Everybody is entitled to an opinion. I don't like ambush criticism.
- spatso

You need to appreciate that the blog gives people a forum to vent and criticize, as well as express satisfaction with the team. Different opinions are a very good thing.

I did want to say that this Leaf team is vulnerable.

Goaltending, defense as well as the 3rd and 4th lines are dubious at best. I think it is going to be hard for them to keep their heads above water the deeper we get into the season.
- spatso

We knew they were rolling the dice, twice really, with the goaltending.

Samsonov has been solid so far though.

You need to appreciate that the blog gives people a forum to vent and criticize, as well as express satisfaction with the team. Different opinions are a very good thing.
- SensFan25

I don't mind different opinion and frustration.

I am impatient with criticism that is always looking for the opportunity to find a victim. For example, I thought Motte, Joseph, Kestelic, Kelly and Watson all played fantastic games. They gave you everything you could want from 3rd or 4th line player. I see some guys knocking them. An implicit guilty verdict of Dorion's hockey acumen. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. but sometimes those opinions are stupid and lacking any real insight into just how hard it is to be a really good 3rd or 4th liner for an NHL team.

I sometimes think to myself, guys who spew up the cheap criticism have never played the game. Never been on the ice trying to contain an elite talent.

It can certainly be said that the amateur scouting for Ottawa has marched to its own beat and frequently goes against consensus of the many scouting services.

What is most important is that they get the big decisions right. For the most part, that has been the case. The selections of Tkachuk, Sanderson and Pinto are certainly the best examples of getting things right and a huge part of why this team has turned things around.
- SensFan25

One prospect Im curious to see how they turn out is Kleven. He was another player they reached on, and we don't hear much about him, but to my understanding he's been fairly steady in the College league.

All the players who were talked to after the game said they all got pumped up from that one shift where Kelly, Watson, and Kastelic were destroying everybody. That's all I need to know.

Now that we're all agreed on how good Pinto actually is and there were 19,000 of Zub's relatives at the game opening night vouching for him and I've been hearing nothing but good things about Kastelec I think it would be a really good idea to make sure the money is there under the cap to keep them all; and I didn't even mention a half dozen other guys who will need to be paid or replaced. Just saying.

Hopefully the cap will go up more than the original 1 million projection and it seems likely that it will a bit but not nearly enough to keep everyone.

I'm thinking Pinto will prove to be good enough to make the solution to that problem obvious and if push comes to shove I would vote to keep the guys I've just mentioned.

One prospect Im curious to see how they turn out is Kleven. He was another player they reached on, and we don't hear much about him, but to my understanding he's been fairly steady in the College league.
- david22

Kleven is entering his third year at UND. From what I've read, he is progressing well. Apparently he took a lot of repetitions on the right side with Sanderson, despite being a LHD.
Given the need for size and snarl on this team's defence, it would be huge if he can be a solid contibutor on the Senators.

surprised only 14k attendance last game.

Throught 4 games so far

Brady 2-4 for 6 P
Norris 0-1 for 1P Slump? Struggles? let hope it is Temp.
Giroux 2-2 for 4P
Cat 1-3 for 4P lets hope breaking the ice opens up the Goal flood gates
Drake 3-3 for 6P
Joseph 0-2 for 2 P
Motte 1-2 for 3P
Pinto 3-0 for 3P
Stu 1-2 for 3P
Chabot 0-2 for 2P


As a side note Boucher has 5-2 for 7P in 5 games for the 67s

Hated the Sens picking Brady at #4.

Out of the Pinto draft, the Sens also got Thompson, Soogaard and Kestelic.

Funny how folks are so quick to go underground with their past comments and not want to recognize just how good the Sens amateur scouting has been.

I thought some of the comments and responses on Tyler Boucher draft were absolutely disgraceful.
- spatso

Easy with the moral high-ground there, and with the excessive draft praise. OTT gave themselves an immense volume of picks to slant the odds in their favour, but their actual ROI has been average. Case in point, outside of top-5 picks (which are largely consensus-driven), the only players they've drafted who are playing on the roster are Chabot, Pinto, Batherson, and Kastelic. In the 5yr stretch from 2015-2019, they also drafted Brown, White, Dahlen, Chlapik, Gagne, and Tychonick as relative whiffs in the first-2 rounds. And while I like JBD, Thomson, and Sogaard well enough, it's far from clear that any of them will be more than supporting cast. Even if we assume Sogaard makes an regular NHL impact, that puts them at 2/6 for 2nd round picks from 2015-2019, which is the exact % success likelihood that Dobber Prospects estimates for 2nd round picks. And there's nothing much in their 2nd round picks from 2020 to 2022 that looks all that much different in terms of quality.

As for Boucher, I make no apologies for my dislike of that pick. He's off to a better start this year in the OHL, and I'm sure he'll find his way into the NHL eventually in some 3rd/4th line capacity... but just from a pure asset management perspective it was a terrible pick. Consider for a minute that a top-10 pick like that should have been AT BEST the kind of 1st round pick they got for Karlsson... would you feel the same if Tyler Boucher was the prime draft return in that trade? Pretty sure you wouldn't, because the pick was virtually unanimously panned by every media outlet and pundit that was worth listening to. And it wasn't 'just like' other times people haven't liked a certain pick at all, because there's literally no precedent in team history for going off-the-board with a top-10 pick.

So be as effusively positive as you like, but quite frankly I find people with that degree of blind deference to any kind of perceived authority to be misguided. "They're the professionals" is not an excuse to forego critical thought. I'll own my mistakes if my opinions prove to be wrong, but referring to any kind of frustration or disagreement being vented on these boards as disgraceful because of a perceived lack of team allegiance is just snowflake crap.

Easy with the moral high-ground there, and with the excessive draft praise. OTT gave themselves an immense volume of picks to slant the odds in their favour, but their actual ROI has been average. Case in point, outside of top-5 picks (which are largely consensus-driven), the only players they've drafted who are playing on the roster are Chabot, Pinto, Batherson, and Kastelic. In the 5yr stretch from 2015-2019, they also drafted Brown, White, Dahlen, Chlapik, Gagne, and Tychonick as relative whiffs in the first-2 rounds. And while I like JBD, Thomson, and Sogaard well enough, it's far from clear that any of them will be more than supporting cast. Even if we assume Sogaard makes an regular NHL impact, that puts them at 2/6 for 2nd round picks from 2015-2019, which is the exact % success likelihood that Dobber Prospects estimates for 2nd round picks. And there's nothing much in their 2nd round picks from 2020 to 2022 that looks all that much different in terms of quality.

As for Boucher, I make no apologies for my dislike of that pick. He's off to a better start this year in the OHL, and I'm sure he'll find his way into the NHL eventually in some 3rd/4th line capacity... but just from a pure asset management perspective it was a terrible pick. Consider for a minute that a top-10 pick like that should have been AT BEST the kind of 1st round pick they got for Karlsson... would you feel the same if Tyler Boucher was the prime draft return in that trade? Pretty sure you wouldn't, because the pick was virtually unanimously panned by every media outlet and pundit that was worth listening to. And it wasn't 'just like' other times people haven't liked a certain pick at all, because there's literally no precedent in team history for going off-the-board with a top-10 pick.

So be as effusively positive as you like, but quite frankly I find people with that degree of blind deference to any kind of perceived authority to be misguided. "They're the professionals" is not an excuse to forego critical thought. I'll own my mistakes if my opinions prove to be wrong, but referring to any kind of frustration or disagreement being vented on these boards as disgraceful because of a perceived lack of team allegiance is just snowflake crap.
- khawk

So. You are not happy?

So. You are not happy?
- SensFan25

I'm happy enough, but I'm also not bowing down at the alter. They've made some good picks, and they've made some bad picks. Tkachuk, Stutzle, and Sanderson have played out nicely as high-end talent, and there's quite a lot of potential remaining in the prospect pool. But pretending that the drafting record is beyond criticism is foolish, and calling people out for having opinions that you disagree with is just wrong.

You need to appreciate that the blog gives people a forum to vent and criticize, as well as express satisfaction with the team. Different opinions are a very good thing.
- SensFan25

Just because spatso doesn't like something, doesn't mean any fan or poster on the site should stop giving their opinion. Who is to say that man fans think spatso is way off base. Spatso, who made you judge and jury? Give it a rest. SensFan25 is beyond right in this instance as his statement applies to everything in life.

I'm happy enough, but I'm also not bowing down at the alter. They've made some good picks, and they've made some bad picks. Tkachuk, Stutzle, and Sanderson have played out nicely as high-end talent, and there's quite a lot of potential remaining in the prospect pool. But pretending that the drafting record is beyond criticism is foolish, and calling people out for having opinions that you disagree with is just wrong.
- khawk[/quote

You are right on the mark with this. Going back to when Dorion was chief scout, he missed quite a lot, passing up on players that outdid the player he drafted in that same round. Just at the look at the year he drafted Chabot and White. The point is, he has made some great calls and some horrible calls.

Easy with the moral high-ground there, and with the excessive draft praise. OTT gave themselves an immense volume of picks to slant the odds in their favour, but their actual ROI has been average. Case in point, outside of top-5 picks (which are largely consensus-driven), the only players they've drafted who are playing on the roster are Chabot, Pinto, Batherson, and Kastelic. In the 5yr stretch from 2015-2019, they also drafted Brown, White, Dahlen, Chlapik, Gagne, and Tychonick as relative whiffs in the first-2 rounds. And while I like JBD, Thomson, and Sogaard well enough, it's far from clear that any of them will be more than supporting cast. Even if we assume Sogaard makes an regular NHL impact, that puts them at 2/6 for 2nd round picks from 2015-2019, which is the exact % success likelihood that Dobber Prospects estimates for 2nd round picks. And there's nothing much in their 2nd round picks from 2020 to 2022 that looks all that much different in terms of quality.

As for Boucher, I make no apologies for my dislike of that pick. He's off to a better start this year in the OHL, and I'm sure he'll find his way into the NHL eventually in some 3rd/4th line capacity... but just from a pure asset management perspective it was a terrible pick. Consider for a minute that a top-10 pick like that should have been AT BEST the kind of 1st round pick they got for Karlsson... would you feel the same if Tyler Boucher was the prime draft return in that trade? Pretty sure you wouldn't, because the pick was virtually unanimously panned by every media outlet and pundit that was worth listening to. And it wasn't 'just like' other times people haven't liked a certain pick at all, because there's literally no precedent in team history for going off-the-board with a top-10 pick.

So be as effusively positive as you like, but quite frankly I find people with that degree of blind deference to any kind of perceived authority to be misguided. "They're the professionals" is not an excuse to forego critical thought. I'll own my mistakes if my opinions prove to be wrong, but referring to any kind of frustration or disagreement being vented on these boards as disgraceful because of a perceived lack of team allegiance is just snowflake crap.
- khawk

The Boucher pick was done for need rather than selecting the best player available. Dorion and Mann said so much. Then Mann let it out on tsn1200 radio that they also made the pick due to ELC and long term cap issues. Meaning they didn't want another top talent that would cost a lot in 3 years after his ELC.

surprised only 14k attendance last game.

Throught 4 games so far

Brady 2-4 for 6 P
Norris 0-1 for 1P Slump? Struggles? let hope it is Temp.
Giroux 2-2 for 4P
Cat 1-3 for 4P lets hope breaking the ice opens up the Goal flood gates
Drake 3-3 for 6P
Joseph 0-2 for 2 P
Motte 1-2 for 3P
Pinto 3-0 for 3P
Stu 1-2 for 3P
Chabot 0-2 for 2P


As a side note Boucher has 5-2 for 7P in 5 games for the 67s
- Mithos

We were surprised last night at the game to see so many empty seats after so much positivity opening night. I thought for sure the momentum would lead to more tickets being sold as the media talked about great it was.

Ottawa and Carolina are probably bang for your buck the best amateur drafters.
- AdamFrench

what does bang for your buck mean? If it's a case of $ they should be investing all they can in scouting

The Boucher pick was done for need rather than selecting the best player available. Dorion and Mann said so much. Then Mann let it out on tsn1200 radio that they also made the pick due to ELC and long term cap issues. Meaning they didn't want another top talent that would cost a lot in 3 years after his ELC.
- LawyerSens4Life

Right, so then Boucher wasn't in any way the best player available, or what any other team in the NHL would have done with that pick. It would be nice if some people were capable of conceding that point, instead of pretending that you have to wait 5 years before drawing conclusions, or be a professional NHL scout to have an opinion. Of course, being forced to consider long-term cap issues when you're at the draft table is evidence of just how crippling the team's previous economic regime was. But that still doesn't make it a good pick, or appropriate use of a highly valuable draft asset.

We were surprised last night at the game to see so many empty seats after so much positivity opening night. I thought for sure the momentum would lead to more tickets being sold as the media talked about great it was.
- LawyerSens4Life

It's disappointing, but at the same time you have to forgive the fan base if they're a bit cautious after being subjected to one of the most thorough scorched earth rebuilds in NHL history. The extent of the remediation since Melnyk's death has been truly impressive, but the product will only sell itself when the team starts to prove itself in the standings. The past two games are starting to show what they're capable of in terms of competing with and beating playoff-quality teams. If they keep it up, I think you'll see the non-season ticket sales pick up by mid-season.