So you don't think that there is a big difference between a 23 goal scorer and a 40 goal scorer?

We're in agreement on your final paragraph.
- MJL

Yes, there certainly is a big difference between a 23 goal scorer and a 40 goal scorer. I think this kid has the moxy and ability to make that leap. He may need to be surrounded by some more talent to reach his full potential, but this kid has the "IT" factor in my opinion and that's why I was livid when Chuckles passed on him.

Yes, there certainly is a big difference between a 23 goal scorer and a 40 goal scorer. I think this kid has the moxy and ability to make that leap. He may need to be surrounded by some more talent to reach his full potential, but this kid has the "IT" factor in my opinion and that's why I was livid when Chuckles passed on him.
- Phillywhiteout

I wanted us to take him too. I am not ready to write York off yet but I agree with many of the posters that this franchise has an unending capacity to ruin the development of players. Frankly, it is weird.

What discrepancies?
- furio16

Torts wants him to push the envelope and get up in the play, and Lappy wants him to play a simple game. Sounds like some pretty serious discrepancies to me. It's like, should I stay or should I go now to paraphrase The Clash!

Yes, there certainly is a big difference between a 23 goal scorer and a 40 goal scorer. I think this kid has the moxy and ability to make that leap. He may need to be surrounded by some more talent to reach his full potential, but this kid has the "IT" factor in my opinion and that's why I was livid when Chuckles passed on him.
- Phillywhiteout

I don't think I'm getting my point across so I'll try and be as specific as I can. First of all, it's not uncommon for forwards to develop faster than defenseman. I would not at all be surprised if Caufield develops into a 40 goal scorer. However he actually has to accomplish that before we view him as such. For some reason, some always feel the need to link players and act as if one player succeeds than the other one can't. You went at Fletcher, which heaven knows there is plenty of reason to do generally, for drafting York over Caufield. I'll repeat, that's extremely premature. York has played 30 NHL games. Many fans want instant development and lack patience with young players. Same thing with Frost. I think that is in part of product of being a Flyers fan since they are so poor in player development. Let's give it a chance and not overreact to a small set back.

Torts wants him to push the envelope and get up in the play, and Lappy wants him to play a simple game. Sounds like some pretty serious discrepancies to me. It's like, should I stay or should I go now to paraphrase The Clash!
- Phillywhiteout

"I think the management, Torts' staff and myself are looking for him to make the simple play," Lehigh Valley head coach Ian Laperriere said Sept. 24.

So cement head “thinks”. Key word there. He has no idea what Torts thinks or wants and was wrong to offer his assessment.

I don’t see any discrepancy to me.

I don't think I'm getting my point across so I'll try and be as specific as I can. First of all, it's not uncommon for forwards to develop faster than defenseman. I would not at all be surprised if Caufield develops into a 40 goal scorer. However he actually has to accomplish that before we view him as such. For some reason, some always feel the need to link players and act as if one player succeeds than the other one can't. You went at Fletcher, which heaven knows there is plenty of reason to do generally, for drafting York over Caufield. I'll repeat, that's extremely premature. York has played 30 NHL games. Many fans want instant development and lack patience with young players. Same thing with Frost. I think that is in part of product of being a Flyers fan since they are so poor in player development. Let's give it a chance and not overreact to a small set back.
- MJL

The bottom line is that I wanted a player of Caufield's ilk over a player like York. I just wanted this organization to have a dynamic scoring forward the likes of which haven't been seen in quite sometime(since when have the Flyers had a perennial 40 goal scorer?). Yes, it is premature and I know that defensemen take longer than forwards to develop in general. They can be equally important in the role on a team and I understand that as well. I just wanted the more dynamic player and I'm certainly not closing the door on York as my previous comments have indicated. Who knows, perhaps Caufield falls flat on his face. This is part of the fun of watching sports.....projecting what a player may become down the line. As always, time will tell.

The bottom line is that I wanted a player of Caufield's ilk over a player like York. I just wanted this organization to have a dynamic scoring forward the likes of which haven't been seen in quite sometime(since when have the Flyers had a perennial 40 goal scorer?). Yes, it is premature and I know that defensemen take longer than forwards to develop in general. They can be equally important in the role on a team and I understand that as well. I just wanted the more dynamic player and I'm certainly not closing the door on York as my previous comments have indicated. Who knows, perhaps Caufield falls flat on his face. This is part of the fun of watching sports.....projecting what a player may become down the line. As always, time will tell.
- Phillywhiteout

Not that quality goal scoring wingers aren't important but I rank quality defenseman as more important players. You build through the middle. Goaltending, defense, center.

Not that quality goal scoring wingers aren't important but I rank quality defenseman as more important players. You build through the middle. Goaltending, defense, center.
- MJL

I don't disagree with that sentiment, but high scoring dynamic wingers don't grow on trees. The worry with Caufield could be his size when games get physical although he(his line)looked pretty good when they went all the way to the Finals a couple of years ago.

The bottom line is that I wanted a player of Caufield's ilk over a player like York. I just wanted this organization to have a dynamic scoring forward the likes of which haven't been seen in quite sometime(since when have the Flyers had a perennial 40 goal scorer?). Yes, it is premature and I know that defensemen take longer than forwards to develop in general. They can be equally important in the role on a team and I understand that as well. I just wanted the more dynamic player and I'm certainly not closing the door on York as my previous comments have indicated. Who knows, perhaps Caufield falls flat on his face. This is part of the fun of watching sports.....projecting what a player may become down the line. As always, time will tell.
- Phillywhiteout

Yeah but you’re speaking as if Caulfield is already a dynamic scorer. The book hasn’t been written by either player…

I don't disagree with that sentiment, but high scoring dynamic wingers don't grow on trees. The worry with Caufield could be his size when games get physical although he(his line)looked pretty good when they went all the way to the Finals a couple of years ago.
- Phillywhiteout

One thing I don't buy into is the size issue. If you can play, you can play. Some of the top players in the game are small players.

Yes, but he had a bad coach. He was much better when St. Louis took over and he will have a full year with him behind the bench this year. I fully expect him to take a run at 40 if he stays healthy. His +/- may still suck cause the team is pretty much a dumpster fire. They actually have lower odds to win the Cup than the Flyers do according to The Hockey News.
- Phillywhiteout

His line with Suzuki caused a fair bit of havoc against a stud Tampa D. Then he fell out of favor in the first part of year. He has a lot of talent.

Question I have is, will this giant Slafkofsky (sp?) make the team? And if so, can he please transform that line (assuming it is Caulfiled-Nick-Slafkofsky) into a standing boosting one?

I think I'm getting more frustrated with the last minute Andys than I am with the Flyers. Did it really take the media and some of the fans this long to finally realize this?
- Glak18

Fans yeah. Media, I am skeptical.

I think the worm turned for me in the 13-14 season. I remember being rather dismissive when they made the playoffs.

Anyway, pointless. I would far rather have been wrong, as I was with Couturier.

Actually, this is precisely the kind of errant pedantry up with which this board should not put.
- iamscore2day

Sir, I fear you are equating the definition of pedantry with everything that goes over your head. The latter is far too generous a definition.

Pedantry would be pointing out that one doesn't end sentences with a verb outside of poetry. Or that errant (aimless) is a superfluous adjective before pedantry.

I do concede however exercising poor judgment in not noticing MJL is back when making that observation.

EDIT: It struck me suddenly. You meant arrant. Ha ha. (yes this is being pedantic)

Really insightful presser from Torts today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDZCKJj7Ot0

He explains why he doesn't believe Lappy has to coach the same way in the AHL that Torts does in the NHL. Tort's values players being in a winning environment much more than what systems they play.

Frankly, if we all had more self-control, we would post less on this board. If these boards ran on "facts" and not "opinions," we would all have to do way more research than we would prefer in order to post here. Having said that, I think he provides more facts than many. Since he enjoys it and everyone else willingly joins in the various forms of repartee (should I have added an accent aigu?), let's hope no such bans are forthcoming. Cheers.
- iamscore2day

Sir, western civilization is based on utilitarianism (greater good etc) and empiricism (data). The former makes his own enjoyment a factor but not the deciding one. The latter suggests that hope aside, another justly deserved ban is already in a gestational phase.

Really insightful presser from Torts today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDZCKJj7Ot0

He explains why he doesn't believe Lappy has to coach the same way in the AHL that Torts does in the NHL. Tort's values players being in a winning environment much more than what systems they play.
- jd250

And out of curiosity, what leads Torts to believe that winning environment is not correlated with systems familiarity?

I don't think I'm getting my point across so I'll try and be as specific as I can. First of all, it's not uncommon for forwards to develop faster than defenseman. I would not at all be surprised if Caufield develops into a 40 goal scorer. However he actually has to accomplish that before we view him as such. For some reason, some always feel the need to link players and act as if one player succeeds than the other one can't. You went at Fletcher, which heaven knows there is plenty of reason to do generally, for drafting York over Caufield. I'll repeat, that's extremely premature. York has played 30 NHL games. Many fans want instant development and lack patience with young players. Same thing with Frost. I think that is in part of product of being a Flyers fan since they are so poor in player development. Let's give it a chance and not overreact to a small set back.
- MJL

And you also have to remember York came up to the NHL team when it was in turmoil, no head coach, only 1 assistant coach. You have to think York did not get the coaching he needed last year (no fault on Yeo for that) nor did he come into a disciplined environment. And its not like York didn't work hard this summer and was not in shape. He just came up and was exposed to a bad environment, so he needs to adjust to how Torts wants him to be on and off the ice, and once he does York will be back and ready to go. Remember, Farabee was sent down for about 10 games before he stuck with the NHL club. Perhaps York will follow a similar path.

Sir, I fear you are equating the definition of pedantry with everything that goes over your head. The latter is far too generous a definition.

Pedantry would be pointing out that one doesn't end sentences with a verb outside of poetry. Or that errant (aimless) is a superfluous adjective before pedantry.

I do concede however exercising poor judgment in not noticing MJL is back when making that observation.
- PT21

Another violation of rule 3. You've ignored the larger issue and attempted to score a cheap point with a grammar critique. Which is irrelevant. This is a repeated issue for you today.

And out of curiosity, what leads Torts to believe that winning environment is not correlated with systems familiarity?
- PT21

He explains that in this presser, but basically he stated systems are really not that different and a lot of hockey is played in small areas and one on one. He then said he used be a coach that dictated every single move and wanted his players programmed, and now he has realized that its better to get out of the players way, let them play, but demand they do the little things well like how to play without the puck.

Really insightful presser from Torts today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDZCKJj7Ot0

He explains why he doesn't believe Lappy has to coach the same way in the AHL that Torts does in the NHL. Tort's values players being in a winning environment much more than what systems they play.
- jd250

Doesn't make sense to me. Doesn't Tortorella believe that his system can create a winning environment? Does he believe that Lappy's system can do a better job in creating that?

And you also have to remember York came up to the NHL team when it was in turmoil, no head coach, only 1 assistant coach. You have to think York did not get the coaching he needed last year (no fault on Yeo for that) nor did he come into a disciplined environment. And its not like York didn't work hard this summer and was not in shape. He just came up and was exposed to a bad environment, so he needs to adjust to how Torts wants him to be on and off the ice, and once he does York will be back and ready to go. Remember, Farabee was sent down for about 10 games before he stuck with the NHL club. Perhaps York will follow a similar path.
- jd250

I fully expect York to be quickly back with the Flyers.

Doesn't make sense to me. Doesn't Tortorella believe that his system can create a winning environment? Does he believe that Lappy's system can do a better job in creating that?
- MJL

Torts believes that people's focus on system is over-complicating the game, and that most teams play the same way with only subtle differences. Torts put his emphasis on how his players play when they don't have the puck, and today for example apparently did a lot of half ice drills to help the team work on 1 on 1 battles in tight spaces, which he said this team needs to be better in. He wants Lappy to be his own coach. I just thought he was great today, I really learned a few things.

Really insightful presser from Torts today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDZCKJj7Ot0

He explains why he doesn't believe Lappy has to coach the same way in the AHL that Torts does in the NHL. Tort's values players being in a winning environment much more than what systems they play.
- jd250

I'm not even going to listen to the presser cause I have a major problem with this line of thinking. I hate to bring the Pens into this, but I will use Mike Sullivan as an example. Several years ago the Pens were besieged with injuries, but somehow kept their heads above water and stayed in the playoff race. Sullivan was quoted as saying their guys at WBS play the same system as they do at the NHL level and therefore are able to fit in seamlessly when they are brought up. It just makes no sense whatsoever to play different systems within the top 2 levels of an organization. Sorry Torts! I'm out on this one. FIRE CHUCK!

Torts believes that people's focus on system is over-complicating the game, and that most teams play the same way with only subtle differences. Torts put his emphasis on how his players play when they don't have the puck, and today for example apparently did a lot of half ice drills to help the team work on 1 on 1 battles in tight spaces, which he said this team needs to be better in. He wants Lappy to be his own coach. I just thought he was great today, I really learned a few things.
- jd250

This team has been terrible at 1 on 1 battles in tight spaces in what seems like forever. Glad he sees that as an issue, but the problem is what do you do to fix it?

Torts believes that people's focus on system is over-complicating the game, and that most teams play the same way with only subtle differences. Torts put his emphasis on how his players play when they don't have the puck, and today for example apparently did a lot of half ice drills to help the team work on 1 on 1 battles in tight spaces, which he said this team needs to be better in. He wants Lappy to be his own coach. I just thought he was great today, I really learned a few things.
- jd250

There hasn't been really anything that Tortorella has done or said since he's been here that I've found highly enlightening. Most teams do play the same way and he's right that the differences are subtle. However that doesn't change that a team does need to be on the same page. How many times have you projected that Tortorella is going to add structure to this team and that will pay dividends? Have you changed your mind about that? One on one drills and battle drills are common in hockey. It doesn't make sense not to employ the same system in the AHL as the parent club. Lappy being his own coach is what I'm afraid of.