Ya I dont get the "temper tantrum" angle either.
- Fakepartofme

Jones hit it on the head.

Projecting their anger about this team into fantasy scenarios.

It is funny but it is going to get old very fast.

You domt think the Leafs have always had skill coaches? Youre def wrong on that. As example, kaating coach Paul Matheson, that you point out, was preceded by barb underhill, i beleive, and that was wayyyyy before dubas. Theyve had skill coaches for dexades. The leafs have been working on using financial leverage for a long time (trying to gain advantages that they lost becausenof cap). The centre for excellence they built, all that stuff, its been going in That direction a long time.
- prock

First of all, are you typing with winter mittens on?

Anyway, you're also not fully reading to get to your counterargument because it says this, "oversaw the expansion of a skill development program".

Yes we did have skill coaches, but integrating that with sports science, greater skill development coaching and programs and so on.

The other thing is - and this isn't all on Dubas, it really starts with Shanahan - is that they started to use their financial clout in areas surrounding the cap to give them greater benefits that they had not been previously using - so the allocation of ancillary resources has really grown in the past decade in the development of these programs.

They mentioned this in the presser. He has restrictions on this years draft and made not have influence on it. Brenden said they have full trust in their Head scout and team and the work they've done for the draft.
Dubas may have the same type of restriction. May have.
- Fakepartofme

Typically it's why these guys have contracts that extend out to July 1. Dubas very much should have the same caveat because despite being fired he was still under contract until July 1.

The Shanny having a temper tantrum is the one that is getting me the most

To be fair its only a select few on here...but yeah thats it.
- Santo_44

Realistically fans of other teams will always focus on bashing the Leafs. With dubas gone, theyre shifting focus. After years of bashing dubas, they have to shift from him being terrible, to him being great, and they do that by shifting blame and mocking to shanahan. Thats where you get stories about the GM not having real control.

If shanahan were to leave tomorrow, he would suddenly get a pass and we would be told hes amazing and he was inly operating under ownership control.

I'm gonna blow more than your mind in a minute.
- gravyface

It won't even take 30 seconds 😃

First of all, are you typing with winter mittens on?

Anyway, you're also not fully reading to get to your counterargument because it says this, "oversaw the expansion of a skill development program".

Yes we did have skill coaches, but integrating that with sports science, greater skill development coaching and programs and so on.

The other thing is - and this isn't all on Dubas, it really starts with Shanahan - is that they started to use their financial clout in areas surrounding the cap to give them greater benefits that they had not been previously using - so the allocation of ancillary resources has really grown in the past decade in the development of these programs.
- Monkeypunk

Im on a phone, and not going back to correct stuff.. who cares?

But the rest is my point. I have a hard time giving credit for establishing expanding scouti g, medical staff, skills coaching. The leafs have been working in this direction for 15ish years. I recall about 15 years ago, in the Sundin era, the Leafs perenially led the league in injuries. They assembled a huge medical team. Built state of the art oractice facilities and gyms. Theyve been POURING money into everything they can, because they cant pour it into player payroll.

Not only is this not a Dubas thing, its not even a Leaf thing, its an MLSE thing. Its happening with Raps and TFC too.

I have a hard time giving dubas piles of credit for taking the financial clout of the Leafs, and using it like the organization wants it used.

Hes done a decent job as GM, but lets not pretend hes transformed the team into some well operating juggernaut. Thats just not true.

Ya I dont get the "temper tantrum" angle either.
- Fakepartofme

It was a negotiation on both sides. Dubas wanted something that Shanahan and the Noard weren’t prepared to give. Dubas didn’t overplay his hand. He asked for what he wanted. Shanny didn’t have a temper tantrum. He said no.

This is entertaining.

People were up in arms when Dubas was hired.

I seriously can't understand the level of complaining and the somehow in depth knowledge of what has gone on behind the scenes.
- Santo_44

No matter what happens there will be moaning that theyre doing something stupid. Id bet that most of the people conplaining that dubas was let go are the same ones complaining he was hired in the first place. Theyll scream that Treliving is a terrible hire.... until the day he too is no longer GM, then they will scream about how stupid itnis hes gone.

Good riddance to the overrated Kyle Dubas. Hope he finds a way for Keefe to join him.
- Strider

It would be amusing if the Pens won the Cup with that combo.

No matter what happens there will be moaning that theyre doing something stupid. Id bet that most of the people conplaining that dubas was let go are the same ones complaining he was hired in the first place. Theyll scream that Treliving is a terrible hire.... until the day he too is no longer GM, then they will scream about how stupid itnis hes gone.
- prock

Yup, some fanatics need something to complain about.

It would be amusing if the Pens won the Cup with that combo.


- mjones242

Honestly, The Pens are one of the last teams I would choose to win a cup in the next 3 years.

You domt think the Leafs have always had skill coaches? Youre def wrong on that. As example, kaating coach Paul Matheson, that you point out, was preceded by barb underhill, i beleive, and that was wayyyyy before dubas. Theyve had skill coaches for dexades. The leafs have been working on using financial leverage for a long time (trying to gain advantages that they lost becausenof cap). The centre for excellence they built, all that stuff, its been going in That direction a long time.
- prock

It literally specifies his integration of processes which intertwined departments and utilized them differently.

The bus is like 4 stops ahead and you're still waiting for it my friend.

I think he makes a splash on the backend.
- Fakepartofme

i think he goes out and gets some holes filled👍

new blog everyone

i think he goes out and gets some holes filled👍
- Skalapy

Oh poop yeah

It literally specifies his integration of processes which intertwined departments and utilized them differently.

The bus is like 4 stops ahead and you're still waiting for it my friend.
- joel878

Nah, there are just some that will try proclaim he performed magic, and complain he (or anyone else) is gone, no matter what. I think thats the bus youre on.

End result, he was given a LOT to work with. Arguably more than any other incoming GM in recent NHL history, in terms of young top roster players, prospect depth, organizational resources, and funding to do what he wanted, and didnt really do anything spectacular.

Nah, there are just some that will try proclaim he performed magic, and complain he (or anyone else) is gone, no matter what. I think thats the bus youre on.

End result, he was given a LOT to work with. Arguably more than any other incoming GM in recent NHL history, in terms of young top roster players, prospect depth, organizational resources, and funding to do what he wanted, and didnt really do anything spectacular.
- prock

It's not magic, he just did a lot of work to organization structure where as it was specifically mentioned these processes didn't exist and departments were siloed during the Lou era.

It's a matter of calling it what it is and it make him a quality candidate for a team president role. Your inability to understand that does not discredit the work.

"any jobs".

I really don't give a poop either way. I'm pretty much stay or go for any GM. They all make mistakes, they all make good moves... so much of it is out of their control on the ice that they really can't do much else.

Now if KD didn't have authority like a GM should, I think that's reason enough for him to move on.
- gravyface

I'm willing to bet that a GM with the powers you believe a GM should have, that isn't also a president with full reign given by ownership, no consultation required, does not actually exist.

It's not magic, he just did a lot of work to organization structure where as it was specifically mentioned these processes didn't exist and departments were siloed during the Lou era.

It's a matter of calling it what it is and it make him a quality candidate for a team president role. Your inability to understand that does not discredit the work.
- joel878

Ultimately hes just a GM that was given piles to work with, and came up with mediocre results. No amount of your organizational processes will change that.