Unsurprising. He's now exclusively playing next to a center who's really a middle six LW.
- Feanor

Not surprising regardless who the center is really. He was above 20% I think, that wasn't sustainable. Sell high.

No issue giving cates the full year and another camp to see what he can do at center. Learning on the fly isn't ideal. He seems to be doing hat the coaches want.

He clearly is not a top line center.

or entertaining
- hello it's me 2050

I love the part… “It's a grind, but all of that is extremely important to see what we have and what we need to move forward.” 50 games in and we’re still evaluating. This must be the most thorough evaluation in the history of pro sports!

Do you remember when Mike Missenelli called Flyer Fans Stepford Wives ? If you caught that movie you’ll know what I mean.
- Angus4444

Yep, he just shortened it to "The Stepfords" over the years.

It became very apt. But I think lately it has started to change. The Flyers rank 27th in attendance capacity this season so things ARE changing with the fans.


https://theathletic.com/4...tortorella-flyers-letter/

Philadelphia Flyers fans want to cheer for a contending hockey team, yes. But in the here and now, they’d settle for something far less lofty: honesty — specifically from those at the top of the organization — regarding the state of the club, and just how far the Flyers are from winning anything meaningful.

For nearly two years, the organization at large has tried to sell the fans on pandemic excuses and “aggressive retools” and overly optimistic playoff dreams.

It hasn’t worked. Per Hockey Reference, the Flyers rank 27th in the NHL this season with an 86.8 percent attendance capacity rate. Flyers fans aren’t simply not buying the organization’s message — they’re not buying, period.

I would say he is ideally a 3rd line LW.
- MBFlyerfan

And they are trying to make Cates a 3C or swing player between the two with injuries. No biggie. This is a good season to expand his toolbox. The hard truth is that the end results of team goal differential at the end of the night would not be better with Hayes in that role. They just don’t have a 1C or high end 2C right now. It’s tough.

The first paragraph, that is exactly what they believe.

The last, at least they're not so tone death to not realize that the message is best sent by Tortorella.
- MJL

Folks like Torts. I like Torts, but this message is lipstick on the pig. The owner hiding inside, sends the farmhand to show the pig.

Isles sucked the life out of Flyers PP
- THE EVIL WITHIN

I feel like all games vs the Islanders are snooze fests, the Islanders just suck the life out of games.

I love the part… “It's a grind, but all of that is extremely important to see what we have and what we need to move forward.” 50 games in and we’re still evaluating. This must be the most thorough evaluation in the history of pro sports!
- Dkos

a letter like that as many have said is a joke. Just makes you more of a laughingstock imo.

And they are trying to make Cates a 3C or swing player between the two with injuries. No biggie. This is a good season to expand his toolbox. The hard truth is that the end results of team goal differential at the end of the night would not be better with Hayes in that role. They just don’t have a 1C or high end 2C right now. It’s tough.
- NC Flyers Fan

What would be better is the proper development for Cates, which right now, should take precedence over winning. Hayes should be at center, and Cates on the wing.

The sad thing is that Fletcher and his cronies are modeling themselves on Lou's Islanders.
- Feanor

I don't know if they're "modeling" the Islanders so much as the Islanders just simply stifle most teams they play against with a boring style of play. Last night was no different than any of their games... they only score 2 goals and none in the 3rd. IIRC, they have played that trend for the past 20+ games.

What would be better is the proper development for Cates, which right now, should take precedence over winning. Hayes should be at center, and Cates on the wing.
- MJL

This 100,000%!

I don't know if they're "modeling" the Islanders so much as the Islanders just simply stifle most teams they play against with a boring style of play. Last night was no different than any of their games... they only score 2 goals and none in the 3rd. IIRC, they have played that trend for the past 20+ games.
- Letterkenney

The Islanders I think piled 17 scoring chances and 10 high danger chances on the Flyers last night in the first period. They just lack finishing ability, which is why they went out and got Horvat.

It's more likely to get an elite player in the top 5 but you can get an elite pick with the 9th pick.
- MJL

Sure, you can get elite talent in the 3rd round also. Its about the odds, the people making the pick and the people developing the talent. I just want the Flyers to pick a player that is ready for the NHL now, so they can develop under that archaic coach Torts.

The Islanders I think piled 17 scoring chances and 10 high danger chances on the Flyers last night in the first period. They just lack finishing ability, which is why they went out and got Horvat.
- MJL

I think a few posts and Hart had something to do with it also.

Not surprising regardless who the center is really. He was above 20% I think, that wasn't sustainable. Sell high.

No issue giving cates the full year and another camp to see what he can do at center. Learning on the fly isn't ideal. He seems to be doing hat the coaches want.

He clearly is not a top line center.
- hello it's me 2050

I think Cates can really be a very solid bottom six forward. He’s got enough skill to chip in here or there. Kind of reminds of Laughton. A new position, a rookie and he still seems to make 3 or 4 noticeable plays at both ends of the ice every game.

Nashville, $2M under the cap, .563 pts%, -4 goal differential
Buffalo, $18.25M under the cap, .560 pts%, +16 goal differential
Detroit, $6.6M under the cap, .521 pts%, -15 goal differential
Ottawa, $4.25M under the cap, .510 pts%, -8 goal differential
Philadelphia, $4M OVER the cap, .490 pts%, -21 goal differential


One miracle is not like the others
- Tomahawk

YOU.... and your facts....

What would be better is the proper development for Cates, which right now, should take precedence over winning. Hayes should be at center, and Cates on the wing.
- MJL

I’m not bothered by it, mostly because I disagree that learning center is going to damage or delay him in anyway. It’s definitely not about winning. I think the choice is about keeping the goals against manageable. Being even more leaky certainly won’t help goalie development which rightfully is a higher priority.

What would be better is the proper development for Cates, which right now, should take precedence over winning. Hayes should be at center, and Cates on the wing.
- MJL

Hayes sucks at center, he is much better on wing. Cates is doing fine at center right now. Somehow if your head we need to give Frost a couple of 100 games to develop but Cates gets 40. Right ...

I think a few posts and Hart had something to do with it also.
- jd250

That the idea of where finishing comes in. Hockey 101. Don't hit the post and shoot it past the goalie.

Hayes sucks at center, he is much better on wing. Cates is doing fine at center right now. Somehow if your head we need to give Frost a couple of 100 games to develop but Cates gets 40. Right ...
- jd250

So much is wrong with your reply here that I'm not sure where to start. Did you read the report by Kevin Allen that apparently a very good team has interest in Hayes and they want him to play center? Are they not aware that Hayes sucks at center?

My stance on Cates is not that he's not a good player. It's that he is playing out of position. That he would make a strong forechecking two way winger but lacks the puck skills to play center. You can't create skill and talent in a player by playing him more games.

The Islanders I think piled 17 scoring chances and 10 high danger chances on the Flyers last night in the first period. They just lack finishing ability, which is why they went out and got Horvat.
- MJL

I'm speaking to the style of their play, their systems, which has remarkably played itself out in the stat line of no more than 2 goals, and no goals in the 3rd for 2 months, despite a strong 1st period against the Flyers last night. I understand why they got BoHo but I'll be surprised if he can cause them to rise above their own systems and style. Time will tell.

YOU.... and your facts....
- Letterkenney

Passing off mediocrity as a miracle... Flyers marketing at work.

I’m not bothered by it, mostly because I disagree that learning center is going to damage or delay him in anyway. It’s definitely not about winning. I think the choice is about keeping the goals against manageable. Being even more leaky certainly won’t help goalie development which rightfully is a higher priority.
- NC Flyers Fan

Of course it's about winning. That's the only reason to play Cates at center.

I would say he is ideally a 3rd line LW.
- MBFlyerfan

Right now, but he has 2nd line upside.

My worry is the Flyers got themselves a Jere Lehtinen-type in the draft (thanks Hexy), but they're forcing him to play center whether that's the best spot for him long term or not.

That’ll be a treat Thursday. Really hope Bedard ends up on the east coast, sucks McDavid is at 10PM most nights. I think he’s always had a little hatred for the Flyers since the Manning incident, his first game back against us post injury was a good one
- ClaudeFather

According to EK it was Sanheim...

Passing off mediocrity as a miracle... Flyers marketing at work.
- Tomahawk

That's a prime example of the audience that letter was targeted to.