I keep hearing Treliving as the front runner to replace Dubas.

I don't think that's an upgrade.

There are worse choices out there though.
- Scabeh

happy to be wrong, but I dont get it.

treeliving has more experience, yes..but more at achieving nothing... pretty much the same resume as Dubas..but longer

Thank you for helping to prove my point. None of that suggest or proves that Shanny is a moron.
Lou was interim, he wasnt staying long, just long enough to help clean up and then a fresh pov was going to be brought in. Dubas was a young up and coming GM, it was a risk but it wasnt a moronic move to sign him.
Babcock was highly regarded as a coach and was hailed as exactly what the leafs needed at that time....by everyone! He got the leafs to over 100pts in a reg a season. After a few years, things changed and they had to move on from him and they did. Nothing moronic about that.
Hunter, well I wasnt a big fan of his either, but he had a good rep around the hockey community.
Signing Tavares was the biggest FA get for the leafs or any team really. A young superstar in his prime, sure he was overpaid, but he was paid less than what others were offering and had covid not occurred (not Shanny's fault either) and the cap continued to rise, the contract wouldnt have been so bad in year 6 and 7. Definitely not a moronic move.
By all accounts, Dubas tried to play Shanny and the leafs, Shanny wasnt gonna play so he moved on. Not a moronic move.
Now, if he hires Chia or Bergevin as the new GM, in my opinion, that would be a moronic move. But again, that would only be my immediate opinion, who knows what the results would be in that alternate timeline.

Im not a huge Shanny supporter, but nothing you've said suggest he is a moron.
- Fakepartofme

That's your take of it. Being the driver of a bus that's gone nowhere and consistently hiring the cart before the horse, is to me, a moron.

Kind of to be expected from someone who's most comparable experience was head of DOPS. Can you imagine George Parros in his position? I'm positive it wouldn't take long to label him as a moron either.

I wonder if a deal with the Islander that is centered around Dobson and Nylander can come together.

I keep hearing Treliving as the front runner to replace Dubas.

I don't think that's an upgrade.

There are worse choices out there though.
- Scabeh

The biggest problem I have is that I would like progressive thinking and approaches in the GM office. You don't see that from the 'experienced' names out there. The hard part of moving on from Dubas is keeping that type of thinking going with the names being bandied about.

I keep hearing Treliving as the front runner to replace Dubas.

I don't think that's an upgrade.

There are worse choices out there though.
- Scabeh

I don't think the Leafs need "an upgrade" from a GM perspective. What they need is a different approach instead of stubbornly running back the same Core 4 again with re-arranged deck chairs.

happy to be wrong, but I dont get it.

treeliving has more experience, yes..but more at achieving nothing... pretty much the same resume as Dubas..but longer
- senstroll

Well there's issues with this I think. In sports teams generally fire GM's when things don't work out so Dubas not being resigned is par for the course in that regard. However, if GMs didn't get so attached to "their players" maybe they would keep their jobs longer.

Well there's issues with this I think. In sports teams generally fire GM's when things don't work out so Dubas not being resigned is par for the course in that regard. However, if GMs didn't get so attached to "their players" maybe they would keep their jobs longer.
- Aaron_85

Billy Beane was a good example of this -

I can’t be their buddies - I gotta trade them, cut them- send them down without hesitation if it makes the team better -

That's your take of it. Being the driver of a bus that's gone nowhere and consistently hiring the cart before the horse, is to me, a moron.

Kind of to be expected from someone who's most comparable experience was head of DOPS. Can you imagine George Parros in his position? I'm positive it wouldn't take long to label him as a moron either.
- joel878

Hiring Lou for a temporary 3-year stint was a good move - it provided a mentor to inexperienced AGMs (Hunter and Dubas).

Hiring Babs was also a good move... that didn't quite pan out as hoped for.

I really feel like the team was in very good shape with the Core 4 but then got absolutely (frank)ed with the frozen cap. The Core 4 was never meant to take up 50% of the cap space year-on-year. It was a fatal flaw that could not have been foreseen.

Did he handle the Dubas situation at the end of this season with panache? Nope, it was an unnecessary circus that was bungled. But... I think Dubas overplayed his hand too and poisoned the well. On this last point, Shanny should have sat on the negotiation longer if only to minimize the potential negative optics.

Having said that, I'm sure Shanny is on super thin ice with the execs. He will have to consider his next move very, very carefully.

Hopefully, it works out.

I don't think the Leafs need "an upgrade" from a GM perspective. What they need is a different approach instead of stubbornly running back the same Core 4 again with re-arranged deck chairs.
- mjones242

Dubas “I would consider anything with our group that would allow us a better to win the Stanley Cup. I would take nothing off the table.” Points to Florida example.

Shanny to core: don’t worry guys

Well there's issues with this I think. In sports teams generally fire GM's when things don't work out so Dubas not being resigned is par for the course in that regard. However, if GMs didn't get so attached to "their players" maybe they would keep their jobs longer.
- Aaron_85

the thing is, Dubas not coming back does not feel like it has anything to do with stubbornness and not trading the teams good players.

and it sounds like the opposite so far, that KD was looking at making changes, but was not ok'd on everything.

hard to know the truth. its just guess work. But its not like KD trading or a new GM trading the core = immediate success and its that simple.

Trade Nylander and win a cup.. why didnt Dubas think of that

Billy Beane was a good example of this -

I can’t be their buddies - I gotta trade them, cut them- send them down without hesitation if it makes the team better -
- dozerD10

also never won anything...if thats the measuring stick here

Dubas “I would consider anything with our group that would allow us a better to win the Stanley Cup. I would take nothing off the table.” Points to Florida example.

Shanny to core: don’t worry guys
- Canada Cup

Dubas, of "we can and we will", didn't want to trade any of the Core 4 until he finally realized he should consider trading any of the Core 4.

Also, what else should Shanny say? "Hey guys, buckle up... could be your last ride."

Dubas, of "we can and we will", didn't want to take anything off the table until he finally realized he should consider taking things off the table.

Also, what else should Shanny say? "Hey guys, buckle up... could be your last ride."
- mjones242

If I was a professional hockey player, I'd expect that things can change and trades can happen.

Especially when a new GM comes along, changes will happen. It's the same in any job really.

the thing is, Dubas not coming back does not feel like it has anything to do with stubbornness and not trading the teams good players.

and it sounds like the opposite so far, that KD was looking at making changes, but was not ok'd on everything.

hard to know the truth. its just guess work. But its not like KD trading or a new GM trading the core = immediate success and its that simple.

Trade Nylander and win a cup.. why didnt Dubas think of that
- senstroll

I'm talking a little more general. I don't know specifics enough for Dubas situation to comment if he did/would move a core guy.

Dubas, of "we can and we will", didn't want to trade any of the Core 4 until he finally realized he should consider trading any of the Core 4.

Also, what else should Shanny say? "Hey guys, buckle up... could be your last ride."
- mjones242

Dubas let go for stubbornly refusing to trade core days after he says he would consider trading them a day before the guy who let him go assures those guys they won’t be moved.

Hiring Lou for a temporary 3-year stint was a good move - it provided a mentor to inexperienced AGMs (Hunter and Dubas).

Hiring Babs was also a good move... that didn't quite pan out as hoped for.

I really feel like the team was in very good shape with the Core 4 but then got absolutely (frank)ed with the frozen cap. The Core 4 was never meant to take up 50% of the cap space year-on-year. It was a fatal flaw that could not have been foreseen.

Did he handle the Dubas situation at the end of this season with panache? Nope, it was an unnecessary circus that was bungled. But... I think Dubas overplayed his hand too and poisoned the well. On this last point, Shanny should have sat on the negotiation longer if only to minimize the potential negative optics.

Having said that, I'm sure Shanny is on super thin ice with the execs. He will have to consider his next move very, very carefully.

Hopefully, it works out.
- mjones242

The funny thing about the Lou hiring was he wanted an extension to his contract and wanted to stay in Toronto. He was pretty upset when they let him go.

Shanahan has fired everyone he's hired to this point in a meaningful position. Definitely in the hot seat now. He's been here for 9 years. No way was his original scorched earth plan supposed to be a 15 year plan. Likely 5 to 10 and he's at the end of it with 1 second round visit.

Oh just realized after reading the CBJ blog, we get a first ever champion team this year. Either Florida or Vegas.

That's kind of neat. Now the Canucks will have less cupless friends.

Going to bump this as my deadline tomorrow approaches. Sorry to spam but it's for a good cause. Sincere gratitude to those who contributed. Blessings to you and yours, and may God bless the Toronto Maple Leafs.

This Sunday I am participating in the Baycrest Ride For Brain Health to raise funds for Baycrest Hospital's fight against dementia and continuing care of patients afflicted by it.

If like myself and Mz Z you have lost relatives to dementia you know it is horrible. If you'd like to support my fundraising you can do so here, and receive a tax receipt.

https://baycrestbikeforbr...hange.ca/16201/page/68486

Thanks from your Leafy friend Z (Rob)
- Zezel

Oh just realized after reading the CBJ blog, we get a first ever champion team this year. Either Florida or Vegas.

That's kind of neat. Now the Canucks will have less cupless friends.
- Aaron_85

Lets go Florida
Ugh

Lets go Florida
Ugh
- Fakepartofme

For sure. (frank) Vegas.

also never won anything...if thats the measuring stick here
- senstroll

Chia won a cup...so

Going to bump this as my deadline tomorrow approaches. Sorry to spam but it's for a good cause. Sincere gratitude to those who contributed. Blessings to you and yours, and may God bless the Toronto Maple Leafs.

This Sunday I am participating in the Baycrest Ride For Brain Health to raise funds for Baycrest Hospital's fight against dementia and continuing care of patients afflicted by it.

If like myself and Mz Z you have lost relatives to dementia you know it is horrible. If you'd like to support my fundraising you can do so here, and receive a tax receipt.

https://baycrestbikeforbr...hange.ca/16201/page/68486

Thanks from your Leafy friend Z (Rob)
- Zezel
- Zezel

Leaves Leefs
- senstroll

Going to bump this as my deadline tomorrow approaches. Sorry to spam but it's for a good cause. Sincere gratitude to those who contributed. Blessings to you and yours, and may God bless the Toronto Maple Leafs.

This Sunday I am participating in the Baycrest Ride For Brain Health to raise funds for Baycrest Hospital's fight against dementia and continuing care of patients afflicted by it.

If like myself and Mz Z you have lost relatives to dementia you know it is horrible. If you'd like to support my fundraising you can do so here, and receive a tax receipt.

https://baycrestbikeforbr...hange.ca/16201/page/68486

Thanks from your Leafy friend Z (Rob)
- Zezel
- Zezel

link is not working

Dubas let go for stubbornly refusing to trade core days after he says he would consider trading them a day before the guy who let him go assures those guys they won’t be moved.
- Canada Cup

Dubas was let go because he wanted full autonomy not because he waffled on his Core 4 strategy.

My point is that it was cute that he suddenly, after all of his "we can and we will" assurances that the Core 4 would remain intact, decides that "nothing is off the table." Yeah, okay, bud.

I sincerely doubt that about face played into Shanny's decision at all, but it was amusing to see Dubas finally realize that maybe hitching his wagon was potentially not the best strategy moving forward.