Everyone says "they got their guy" though. I have a hard time believing they would have taken him at 25.

But even so, I think Mrazek and almost a mill of cap space vs. Murray, 3rd, 7th is a tough call. They are very similar goalies imo and cap space is at a premium for this team
- PlatosRepucklic

I get it, it's a tough look right now.. Dubas is banking on Murray rebounding. If it works, then Dubas got a goalie for nothing.. I personally hope he does well. I don't mind the deal, to be honest.. It cost nothing but cap space and they got two more lottery tickets in the process. As a Leafs fan, I want all of the Leaf players to do well..

Mrazek was a good idea at the time, he had good numbers throughout his career, the plan was to have a good 1A/1B tandem.. It just didn't work out that way.
- PatC80

It was never a good idea to pay him 3.8 x 3. Too much money for a backup, and he isnt a contender level starter. It never made sense.

Matt Murray has not been bad for 5 years.
- Leafs43

Yes its a gamble but Murray at his worse was basically equal to what they were already getting from Campbell other then the his two stellar months at the start of the season. I think Murray will look a lot better playing for the Leafs then he did for the Sens about a .910, but the big question mark will be can he stay healthy.
Also I think one of the key points to the Murray trade is they didn't give up assets to get him, assets that can be used to address other needs. Another point in the matter is the term, two years is manageable. The 5 years that the Ufa's are rumored to get is not IMO and it just so happens to come off the cap when Matthews needs a raise.
Question for you peeps, should the Leafs move JT to the wing, move out Kerfoot and Holl freeing up $5.7 and then sign Malkin at $5.7????

Bunting...Matthews..... Marner
Tavares.....Malkin.....Nylander

If it works out, Dubas looks like a genius, if it fails, he may be out of a job.. It's a risky move for him.. As a Leafs fan though, I will still cheer for Matt Murray.. Heck, we've cheered for J.S Aubin and Jonas Gustavsson
- PatC80

It was never a good idea to pay him 3.8 x 3. Too much money for a backup, and he isnt a contender level starter. It never made sense.
- Archaic

In hindsight, yeah, you're right.. That's too much for a backup.. The line of thinking at the time was if Campbell can't handle being a #1 goalie, then getting a guy who can split starts and put up decent numbers is a safe bet. Mrazek, didn't put up good numbers though.

I am hoping that the Leafs go after Samsonov.. I think he's a guy that could be good.
- PatC80

he or Comrie I would like to see as the Leafs backup to Murray

he or Comrie I would like to see as the Leafs backup to Murray
- dmnted

Agreed..

Samsonov or Comrie

I get it, it's a tough look right now.. Dubas is banking on Murray rebounding. If it works, then Dubas got a goalie for nothing.. I personally hope he does well. I don't mind the deal, to be honest.. It cost nothing but cap space and they got two more lottery tickets in the process. As a Leafs fan, I want all of the Leaf players to do well..
- PatC80

Hey as a Leafs fan I hope he proves me wrong and wins the Vezina. He can even have the Conn Smythe if it means they win a cup.

if dufuss gets charlie manson all is forgiven👍

over the years i’ve learned to abandon all hope tho🤦🏿‍♂️😭
- Skalapy

he's not playing for a team past the 43rd parallel

3 years.
- Fakepartofme

Goals Saved Above Expected for Matt Murray:

16-17: 16.99
17-18: -7.6
18-19: -0.08
19-20: -13.98
20-21: -15.22
21-22: 3.78

In theory he hasn't been too good except for his first year (his REAL first year was 13 games, and he was decent in that as well). BTW, because any stat like GSAx or GSAA is an aggregate, the more you play, the more it's affected, so this is it normalized to 40 games:

16-17: 14.74
17-18: -6.67
18-19: -0.07
19-20: -15
20-21: -26.02
21-22: 7.68

He was decent, but often injured, last year. Bad enough that Ottawa was giving up on him, though. My point in all of this isn't whether Murray could be capable, but rather than he had not only no value, but Ottawa needed him gone. Get what you want from Ottawa, wait for the buyout, or ultimately just move on.

Elkin has one job - work with Murray.

Elkin started coaching Murray when Murray was 10 so he must have helped him develop a bit. Dubas also hired Elkin to work with Murray at the Soo. Once he got there, Murray went from .894% to .921%. Elkin, Dubas and Keefe think there’s still something there.
- Canada Cup

And maybe they can. I feel there's more bias and 12-20 year old relationships impacting this than real assessment. But if you're running an NHL team that desperately needs cap, is he worth $4.7m right _now_? Maybe you can rebuild him to a $5m goalie, but what is his current cap value?

They had some room and flexibility and threw it away. That's ultimately my frustration. I don't care that we got Murray. I care about what we're paying him.

Yes its a gamble but Murray at his worse was basically equal to what they were already getting from Campbell other then the his two stellar months at the start of the season. I think Murray will look a lot better playing for the Leafs then he did for the Sens about a .910, but the big question mark will be can he stay healthy.
Also I think one of the key points to the Murray trade is they didn't give up assets to get him, assets that can be used to address other needs. Another point in the matter is the term, two years is manageable. The 5 years that the Ufa's are rumored to get is not IMO and it just so happens to come off the cap when Matthews needs a raise.
Question for you peeps, should the Leafs move JT to the wing, move out Kerfoot and Holl freeing up $5.7 and then sign Malkin at $5.7????

Bunting...Matthews..... Marner
Tavares.....Malkin.....Nylander
- Buck Norris

you got your numbers backward. it's at least 7.5 for Malkin

I’m a Toronto kid born and raised. I know a thing or two about Leaf fans. Didn’t know this was a ‘do not enter’ area. Toronto sports fans and it’s media are a special bunch.
- Habsolute009

I never said it was. I implied it's a pretty stupid place to take shots at/whine about Leaf fans.

Didn't Dubas imply that they would have taken Fraser Minten at 25? So, they unloaded Mrazek's contract and still got the guy they wanted
- PatC80

Again, Minten is a solid pick - almost every analyst agrees, and many think he has the potential and drive to be more, but he is at least a very solid 3C at the NHL level. I believe he was the guy they wanted - but I think Ostlund, Ohgren and McGroarty may have been their principal targets if they were still around at 25 (and almost all projections had them being gone by 20; mock drafts had the Leafs getting one of these often, but everyone's rankings had those 3 in the top-20, so why they were still around for the Leafs to take in their mock drafts was curious).

Brutal move by Dubas. He got worked by one of the worst GMs in league history

A couple years after shipping a first round pick to dump one year of Patrick Marleau, he only manages to recoup a 3rd and 7th for taking on two years of Matt Murray. Awful

I get not wanting to sign Campbell for 5 years. And I agree with that. But Murray?? Come on
- AxlRose91

the problem with this comp is PM cap hit was 6 mil and that wasnt changing. if you buy him out, its stil 6mil

Leafs could buy out Murray after this year and it would be 666k and 2mil cap.

In hindsight, yeah, you're right.. That's too much for a backup.. The line of thinking at the time was if Campbell can't handle being a #1 goalie, then getting a guy who can split starts and put up decent numbers is a safe bet. Mrazek, didn't put up good numbers though.
- PatC80

It was pretty obvious to the average person it wasnt a great idea to sign him to begin with, so why doesnt a GM see that?

Yes its a gamble but Murray at his worse was basically equal to what they were already getting from Campbell other then the his two stellar months at the start of the season. I think Murray will look a lot better playing for the Leafs then he did for the Sens about a .910, but the big question mark will be can he stay healthy.
Also I think one of the key points to the Murray trade is they didn't give up assets to get him, assets that can be used to address other needs. Another point in the matter is the term, two years is manageable. The 5 years that the Ufa's are rumored to get is not IMO and it just so happens to come off the cap when Matthews needs a raise.
Question for you peeps, should the Leafs move JT to the wing, move out Kerfoot and Holl freeing up $5.7 and then sign Malkin at $5.7????

Bunting...Matthews..... Marner
Tavares.....Malkin.....Nylander
- Buck Norris

I don't want more old and slow - and if we think Nylander looks disengaged, getting Malkin will make Willy look like Gallagher.

I don't know what Pittsburgh offered Malkin, but whatever it was was low enough for him to claim they don't think he's good anymore and they don't want him. I'd imagine it was probably around $5m.

he's not playing for a team past the 43rd parallel
- dmnted

thanks for making me google 43rd parallel👍

i got smarter so far today👍🏿😃

In hindsight, yeah, you're right.. That's too much for a backup.. The line of thinking at the time was if Campbell can't handle being a #1 goalie, then getting a guy who can split starts and put up decent numbers is a safe bet. Mrazek, didn't put up good numbers though.
- PatC80

I try to look at goaltending as a whole now with salary. Our starter was 1.65 million and that's super underpaid as a starter. So it washes out for last year. I think the leafs can have a pair of goalies for 6 million and still be okay cap wise. Which means you're looking at 1 to 1.2 for a back up. Do I think Comrie would be worth a million or less? Yes. Do I think he wants to come here? No clue lol.

I’m a Toronto kid born and raised. I know a thing or two about Leaf fans. Didn’t know this was a ‘do not enter’ area. Toronto sports fans and it’s media are a special bunch.
- Habsolute009

Enjoy your ban.

I get it, it's a tough look right now.. Dubas is banking on Murray rebounding. If it works, then Dubas got a goalie for nothing.. I personally hope he does well. I don't mind the deal, to be honest.. It cost nothing but cap space and they got two more lottery tickets in the process. As a Leafs fan, I want all of the Leaf players to do well..
- PatC80

I agree, but no matter how you look at it, even if he does well, its still a bad trade. No way the Leafs should have to take this much risk on with so little return.

I get it, it's a tough look right now.. Dubas is banking on Murray rebounding. If it works, then Dubas got a goalie for nothing.. I personally hope he does well. I don't mind the deal, to be honest.. It cost nothing but cap space and they got two more lottery tickets in the process. As a Leafs fan, I want all of the Leaf players to do well..
- PatC80

What I do find amusing is the addition of more picks is looked over considering a few of the Dubas haters kept talking about how there's no prospects/picks and not doing enough to keep that going.

Dubas got 5 picks in this draft when he went in with 3 picks. He now has picked up a couple more in the coming years. Not saying it fixes the trade but it's something.

Again, Minten is a solid pick - almost every analyst agrees, and many think he has the potential and drive to be more, but he is at least a very solid 3C at the NHL level. I believe he was the guy they wanted - but I think Ostlund, Ohgren and McGroarty may have been their principal targets if they were still around at 25 (and almost all projections had them being gone by 20; mock drafts had the Leafs getting one of these often, but everyone's rankings had those 3 in the top-20, so why they were still around for the Leafs to take in their mock drafts was curious).
- Monkeypunk

Also Owen Pickering was taken at 21st overall.. Those are 4 players that were apparently Leafs targets that went before 25.

I wanted Owen Beck, but who knows. maybe Minten has a better NHL career than Beck does?

And maybe they can. I feel there's more bias and 12-20 year old relationships impacting this than real assessment. But if you're running an NHL team that desperately needs cap, is he worth $4.7m right _now_? Maybe you can rebuild him to a $5m goalie, but what is his current cap value?

They had some room and flexibility and threw it away. That's ultimately my frustration. I don't care that we got Murray. I care about what we're paying him.
- Monkeypunk

I also think the long term stuff wasn't an option for the Leafs.

Campbell is 31 this season. It was never a good idea to give him the deal he wants.

Kuemper is about to get really overpaid.

Talbot? Sure but the insiders say Wild don't want to move him.

Murray has worked with the goalie coach before and he did show glimpses of his old self before getting a concussion.

Ottawa is a sucky org and Murray wants to be here, he will come motivated. A new mindset in the crease isnt bad.

I wanted MAF.

What I do find amusing is the addition of more picks is looked over considering a few of the Dubas haters kept talking about how there's no prospects/picks and not doing enough to keep that going.

Dubas got 5 picks in this draft when he went in with 3 picks. He now has picked up a couple more in the coming years. Not saying it fixes the trade but it's something.
- Aaron_85

You could put shine on a shipwreck.