for instance, got rid of a good GM, then replaced him with an average one who went on to win three cups with the core that his predecessor built.

He wasn't bad in Calgary, especially when they made the playoffs (just barely half the time).

Management (Treliving and the coaches he hired) didn't utilize him properly.
- Rare_Jewel

(1) It isn't the GMs job to make the lines. I don't agree with his coaching hires, but it's up to the coaching staff to make those decisions. That said, he was given those opportunities to be "used properly".

(2) You have to play well enough to get to the playoffs. Sam Bennett didn't in the regular season. Go look at his numbers if you can be bothered - his actual goals for and against with linemates. When he played UP in the lineup, he was a negative to very negative player most of the time. When he played 3rd line he was a positive player. But Bennet sulked and publicly complained about not being in the top-6 regularly.

I would have liked him on the Leafs for a 2nd - that would have been a fair investment and we have a perennial hole on the left side. But Bennett would still have to be better than he was. Ultimately don't scapegoat management because Bennett half-assed his opportunities. I think he learned from getting traded to shut up and play.

word is he is looking at a big right handed shot D
Justin Holl
- senstroll

Poor Gigsy 😢

Brad Mutha(frank)er will build from the blue line👍

Schenn, Graves, Soucy or Mayfield
- mr.sir

The blueline is basically already built. Just need Schenn signed.

Unless Brodie or Gio are traded out or retire.

I think it was different for both Tavares and Guadreau.

Johnny Hockey said he wanted to go home and then when home wanted to sign him he said nah, lemme go to (frank)ing Columbus.

But with Tavares, I feel like he only decided to actually maybe leave the Island after they fired everyone he was loyal to (Snow and Weight). And even then it was a maybe. But he bought into what Dubas sold him.
- GreatGigInTheSky

I also think a bunch of the stuff in Calgary may actually have gone back to Sutter. No one liked playing for him - and Treliving didn't even want him. He may have been the poison pill.

(1) It isn't the GMs job to make the lines. I don't agree with his coaching hires, but it's up to the coaching staff to make those decisions. That said, he was given those opportunities to be "used properly".

(2) You have to play well enough to get to the playoffs. Sam Bennett didn't in the regular season. Go look at his numbers if you can be bothered - his actual goals for and against with linemates. When he played UP in the lineup, he was a negative to very negative player most of the time. When he played 3rd line he was a positive player. But Bennet sulked and publicly complained about not being in the top-6 regularly.

I would have liked him on the Leafs for a 2nd - that would have been a fair investment and we have a perennial hole on the left side. But Bennett would still have to be better than he was. Ultimately don't scapegoat management because Bennett half-assed his opportunities. I think he learned from getting traded to shut up and play.
- Monkeypunk

At that time, a 2nd rd pick for Bennett would have been a high price, he was a 25-35 point guy with Calgary.. That's why I find Rare's takes to be laughable, I bet he's laughing at himself too.

See, still happens to this day.

The Leafs are not in a position to play wait and see with this guy or this current situation. They've already made dozens of mistakes. A few more and it's rebuild time all over again.
- Rare_Jewel

No sense talking common sense with the excuse crew. You could hand them a bag of actual poop and they’d talk about where the poop came from and how great the smell of the poop is versus 30+ other piles of poop.

Sometimes insanity just can’t be fixed. Let them fester and plan new excuses in peace.

The blueline is basically already built. Just need Schenn signed.

Unless Brodie or Gio are traded out or retire.
- GreatGigInTheSky

Yes

As stated….
Schenn, Graves, Soucy or Mayfield

Poor Gigsy 😢
- mr.sir

Poor all of us.

Anyone who's a Leafs fan should look at that and cry tears of blood.

No sense talking common sense with the excuse crew. You could hand them a bag of actual poop and they’d talk about where the poop came from and how great the smell of the poop is versus 30+ other piles of poop.

Sometimes insanity just can’t be fixed. Let them fester and plan new excuses in peace.
- optimus-reim

Yeah, it's always good to just make random stuff up and claim it to be fact.

One thing we do know is that Treliving will build the team from the back end out.. A new and improved defense
- PatC80

I certainly hope so but he's also the guy who traded away Hamilton and Fox so, maybe he's not that good at building from the net out. He seems keen on trading his high scoring, skilled D. Maybe Rielly is packing his bags right now.

I hope he's smart enough to remember how good Hellebuyck is and to acquire him. I could hope a lot of things of this guy. I would hope and wish he does fantastic things but there simply isn't enough evidence or a strong enough track record of success to have a good foundation to believe in that hope.

The blueline is basically already built. Just need Schenn signed.

Unless Brodie or Gio are traded out or retire.
- GreatGigInTheSky

I think we need to plan for Gio to be a #7 this coming year. Let's see how he comes out of the gate. He was fabulous for most of the year but he just ran out of steam at the end. Age or fatigue? Had they managed his ice and opposition better would he have still been okay in the playoffs or were they just too much for him? I don't know. He's always been a smart defenseman and those guys learn how to cheat time a bit by knowing the game.

For me I am hoping for more Timmins.

I think we need to plan for Gio to be a #7 this coming year. Let's see how he comes out of the gate. He was fabulous for most of the year but he just ran out of steam at the end. Age or fatigue? Had they managed his ice and opposition better would he have still been okay in the playoffs or were they just too much for him? I don't know. He's always been a smart defenseman and those guys learn how to cheat time a bit by knowing the game.

For me I am hoping for more Timmins.
- Monkeypunk

Yes guy

Timmins is more of a scorer
I would pair him with a knuckle dragger

Stating the facts here. If you're laughing, it's at the Leafs and Treliving's incompetence.
- Rare_Jewel

The man just got hired and you're already poopting down his throat.

Who out there was better than Treliving? Certainly not Fedorov.

I certainly hope so but he's also the guy who traded away Hamilton and Fox so, maybe he's not that good at building from the net out. He seems keen on trading his high scoring, skilled D. Maybe Rielly is packing his bags right now.

I hope he's smart enough to remember how good Hellebuyck is and to acquire him. I could hope a lot of things of this guy. I would hope and wish he does fantastic things but there simply isn't enough evidence or a strong enough track record of success to have a good foundation to believe in that hope.
- Rare_Jewel

Again, you're doing it wrong..

Adam Fox didn't want to be in Calgary, there were reports that he wouldn't sign with the Flames and Hamilton was part of the deal that same deal that brought in Elias Lindholm, you know, the guy that's been really good in Calgary.

I also think a bunch of the stuff in Calgary may actually have gone back to Sutter. No one liked playing for him - and Treliving didn't even want him. He may have been the poison pill.
- Monkeypunk

For sure. It makes sense.

I was hoping for fresh blood as GM, but of all the names of the old heads (that I didn't want), Treliving was on top of them.

Pridham or Tulsky was my hope for GM, and I've said that if Shanahigan wanted an experienced guy, like Treliving, make him the AGM to the new blood.

word is he is looking at a big right handed shot D
Justin Holl is not on that list
- senstroll

(1) It isn't the GMs job to make the lines. I don't agree with his coaching hires, but it's up to the coaching staff to make those decisions. That said, he was given those opportunities to be "used properly".

(2) You have to play well enough to get to the playoffs. Sam Bennett didn't in the regular season. Go look at his numbers if you can be bothered - his actual goals for and against with linemates. When he played UP in the lineup, he was a negative to very negative player most of the time. When he played 3rd line he was a positive player. But Bennet sulked and publicly complained about not being in the top-6 regularly.

I would have liked him on the Leafs for a 2nd - that would have been a fair investment and we have a perennial hole on the left side. But Bennett would still have to be better than he was. Ultimately don't scapegoat management because Bennett half-assed his opportunities. I think he learned from getting traded to shut up and play.
- Monkeypunk

Completely disagree.

Management was stupid to throw him into the NHL at such a young age. They set back his development years. Not too different than how the Leafs ruined Schenn for a few years at the beginning. Expected too much, too quick.

Management also hired pretty much every coach he played for in Calgary and discusses the roles of players which Treliving repeatedly failed at. He created a poor environment and the results speak for themselves.

Bennett was a good playoff performer for the Flames, considering his age and his role. He stepped up when the games mattered most and if Treliving had a brain, he'd keep that type of player. Maybe he'd be getting that benefit instead of Florida right now.

The man just got hired and you're already poopting down his throat.

Who out there was better than Treliving? Certainly not Fedorov.
- dmnted

Dale Tallon. No contest.

Again, you're doing it wrong..

Adam Fox didn't want to be in Calgary, there were reports that he wouldn't sign with the Flames and Hamilton was part of the deal that same deal that brought in Elias Lindholm, you know, the guy that's been really good in Calgary.
- PatC80

Lindholm had one good season and fell off a cliff this year. Bad management, bad results. Seems to be a lot of players that didn't want to play under Treliving's regime.

Yes

As stated….
Schenn, Graves, Soucy or Mayfield
- mr.sir

I can't see him overhauling it too much right away.

Rielly, Liljegren, and McCabe are going nowhere and nor should they. Timmins should be given a legit shot at playing time next season.

That basically leaves trading Brodie because I don't think Gio is gonna retire.

The blueline is basically already built. Just need Schenn signed.

Unless Brodie or Gio are traded out or retire.
- GreatGigInTheSky

both could happen but the Leafs would be on the hook for Gio's 800k.
granted it's not much of a cap hit but still a cap hit for a player not on the team playing

I certainly hope so but he's also the guy who traded away Hamilton and Fox so, maybe he's not that good at building from the net out. He seems keen on trading his high scoring, skilled D. Maybe Rielly is packing his bags right now.

I hope he's smart enough to remember how good Hellebuyck is and to acquire him. I could hope a lot of things of this guy. I would hope and wish he does fantastic things but there simply isn't enough evidence or a strong enough track record of success to have a good foundation to believe in that hope.
- Rare_Jewel

He had no choice on Fox. Fox had no intention of signing with Calgary. He was simply thrown in to Carolina as a part of the deal - because Carolina knew they could flip him for picks, but it didn't stop them from trying to sign him, too.

Hamilton, I never fully loved that deal - but Lindholm and Hanifin combined made them better. In fact I think Hamilton has always been a bit hyped and this year was probably the first time he's really stepped up to be worth the hype and money he's received.

I'm with you - I hope they find a move to acquire Hellebuyck. I love the guy. You put a top-5 team in front of him and he'll respond.

I certainly hope so but he's also the guy who traded away Hamilton and Fox so, maybe he's not that good at building from the net out. He seems keen on trading his high scoring, skilled D. Maybe Rielly is packing his bags right now.

I hope he's smart enough to remember how good Hellebuyck is and to acquire him. I could hope a lot of things of this guy. I would hope and wish he does fantastic things but there simply isn't enough evidence or a strong enough track record of success to have a good foundation to believe in that hope.
- Rare_Jewel

Fox said it was the Rangers or nowhere for him and it seemed like Dougie Hamilton also wanted out of Calgary or his "teammates" wanted nothing to do with him.

Can't really blame him for that.

Lindholm had one good season and fell off a cliff this year. Bad management, bad results. Seems to be a lot of players that didn't want to play under Treliving's regime.
- Rare_Jewel

Treliving or Sutter?