I don't like him rescinding the offer - as I said, to me it's a bad faith move - but he is the president. They report to him. He has to have that authority.
- Monkeypunk

The president is not very good, but he's quite good at getting people to look the other way. Sure he just had a 15 minute press conference dedicated to it.

"This decision should cast an even brighter spotlight on Shanahan.

He’ll be hiring his third general manager in less than 10 years. He pivoted to Dubas from Lou Lamoriello after three seasons and has now decided to replace Dubas after five. He wears the Leafs’ ultimate failings more than anyone.

It was Shanahan who decided to hire a coach – Mike Babcock – before he had a GM. It was Shanahan who brought in Mark Hunter to run the draft for the Leafs (which backfired). It was Shanahan who had Hunter and Dubas running the Leafs together when the Leafs still hadn’t hired that GM (Lamoriello).

It was Shanahan who purged the entire front office after the 2014-15 season.

It was Shanahan who plucked Dubas from Sault Ste. Marie. It was Shanahan overseeing the Leafs when he and Dubas sat together on a summer day in 2018 to announce the signing of John Tavares. It was Shanahan in charge when the Leafs lost in the first round in the two seasons before Dubas took over and the four that followed after that.

It was Shanahan who changed the direction of the Leafs when he promoted Dubas to GM. It’s Shanahan now leading the Leafs back into the unknown."

Bunting was gun shy after taken a 3 games suspension in the first round.
- dmnted

He was a whiny anchor that scored 2 points in the playoffs, and was terrible in his own zone.

Solid take. Makes sense.

One of his last points was he doesn't think MLSE knows what they are doing and it certainly feels that way.
- Aaron_85

Anyone in a senior manager position who is capable of changing their mind on a whim, literally admitting they had made the opposite decision a few days ago, and leave an entire organization at this juncture with this many critical decisions to be made needs to be shown the door now. In any profession.

Well considering Spezza left and it sounds like others, likely important people, are also upset it certainly can be seen as lighting the culture on fire. Time will tell on that though.

I would certainly guess it would depend on who they hire and the next 12 to 24 months.
- Aaron_85

Ehh... Spezza was attached to the hip with Dubas. Pretty sure he wants to go wherever Dubas goes. 🤷

Yikes! Hope you're alright and that he's alright
- Aaron_85

Crazy, bizarre event, obviously involving a domestic dispute with his wife or girlfriend. I was able to swerve last second, and he ran into the side of the truck but I caught him with the mirror.
Dude laying in the middle of the road just kept saying, “I just want to die”. His woman saunters over and asks if we hit him. “Yes”. She tells him, “Get up.”
I Don’t think this is the first time something like this has happened.
Dude just says, “Go. I’m ok. You better go.”
My daughter was really shook up.

Was Santo pro or no Dubas?
- jribout

Big time pro. Has anyone made sure to remove his shoelaces?

Ehh... Spezza was attached to the hip with Dubas. Pretty sure he wants to go wherever Dubas goes. 🤷
- mjones242

Correct

It's a truly unfortunate position Shanahan has put this team into.
- GreatGigInTheSky

You can pretty much kiss Matthews goodbye imo. I cant see him signing a new contract now.

Crazy, bizarre event, obviously involving a domestic dispute with his wife or girlfriend. I was able to swerve last second, and he ran into the side of the truck but I caught him with the mirror.
Dude laying in the middle of the road just kept saying, “I just want to die”. A woman saunters over and asks if we hit him. “Yes”. She tells him, “Get up.”
I Don’t think this is the first time something like this has happened.
Dude just says, “Go. I’m ok. You better go.”
My daughter was really shook up.
- Woderwick

Bruh that's a terrible story. Glad noone was seriously injured but that's pretty messed up.

Big time pro. Has anyone made sure to remove his shoelaces?
- mjones242

Funny how he always disappears for a few days when he is clearly wrong

Anyone in a senior manager position who is capable of changing their mind on a whim, literally admitting they had made the opposite decision a few days ago, and leave an entire organization at this juncture with this many critical decisions to be made needs to be shown the door now. In any profession.
- joel878

Dangle questioned it in that link you provided. He made a load of sense with it. Whatever he said to the board, he's quite the smooth talker it would seem. Not in his presser though...100% fact and truth only

Ehh... Spezza was attached to the hip with Dubas. Pretty sure he wants to go wherever Dubas goes. 🤷
- mjones242

Eh...the guy loves Toronto. Came here to win with his home town team in any capacity. I don't know if he continues in management or not anywhere else.

Crazy, bizarre event, obviously involving a domestic dispute with his wife or girlfriend. I was able to swerve last second, and he ran into the side of the truck but I caught him with the mirror.
Dude laying in the middle of the road just kept saying, “I just want to die”. His woman saunters over and asks if we hit him. “Yes”. She tells him, “Get up.”
I Don’t think this is the first time something like this has happened.
Dude just says, “Go. I’m ok. You better go.”
My daughter was really shook up.
- Woderwick

Geez... that's awful. Hope she's able to shake it off!

I mean, sure, you can say that. I don't agree. I think the news is fresh, shocking, and there's a lot of emotion at play.

I think the org is, and will be, fine. The Leafs culture isn't completely attached to Dubas and I sincerely doubt that Shanahan has lit the culture up in flames as a result of this decision.

But yes, only time will tell.

Pretty sure Shanny is on a short leash himself.
- mjones242

Matthews and Marner, the teams undoubtedly biggest assets, have no move clauses that will carry them to unrestricted free agency kicking in in 5 weeks. Nylander has a 10 team no trade kicking in.

The Leafs are now in a spot where either Pridham and... Haley Wickenheiser?.. Are left either doing the work to get them extended, or make the decision to trade them and negotiate said trades... Or potentially allow them to walk away for nothing so we can be reversed Tavares x2.

The other option is to hopefully hire an actual GM in absolutely record time and allow them to make that decision and do said work with literally days on the job..

Take the draft, signing their own UFA's and free agency, what to do with Sammy... Throw it out the window. Forget about that part, just read the above again. Decisions on what to do with the teams franchise players are either in the hands of the assistant staff or a complete and total newbie.

This is a complete and total (frank)ing poopshow.

Eh...the guy loves Toronto. Came here to win with his home town team in any capacity. I don't know if he continues in management or not anywhere else.
- Aaron_85

I don't know either.

You can pretty much kiss Matthews goodbye imo. I cant see him signing a new contract now.
- Buck Norris

why that?

cause dubas is longer managing the Leafs

PSSFFFF

He was a whiny anchor that scored 2 points in the playoffs, and was terrible in his own zone.
- winsix

didn't he play mostly on the 3rd line?

So Marner has to go too then. Or we can keep the soft players you like?
- jribout

Why you trying to compare them?

Marner is on a whole different level. Especially with his defensive game.

You guys stop doing that. Marner would be the best player on half the teams out there.

Matthews and Marner, the teams undoubtedly biggest assets, have no move clauses that will carry them to unrestricted free agency kicking in in 5 weeks. Nylander has a 10 team no trade kicking in.

The Leafs are now in a spot where either Pridham and... Haley Wickenheiser?.. Are left either doing the work to get them extended, or make the decision to trade them and negotiate said trades... Or potentially allow them to walk away for nothing so we can be reversed Tavares x2.

The other option is to hopefully hire an actual GM in absolutely record time and allow them to make that decision and do said work with literally days on the job..

This is throwing the draft, signing their own UFA's and free agency out the window. Forget about that part, just read the above again. Decisions on what to do with the teams franchise players are either in the hands of the assistant staff or a complete and total newbie.

This is a complete and total (frank)ing poopshow.
- joel878

Thanks to Dubas, we have 3 picks in this year's draft. I wouldn't be too concerned on that front.

Yes, there are concerns with contracts (I've made that clear enough in this and previous threads) though calling this a "total (frank)ing poopshow" is a bit histrionic.

This idea that Shanahan lost his (frank)ing mind and rejected Dubas in the 11th hour as part of some ego rage trip is quite the narrative. It's one of the reasons I don't waste my time with the Steve Dangle's of the world.

didn't he play mostly on the 3rd line?
- dmnted

Pretty sure he played plenty of top six once Bennett intentionally injured Knies.

Geez... that's awful. Hope she's able to shake it off!
- mjones242

It will take time I think. Thanks Jonsie.
She saw the entire thing unfold and got a sixth sense the guy was going do this.

This means it wasn’t Dubas’ job performance that concerned him and ultimately cost him his job. Quite the opposite. Shanahan stressed repeatedly how pleased he was with the job Dubas had done. It’s why the Leafs were ready to commit to him before the playoffs.

No, what apparently swayed them was Dubas’ brief, days-long reluctance to coming back. Even though the Leafs had left him dangling without a contract all season, a moment of hesitation on his part led them to dramatically change course and dive deep into the unknown.

Which frankly seems like an unusual way of doing business, especially with all that pressing work ahead.



Pretty odd to say the least -
- dozerD10

I thought about that too but came to the conclusion that you really don't want a GM in a kinda/sorta want the job. Pretty sure if I was hiring a key person in my organization, like the key-est person, I would want them 100% committed.

I do kinda smell a little odor coming from Shanahan though. He's been hiding behind someone else for years. Maybe it's time for him to step up or (frank) right off.


Team's a mess right now. I'm really interested to see how they recover from this situation. Gotta think the players are all really concerned now too. I don't think I would want to play for Toronto, and I'm a Toronto kid. There is always some kind stink coming from something with this team.

And, if I was the new GM, I'd lock the press out of the arena. Forever. They just stir poop up. It's not like they get anything other than generic hockey answers, yet still manage to "create" some bullpoop drama to print.

Too much scrutiny and pressure. Just a bunch of noise. End the Leafs press. Trade everybody. Rebuild.

TANK FOR MACKLIN CELEBRINI. (whoever the (frank) that is)

Crazy, bizarre event, obviously involving a domestic dispute with his wife or girlfriend. I was able to swerve last second, and he ran into the side of the truck but I caught him with the mirror.
Dude laying in the middle of the road just kept saying, “I just want to die”. His woman saunters over and asks if we hit him. “Yes”. She tells him, “Get up.”
I Don’t think this is the first time something like this has happened.
Dude just says, “Go. I’m ok. You better go.”
My daughter was really shook up.
- Woderwick

Ya that sucks. Sorry that she had to see that.

I think it’s more common than we think, but it’s sucks when innocent bystanders get dragged into it because it obviously is a very traumatic experience.

Why you trying to compare them?

Marner is on a whole different level. Especially with his defensive game.

You guys stop doing that. Marner would be the best player on half the teams out there.
- Arctic_AARDVARK

I am not comparing them. Your excuse for getting rid of Nylander was you do not like soft players. You telling me Marner is not soft? What other players do you consider soft on the Leafs?

I am not comparing them. Your excuse for getting rid of Nylander was you do not like soft players. You telling me Marner is not soft? What other players do you consider soft on the Leafs?
- jribout

Marner is pretty soft.

However, he’s also elite.