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- hello it's me 2050

$250,000

$250,000
- MBFlyerfan

kikale

So can it be confirmed by both these charts the drafting and development both suck. Is that a fir statement.
- hello it's me 2050

No. It proves at least one of the two are bad. But you can't tease out development effects from scouting here.

Development effects could be gleaned in the following way. Use juniors data, and come up with some kind of WAR/GSVA from that for a player. Now look at subsequent NHL data and look at the WAR/GSVA from that as well. Then find a way to translate junior WAR/GSVA to NHL WAR/GSVA. Meaning say, that a WAR of 75% in juniors is 60% in NHL or something like that.

Then see how how each team did in the difference between junior WAR/GSVA and NHL WAR/GSVA. For example if a team drafted players with WAR of 75% and got only a WAR in the NHL of 50% instead of the expected 60%, then that is purely due to development and takes away draft order/scouting effects.

Then, Use this difference to rank teams.

This one is scary bad.
- landros 2

When your best non 1st round picks are a guy who passed through waivers after being not being able to crack the roster, and had to be paid to be taken as a salary dump/reclamation project, and another who plays a position which typically doesn't get picked in the 1st round anyway, then you know you are in deep poop.

No. It proves at least one of the two are bad. But you can't tease out development effects from scouting here.

Development effects could be gleaned in the following way. Use juniors data, and come up with some kind of WAR/GSVA from that for a player. Now look at subsequent NHL data and look at the WAR/GSVA from that as well. Then find a way to translate junior WAR/GSVA to NHL WAR/GSVA. Meaning say, that a WAR of 75% in juniors is 60% in NHL or something like that.

Then see how how each team did in the difference between junior WAR/GSVA and NHL WAR/GSVA. For example if a team drafted players with WAR of 75% and got only a WAR in the NHL of 50% instead of the expected 60%, then that is purely due to development and takes away draft order/scouting effects.

Then, Use this difference to rank teams.
- PT21

I will keep it simple and just go with both are bad.

kikale
- hello it's me 2050

molopää

molopää
- MBFlyerfan

Millywaukay

molopää
- MBFlyerfan

how original turd.

This is just slobbering blabber.
- MJL

Its not slobbering blabber. What is the margin of underpayment that makes a contract a steal? 1M? 2 m? 10% more AAV? What? That is what he was asking.

Steal is a strong word and suggests Couturier is extremely underpaid for what he would bring (as he was in his last contract).

Further, you said a few days ago Couturier deserved what he got in this contract. If it is a steal, then by definition, Couturier did NOT deserve what he got, for he (by definition) deserved more.

Can't have it both ways.

Its not slobbering blabber. What is the margin of underpayment that makes a contract a steal? 1M? 2 m? 10% more AAV? What? That is what he was asking.

Steal is a strong word and suggests Couturier is extremely underpaid for what he would bring (as he was in his last contract).

Further, you said a few days ago Couturier deserved what he got in this contract. If it is a steal, then by definition, Couturier did NOT deserve what he got, for he (by definition) deserved more.

Can't have it both ways.
- PT21

Personally I thought he was going to get 9, so take that for what it is.

We’ll look at it this way
Coots previous deal I think EVERYONE would say was a “steal” so if it was a steal then by how much? A couple mil per year?

So coots making almost 8 mil on new deal and mjl cap expert claiming he’s a “steal” would obviously mean by same parameters that would be around 10 mil.


Which is an absulute joke

Projected 55 points.


But makes linemates better🤔

So laughable actually
- Stayin alive

Is there like some chart you're using for all of this? Are there any facts that you can provide on this? Projected by whom? The statistical evidence of how Couturier makes players he plays with better was provided to you.
Every post you make is just more babble.

Its not slobbering blabber. What is the margin of underpayment that makes a contract a steal? 1M? 2 m? 10% more AAV? What? That is what he was asking.

Steal is a strong word and suggests Couturier is extremely underpaid for what he would bring (as he was in his last contract).

Further, you said a few days ago Couturier deserved what he got in this contract. If it is a steal, then by definition, Couturier did NOT deserve what he got, for he (by definition) deserved more.

Can't have it both ways.
- PT21

ex selke is CCII. Zero desire to want to try to win. Loves the country club flyers atmosphere. Walks about town and non one bothers him. Zero pressure.

Please follow along. It’s been stated already
- Stayin alive

Stated by whom? You?

Its not slobbering blabber. What is the margin of underpayment that makes a contract a steal? 1M? 2 m? 10% more AAV? What? That is what he was asking.

Steal is a strong word and suggests Couturier is extremely underpaid for what he would bring (as he was in his last contract).

Further, you said a few days ago Couturier deserved what he got in this contract. If it is a steal, then by definition, Couturier did NOT deserve what he got, for he (by definition) deserved more.

Can't have it both ways.
- PT21

Please provide a link to that statement and the context included.

His posting is slobbering blabber.

Here is a breakdown of the contract. Couturier took less of an AAV in exchange for some other factors. The two biggest are the term and security of an 8 year deal. The other is that his deal is heavy in signing bonus money which makes it buyout proof.

It's subjective due to the flat cap environment but on the open market a 30 goal, 70 point Selke level center is certainly worth more than 7.75M a year on the open UFA market. There are a number of comparable players who have a higher cap hit that was signed numerous years sooner.

I disagree on Farabee. He has scored the 5th most points from that draft class despite being the 14th overall pick. 2 more points than Kotkaniemi (#3) who has played 67 more games.
- MBFlyerfan

That’s fair, I’m just concerned that since he’s built like a pipe cleaner, he might have a hard time staying healthy

Is there like some chart you're using for all of this? Are there any facts that you can provide on this? Projected by whom? The statistical evidence of how Couturier makes players he plays with better was provided to you.
Every post you make is just more babble.
- MJL

makes players better is getting the flyers where exactly? another bottom 10 finish?

How much better is he making say TK?

Would love to read some data where this shows he makes players better.

All teams miss on draft picks. It just so happens that the Flyers miss at a much higher rate than other teams do.

- Letterkenney

I was being a bit sarcastic there. The original post I replied to seemed pathetic to me.

Please provide a link to that statement and the context included.

His posting is slobbering blabber.

Here is a breakdown of the contract. Couturier took less of an AAV in exchange for some other factors. The two biggest are the term and security of an 8 year deal. The other is that his deal is heavy in signing bonus money which makes it buyout proof.

It's subjective due to the flat cap environment but on the open market a 30 goal, 70 point Selke level center is certainly worth more than 7.75M a year on the open UFA market. There are a number of comparable players who have a higher cap hit that was signed numerous years sooner.
- MJL

Wrong per usual

1) what are coots averages? 30 goals /70 points? Nope wrong.

2) 1 time selke win does not equal Bergy type of selke play expectation. And I’ll add his d play has clearly trended downward last few years for many reasons

Stated by whom? You?
- MJL

Fine since those in the back can’t/won’t pay attention

Another poster the other day stated they received I believe the hockey news fantasy edition and he said coots was lowest 1c projected point total. Of all the highest point projection on team coots was 55. Lowest among 1c

Its not slobbering blabber. What is the margin of underpayment that makes a contract a steal? 1M? 2 m? 10% more AAV? What? That is what he was asking.

Steal is a strong word and suggests Couturier is extremely underpaid for what he would bring (as he was in his last contract).

Further, you said a few days ago Couturier deserved what he got in this contract. If it is a steal, then by definition, Couturier did NOT deserve what he got, for he (by definition) deserved more.

Can't have it both ways.
- PT21

We all know what was meant. He won’t say a number because he’s a fraud.

Any simple person would say he’s a steal. He is worth X amount then make case for that thought.

He’s a fraud

Personally I thought he was going to get 9, so take that for what it is.
- MBFlyerfan

I’m curious ( obvious I don’t believe he’s worth anything close to that) but do you think he is worth 9 mil and if so do you believe philly should’ve been the one to give it to him?

Personally I thought he was going to get 9, so take that for what it is.
- MBFlyerfan

Couturier is overvalued in this board. He is certainly a very good player, but the ESPN+ article a poster (I think BigE88 is his name) last summer showed that poll of GMs from other teams and he did not get a single top 10 vote. Couple in his age, and his history of injuries, and the hard minutes he plays, and I would say that if he got a 9m contract, it would have been from a team offering 5-6 years.

Here is a list of $/point for centers last year (standard contract, UFA status on expiriy).

If Couturier scores 70 points this year for that AAV of 7.75, that would be around $111k/point and he would still rank in the bottom 20%. He is in the realm of Malkin.

McDavid, Bergeron, Danault, Matthews, Aho, Hiscier are all cheaper.

I don't see much evidence of the "steal"

Please provide a link to that statement and the context included.

His posting is slobbering blabber.

Here is a breakdown of the contract. Couturier took less of an AAV in exchange for some other factors. The two biggest are the term and security of an 8 year deal. The other is that his deal is heavy in signing bonus money which makes it buyout proof.

It's subjective due to the flat cap environment but on the open market a 30 goal, 70 point Selke level center is certainly worth more than 7.75M a year on the open UFA market. There are a number of comparable players who have a higher cap hit that was signed numerous years sooner.
- MJL

If someone gives up $ in AAV and makes up for it in term and buyout proofness, how can any part of that contract be termed a steal?

If someone gives up $ in AAV and makes up for it in term and buyout proofness, how can any part of that contract be termed a steal?
- PT21

It can’t. Plain and simple.

Only in fantasy mjl land

Couturier is overvalued in this board. He is certainly a very good player, but the ESPN+ article a poster (I think BigE88 is his name) last summer showed that poll of GMs from other teams and he did not get a single top 10 vote. Couple in his age, and his history of injuries, and the hard minutes he plays, and I would say that if he got a 9m contract, it would have been from a team offering 5-6 years.

Here is a list of $/point for centers last year (standard contract, UFA status on expiriy).

If Couturier scores 70 points this year for that AAV of 7.75, that would be around $111k/point and he would still rank in the bottom 20%. He is in the realm of Malkin.

McDavid, Bergeron, Danault, Matthews, Aho, Hiscier are all cheaper.

I don't see much evidence of the "steal"
- PT21

Don’t forget

1) he’s a selke winner
2) unlike EVERY other 1c in the league he ACTUALLY 100% makes his wingers better 🙄

You have to figure that in