but if he kicked it up to his own stick and scored it would count. that rule doesnt stop kicking the puck

to me its easier and black and white if you say if the puck goes in off your own player into your own net, it counts
- senstroll

Meh, if you kick the puck and it doesn’t hit your own or teammates stick before entering the net then it doesn’t count.

Doesn’t get much simpler than that.

Meh, if you kick the puck and it doesn’t hit your own or teammates stick before entering the net then it doesn’t count.

Doesn’t get much simpler than that.
- Dozzer

He understands that, he wants it changed. Which is fair.

I don't know, man. So far every single goal he's scored has been disallowed.
- Monkeypunk

He was pretty great last night, one of the better players(not saying much)

I think he is a legitimate option for the 4th line. Its early but it sounds like Keefe wants a long look at him.

Its a move they have to likely address with Hunt being a meh depth guy.

I like that they reward guys like McMann with a few games. I don’t want to overstate the trade chip thing. He might just be one more guy on a list of Marlies and seeing him in a couple of games might make him a bit more real if they’re adding a guy.

Speaking of Bunting, maybe last night was just an off night like a bunch of guys had off nights or maybe he’s a guy who needs two stars on his line to be effective. I have my eyes on him.
- Canada Cup

I think he's a guy they've always liked to grow into a 4th line checker role. Dubas talked about him coming up last summer. Sounds like he finally got healthy and started playing well down there.

Nice depth to compete with guys like Hunt and ZAR and Holmberg. I noticed him more than I have Joey in any game he played. They still have Gaudette and Steeves down there too.

I see both sides of this argument - we want more scoring, but goalies have become so good that you need to get guys in front of the net and guys crashing the net to create more opportunities - so why not also allow kicked in goals?

While I see that side of the argument, I just bristle at it. I'm a traditionalist about hockey in some ways - there are changes I didn't mind and still don't - like the removal of the 2-line pass off-side, and there are changes I think are dumb - like the automatic penalty for puck-over-glass or the trapezoid - but I personally feel that hockey goals should be scored with the stick, and if the stick propelling the puck towards the net wasn't the impetus for the puck entering the net, then it shouldn't count.

The argument gets into a whole slippery slope - if you allow kicking, what about heading the puck in? What about elbowing the puck in? What about just allowing hands? And while it sounds preposterous, the idea of allowing a puck to be kicked in - just 40 years ago - was a ludicrous idea, and now there are a lot of people saying, "Just let them kick it in."
- Monkeypunk

This this 1000000000000 times this! I'm with you on this and yes total goalie bias but screw you non-goalies if your not good enough to beat me by shooting the puck with your million dollar space age technology stick then you don't deserve a goal!

Look up the definition of a goal in hockey and I guarantee you almost all definition's will talk about the puck being put into the with a stick.

As much as I was bummed McMann didn't get his 1st NHL goal last night according to the rule book it's the right call and the Leafs benefitted from that rule vs New Jersey earlier in the year - you can't suck and blow (keep your minds out of the gutter).

I'd be fine if the rule was if a puck goes into the net via anything other than the offensive team player's stick it's no goal. The exception can be if it's an unintentional (and yes that's a referee judgement call) such as a deflection off a shin pad etc.

I'd just say no player can direct the puck with their skates period or it's a automatic no goal if the puck enters the net as a result of that kick regarless of who it goes off off to stop guys from trying to kick it for a deflection.

As a goalie the thought of guys trying to kick pucks in the blue paint to bounce it in off me is terrifying and asking for a serious injury.

My admittedly biased opinion.

I like that they reward guys like McMann with a few games. I don’t want to overstate the trade chip thing. He might just be one more guy on a list of Marlies and seeing him in a couple of games might make him a bit more real if they’re adding a guy.

Speaking of Bunting, maybe last night was just an off night like a bunch of guys had off nights or maybe he’s a guy who needs two stars on his line to be effective. I have my eyes on him.
- Canada Cup

Absolutely the whole team was off - and I probably wouldn't centre on Bunting for any particular reason. I also would never overvalue him. I mean we looked at Bunting's contributions last year and noted that they were similar to Hyman - which was fantastic, because that's what we needed.

The point of that is that Hyman is a vastly superior player to Bunting - but the role that has been asked of them: get in on pucks, win board battles, move the puck in the zone to keep the play going, and get the front and cause chaos - that role is basically the same between what Hyman did and what Bunting does. The difference is that Bunting doesn't carry the puck well, he isn't a particularly good defender, and left to his own merits, he's a decent 3rd line mucker with some good offensive instincts. I don't think anyone should ever expect him to lead a line or make a line better on his own - like Hyman could do. He's a solid contributor when he has a clearly defined role.

I think he's a guy they've always liked to grow into a 4th line checker role. Dubas talked about him coming up last summer. Sounds like he finally got healthy and started playing well down there.

Nice depth to compete with guys like Hunt and ZAR and Holmberg. I noticed him more than I have Joey in any game he played. They still have Gaudette and Steeves down there too.
- The Law

Gaudette and Steeves are two different players. Gaudette can drive a line and Steeves has not been able to.

Steeves is getting points but he has been underwhelming this season...he isnt showing much other than being a good forechecker with some speed. I'd include him in a deal if he has any value to a team.

Gaudette is interesting though.

He was pretty great last night, one of the better players(not saying much)

I think he is a legitimate option for the 4th line. Its early but it sounds like Keefe wants a long look at him.

Its a move they have to likely address with Hunt being a meh depth guy.
- Santo_44

How many games will a 26 year old expected to be an ECHL depth guy have his dad in the crowd?

How many games will a 26 year old expected to be an ECHL depth guy have his dad in the crowd?
- AdamFrench

As many as he wants.

Absolutely the whole team was off - and I probably wouldn't centre on Bunting for any particular reason. I also would never overvalue him. I mean we looked at Bunting's contributions last year and noted that they were similar to Hyman - which was fantastic, because that's what we needed.

The point of that is that Hyman is a vastly superior player to Bunting - but the role that has been asked of them: get in on pucks, win board battles, move the puck in the zone to keep the play going, and get the front and cause chaos - that role is basically the same between what Hyman did and what Bunting does. The difference is that Bunting doesn't carry the puck well, he isn't a particularly good defender, and left to his own merits, he's a decent 3rd line mucker with some good offensive instincts. I don't think anyone should ever expect him to lead a line or make a line better on his own - like Hyman could do. He's a solid contributor when he has a clearly defined role.
- Monkeypunk

This is why I dont see him getting paid this offseason.

I think there will be a 5-6 year deal available here at a cheaper cap hit. Highly doubtful team gives him anything above 3-4 years with him usually being meh when not with Matthews.

Meh, if you kick the puck and it doesn’t hit your own or teammates stick before entering the net then it doesn’t count.

Doesn’t get much simpler than that.
- Dozzer

but thats not really how it is, you can still kick or direct it with your skate in the net, they just have to guess if its a kicking motion etc..

if it were that simple we wouldnt talk about it ever 3rd game.

As many as he wants.
- Scabeh

If Matharnes are paying the bills, sounds good.

How many games will a 26 year old expected to be an ECHL depth guy have his dad in the crowd?
- AdamFrench

I think he gets a look over Hunt when Matthews gets back.

Don't feel like finding the quote but Keefe said he is going to get a run here. Joey got 7 games and he didnt play well.

All forgiven. I love you now. Next up... German wheat beer
- Tee-Dot

Love me some wheat beer! German - Erdinger for sure but why just German?

Off the top of my head I have had and really enjoyed wheat beers from Belgium (Hoegaarden), France (Kronenbourg) and don't sleep on Canada where many many craft breweries have nice wheat beer options but Blanche de Chambly from Quebec is AMAZING!

#beerbuzz

I think he gets a look over Hunt when Matthews gets back.

Don't feel like finding the quote but Keefe said he is going to get a run here. Joey got 7 games and he didnt play well.
- Santo_44

I'm all for giving everybody a go to figure out the best 4th line possible. Hope he continues to play hard and smart. Anything else is just gravy.

I'm all for giving everybody a go to figure out the best 4th line possible. Hope he continues to play hard and smart. Anything else is just gravy.
- AdamFrench

I hadn't even considered him as a call up before a few games ago...its been a nice surprise.

Love me some wheat beer! German - Erdinger for sure but why just German?

Off the top of my head I have had and really enjoyed wheat beers from Belgium (Hoegaarden), France (Kronenbourg) and don't sleep on Canada where many many craft breweries have nice wheat beer options but Blanche de Chambly from Quebec is AMAZING!

#beerbuzz
- Cush29

Do you kiss your mother with that mouth?

*is a Schneider Weisse fanatic, try their Eisbock if you can*

It is hard to read the posts here if you are interested in hockey. People seem to post all kinds of silliness not related to hockey.

Holl has always been what he is. A second or third pair guy depending on the depth. It would be nice to have Schenn as the third pair guy but I think Timmons is showing a nice blend of finesse and physical lay. I think that Lilijgren is well on his way to being a top four guy. Once Brodie, and Muzzen’s contracts expire maybe there will be guys competing by up? Guys like Holliwell and Mete provide good injury relief but that’s all they are. A defense that has Reilly, Lilijgren, sandin, Timmons, and probably Gio will still be there looks pretty good. Dubas needs to find a good physical guy to add to that. In the meantime I have no problem with Holl because he plays the system as required.

So question….

If a Leaf kicks a puck to a team mate at the blue line and a player from the opposition intercepts it, skates back into his own end and puts the puck in the net, does it count?

It is hard to read the posts here if you are interested in hockey. People seem to post all kinds of silliness not related to hockey.

Holl has always been what he is. A second or third pair guy depending on the depth. It would be nice to have Schenn as the third pair guy but I think Timmons is showing a nice blend of finesse and physical lay. I think that Lilijgren is well on his way to being a top four guy. Once Brodie, and Muzzen’s contracts expire maybe there will be guys competing by up? Guys like Holliwell and Mete provide good injury relief but that’s all they are. A defense that has Reilly, Lilijgren, sandin, Timmons, and probably Gio will still be there looks pretty good. Dubas needs to find a good physical guy to add to that. In the meantime I have no problem with Holl because he plays the system as required.
- crawfordg

It's hard to read posts relating to hockey with so many spelling and grammatical errors.

I'm all for giving everybody a go to figure out the best 4th line possible. Hope he continues to play hard and smart. Anything else is just gravy.
- AdamFrench

There are plenty of options - and I agree that seeing some guys come and audition to see if there's another Holmberg, who impresses and understands their role, in the mix. McMann does have that quality to his game - he gets what's expected of him. I think Anderson and Hunt do, too, but they both need to settle their games down. Anderson is almost trying to hit a home run in every shift - he ends up out of position and trying to do more than is expected of him. Hunt ends up out of position throwing hits he doesn't need to - which works in some systems, but I don't think works as well with Keefe's system that both expects and requires guys to be responsible and responsive to the cycle. I sincerely think the system the Leafs use is why more physical players (Ritchie, Aube-Kubel, Hunt . . ) struggle to gain traction in the lineup here.

Absolutely the whole team was off - and I probably wouldn't centre on Bunting for any particular reason. I also would never overvalue him. I mean we looked at Bunting's contributions last year and noted that they were similar to Hyman - which was fantastic, because that's what we needed.

The point of that is that Hyman is a vastly superior player to Bunting - but the role that has been asked of them: get in on pucks, win board battles, move the puck in the zone to keep the play going, and get the front and cause chaos - that role is basically the same between what Hyman did and what Bunting does. The difference is that Bunting doesn't carry the puck well, he isn't a particularly good defender, and left to his own merits, he's a decent 3rd line mucker with some good offensive instincts. I don't think anyone should ever expect him to lead a line or make a line better on his own - like Hyman could do. He's a solid contributor when he has a clearly defined role.
- Monkeypunk

Ya I agree with this. I like the fact that he is a bit of poop disturber. Haven’t had a player that gets under guys skin since kadri? Or komarov.

The downside is he is taking the embellishment to far and isn’t getting rewarded for actual penalties because he is trying to sell so many a game. It would be nice if he could find the happy medium.

Do you kiss your mother with that mouth?
- AdamFrench

The 1664 Blanc is an excellent beer and I have fond memories of several nice cold ones on a patio in Paris.

Yes I do kiss my mother, and I will simply take the high road and avoid the obvious joke you put on a tee for me.

It's fine if you have an inability to appreciate good beer, it doesn't make you a bad person just one with an unrefined palette & no taste.

Will try the recommendation - thank you!

I am shifting away from beer buzz now to get back to hockey talk or at least beer and hockey talk.

When I was in Dallas to see the Leafs several years ago the 'large can' of beer was like a mega can and I would guess almost twice as much volume as a tall boy here.

I thought it was totally a "everything is bigger in Texas" thing until the other day when I pulled a tallboy out of my fridge and tried to use the beer coozie I had bought at my last Bill's game - the tall boy was dwrarfted in this thing!

This explains why I do not remember the drive home from said Bill's game and the hangover the next day - the cans of beer at the game were these same mega cans apparently!

It is hard to read the posts here if you are interested in hockey. People seem to post all kinds of silliness not related to hockey.

Holl has always been what he is. A second or third pair guy depending on the depth. It would be nice to have Schenn as the third pair guy but I think Timmons is showing a nice blend of finesse and physical lay. I think that Lilijgren is well on his way to being a top four guy. Once Brodie, and Muzzen’s contracts expire maybe there will be guys competing by up? Guys like Holliwell and Mete provide good injury relief but that’s all they are. A defense that has Reilly, Lilijgren, sandin, Timmons, and probably Gio will still be there looks pretty good. Dubas needs to find a good physical guy to add to that. In the meantime I have no problem with Holl because he plays the system as required.
- crawfordg

Have you gone into any of the other team blogs and taken a peek? I would say this blog comment section is far more focused on hockey than just about all of them.

So question….

If a Leaf kicks a puck to a team mate at the blue line and a player from the opposition intercepts it, skates back into his own end and puts the puck in the net, does it count?
- .HOHO.

probably? maybe ..idk