Dubas “I would consider anything with our group that would allow us a better to win the Stanley Cup. I would take nothing off the table.” Points to Florida example.

Shanny to core: don’t worry guys
- Canada Cup

Yeah I think there is less of a chance they get traded now.

With the cap space the new GM has I would imagine he wants to see how he can surround this core over trading one.

It won't be off the table obviously...but its doubtful a winning trade will be there.

JT can sign a new deal in exactly 13 months...I think they have an idea and I think he takes less than he is worth. I think the new GM sees a position to add and not lose out on 3 high end players.

Going to bump this as my deadline tomorrow approaches. Sorry to spam but it's for a good cause. Sincere gratitude to those who contributed. Blessings to you and yours, and may God bless the Toronto Maple Leafs.

This Sunday I am participating in the Baycrest Ride For Brain Health to raise funds for Baycrest Hospital's fight against dementia and continuing care of patients afflicted by it.

If like myself and Mz Z you have lost relatives to dementia you know it is horrible. If you'd like to support my fundraising you can do so here, and receive a tax receipt.

https://baycrestbikeforbr...hange.ca/16201/page/68486

Thanks from your Leafy friend Z (Rob)
- Zezel
- Zezel

It won’t open now Z

link is not working
- dmnted

thanks dmnted, I fixed it in my last post

should be:

https://baycrestbikeforbr...hange.ca/16201/page/68486

Yeah I think there is less of a chance they get traded now.

With the cap space the new GM has I would imagine he wants to see how he can surround this core over trading one.

It won't be off the table obviously...but its doubtful a winning trade will be there.

JT can sign a new deal in exactly 13 months...I think they have an idea and I think he takes less than he is worth. I think the new GM sees a position to add and not lose out on 3 high end players.
- Santo_44

My take on the Dubas situation is this: He overpaid his younger core players, when he should have done bridge deals instead. We wouldn't be having this conversation and reupping of contracts, because the core would be in the middle and not at the end of their first big contracts. My opinion is: Dubas was too close to his core players and wanted to shield and coddle them. I would like them to stay, but their contract demands are going to cause one, if not two to move on. Are any of them really worth top dollar going forward, considering that they've really won nothing in the playoffs? The structure of the team also was derelict of building a great defense and only had Rielly and some mediocre defensive pairings. The Leafs haven't had any stud defensemen since the days of Kaberle and McCabe. The Leafs were always built for a run and gun style and that doesn't translate into a playoff winning recipe. Kyle Dubas came in as an analytics guru but never grasped the idea of players that oozed leadership and elevating their game through passion and drive. No, I'm fine with Dubas going elsewhere.

Was going to propose a Marner trade to the Ducks for #2 pick and Gibson. Went to look at who else they have on defence (that we'd want), and would be prepared to throw in to make the salary work, and....nothing.
Besides RFA's, and young'ens they be dumb to trade, they don't have a single defence-man outside of Cam Fowler making more than $1M.
So Anaheims out, who else can we trade Marner to?

My take on the Dubas situation is this: He overpaid his younger core players, when he should have done bridge deals instead. We wouldn't be having this conversation and reupping of contracts, because the core would be in the middle and not at the end of their first big contracts. My opinion is: Dubas was too close to his core players and wanted to shield and coddle them. I would like them to stay, but their contract demands are going to cause one, if not two to move on. Are any of them really worth top dollar going forward, considering that they've really won nothing in the playoffs? The structure of the team also was derelict of building a great defense and only had Rielly and some mediocre defensive pairings. The Leafs haven't had any stud defensemen since the days of Kaberle and McCabe. The Leafs were always built for a run and gun style and that doesn't translate into a playoff winning recipe. Kyle Dubas came in as an analytics guru but never grasped the idea of players that oozed leadership and elevating their game through passion and drive. No, I'm fine with Dubas going elsewhere.
- PrinceLH

Covid situation and the flat cap wasn't his fault, those contracts would have been fine.

Shanny said when he got here the biggest issue in the past has been Leafs not sticking to a plan so I don't think that was the issue here either.

Also the D produced results, I don't know what else to tell you.


Shanny was open why they let him go, it wasn't results driven. Although more success would have shielded him from this.

Was going to propose a Marner trade to the Ducks for #2 pick and Gibson. Went to look at who else they have on defence (that we'd want), and would be prepared to throw in to make the salary work, and....nothing.
Besides RFA's, and young'ens they be dumb to trade, they don't have a single defence-man outside of Cam Fowler making more than $1M.
So Anaheims out, who else can we trade Marner to?
- oldstyle

why do people want Gibson?
he hasnt had a good season since 2018-19

Dubas was let go because he wanted full autonomy not because he waffled on his Core 4 strategy.

My point is that it was cute that he suddenly, after all of his "we can and we will" assurances that the Core 4 would remain intact, decides that "nothing is off the table." Yeah, okay, bud.

I sincerely doubt that about face played into Shanny's decision at all, but it was amusing to see Dubas finally realize that maybe hitching his wagon was potentially not the best strategy moving forward.
- mjones242

Apparently he just wanted a line to the board so he wouldn't need to jump through hoops, just to get a response.





That second one should piss everyone off. 3 (frank)ing days and the Leafs missed out on a top D. Incredible from the Board. Just incredible.

Did Johnny Toews ever say he was retiring?

I could now see Nylander moving to Washington, now that Spencer Carbury has become head coach in Washington. With Rasmus Sandin already over there, there might be an opportunity to get Tom Wilson in exchange. There might be some other small nuances to the trade, a pick or a fringe player going this way, but it's doable. Nylander is going to be wanting a hefty increase, due to his 40 goal, 80+ point season. My take on Nylander is: That may have been his career year. He's probably at the apex of his productive career. Locking him up long term puts you in a Tavares scenario where by year 5 or 6 his contract is an overpay. Leafs are in a win now window and a Tom Wilson riding shotgun makes the Leafs more difficult to play against. Get O'Reilly, Schenn and Accari under contract and make the Leafs difficult to play against. If the Leafs would have had Wilson on the team, against Florida, Sam Bennett wouldn't have gotten away with mugging Matthew Knies.

why do people want Gibson?
he hasnt had a good season since 2018-19
- senstroll

My take on the Dubas situation is this: He overpaid his younger core players, when he should have done bridge deals instead. We wouldn't be having this conversation and reupping of contracts, because the core would be in the middle and not at the end of their first big contracts. My opinion is: Dubas was too close to his core players and wanted to shield and coddle them. I would like them to stay, but their contract demands are going to cause one, if not two to move on. Are any of them really worth top dollar going forward, considering that they've really won nothing in the playoffs? The structure of the team also was derelict of building a great defense and only had Rielly and some mediocre defensive pairings. The Leafs haven't had any stud defensemen since the days of Kaberle and McCabe. The Leafs were always built for a run and gun style and that doesn't translate into a playoff winning recipe. Kyle Dubas came in as an analytics guru but never grasped the idea of players that oozed leadership and elevating their game through passion and drive. No, I'm fine with Dubas going elsewhere.
- PrinceLH

Have you not paid attention to any move he made in the last, like, 3 years? Because he did exactly that multiple times.

Covid situation and the flat cap wasn't his fault, those contracts would have been fine.

Shanny said when he got here the biggest issue in the past has been Leafs not sticking to a plan so I don't think that was the issue here either.

Also the D produced results, I don't know what else to tell you.


Shanny was open why they let him go, it wasn't results driven. Although more success would have shielded him from this.
- Santo_44

The Bridge deals would have protected the Leafs, when Covid struck.

why do people want Gibson?
he hasnt had a good season since 2018-19
- senstroll

Why do people want to trade Marner?

I could now see Nylander moving to Washington, now that Spencer Carbury has become head coach in Washington. With Rasmus Sandin already over there, there might be an opportunity to get Tom Wilson in exchange. There might be some other small nuances to the trade, a pick or a fringe player going this way, but it's doable. Nylander is going to be wanting a hefty increase, due to his 40 goal, 80+ point season. My take on Nylander is: That may have been his career year. He's probably at the apex of his productive career. Locking him up long term puts you in a Tavares scenario where by year 5 or 6 his contract is an overpay. Leafs are in a win now window and a Tom Wilson riding shotgun makes the Leafs more difficult to play against. Get O'Reilly, Schenn and Accari under contract and make the Leafs difficult to play against. If the Leafs would have had Wilson on the team, against Florida, Sam Bennett wouldn't have gotten away with mugging Matthew Knies.
- PrinceLH

Seeing how Nylander >> Wilson, I sure as poop would hope it'd be a big thing coming back, not a small thing.

Have you not paid attention to any move he made in the last, like, 3 years? Because he did exactly that multiple times.
- GreatGigInTheSky

His drafting record and unwillingness to trade out of season for the players that he needed made this team timid.

The Bridge deals would have protected the Leafs, when Covid struck.
- PrinceLH

Dubas signed them pre covid, I do not blame Dubas for not predicting covid.

Apparently he just wanted a line to the board so he wouldn't need to jump through hoops, just to get a response.





That second one should piss everyone off. 3 (frank)ing days and the Leafs missed out on a top D. Incredible from the Board. Just incredible.
- GreatGigInTheSky

He did all of this finagling over money and power at the last second, after they had gone through extensive discussion and negotiation. All this after also saying he might not really be into the job, as well. Might he have had a plan b in his pocket by that point? Whatever the case, to drop TWO new parameters into the discussion at that point in the process - at the end of a whole year - would piss off most bosses.

See ya, Kyle.

Apparently he just wanted a line to the board so he wouldn't need to jump through hoops, just to get a response.





That second one should piss everyone off. 3 (frank)ing days and the Leafs missed out on a top D. Incredible from the Board. Just incredible.
- GreatGigInTheSky

I'd like to know which defenceman, at what cap hit, and at what cost before I decide which irrationally polarized (Shanny or Dubas) side to take.

Was going to propose a Marner trade to the Ducks for #2 pick and Gibson. Went to look at who else they have on defence (that we'd want), and would be prepared to throw in to make the salary work, and....nothing.
Besides RFA's, and young'ens they be dumb to trade, they don't have a single defence-man outside of Cam Fowler making more than $1M.
So Anaheims out, who else can we trade Marner to?
- oldstyle

Sorry, but can we please move on from Gibson.
Hes just not worth it.

Seeing how Nylander >> Wilson, I sure as poop would hope it'd be a big thing coming back, not a small thing.
- GreatGigInTheSky

At the end of last year, would you have traded Austin Matthews or Mitch Marner for Matthew Tkachuk? I'm guessing the fanbase would have been 99% saying no. Today? I'm guessing 60% would say yes.

Sorry, but can we please move on from Gibson.
Hes just not worth it.
- Fakepartofme

Leafs goaltending is fine. No need for another washed up goaltender. We have two good young goaltenders in Sammy and the Great Woll.

why do people want Gibson?
he hasnt had a good season since 2018-19
- senstroll

Purely the team in front causing his terrible results.

I think he's overpaid and just another gamble similar to Murray. Don't know why people who don't like the goalie gamble also want Gibson. Gibson the Goalie Gamble. (Nice alliteration Skalapy)

Dubas signed them pre covid, I do not blame Dubas for not predicting covid.
- Santo_44

Both WN and MM signed 6 year deals, which is fine. doesnt bother me, I just wish AM signed an 8 year deal

He did all of this finagling over money and power at the last second, after they had gone through extensive discussion and negotiation. Might he have had a plan b in his pocket by that point? Whatever the case, to drop TWO new parameters into the discussion at that point in the process - at the end of a whole year - would piss off most bosses.

See ya, Kyle.
- fifty__missions

Incredibly (frank)ing stupid to get rid of the best GM this team has arguably ever had, over the course of 5 days, all because he asked for better poop. Not just for himself, but to help the team.

If they were planning to walk from him, then yeah, ok. But they planned on giving him a 5 year deal.

Only an idiot can think Shanahan came out of this looking like the good guy that isn't acting on hurt emotions.