I was focused on our 1st round picks and named them all as being reasons the rebuild is taking as long as it is. I’m not playing the hindsight game and saying we should have done (referencing Makar), just saying the guys we’ve landed in the draft haven’t made an immediate impact (I don’t expect Hischier or Jack to carry a franchise in their first 3 years), which is part of why it’s taken long.

I can’t say it enough. I’m not hating on Nico. I keep defending that cuz you guys interpret any criticism as hating and have an irrational zealous reaction to defend him against something that’s not meant as an attack. I think he’s a good 2nd line center at this point in his young career. I think he was given the C too young. I think hefty deals for any young player not putting up big points is something I’m iffy on in general.

I expect more from him cuz I would expect more from any young player that was projected to be the best among his peers in the draft. Tatar isn’t a reason why our rebuild is taking long. Who you draft in general is of course a huge part of how a team’s rebuild unfolds.. but a first overall.. or 6th.. a team only gets so many opportunities to pick that high, so you gotta hope that player pans out to be good enough to be a significant part of improving a team.

When I watch the games I see Nico is responsible on both ends, takes care of the puck and limits turnovers, is good enough in the circle, and can make some good plays, decent hand-eye. I don’t see him creating something out of nothing due to not having brilliant playmaking ability or speed, don’t see him protecting the puck with his body due to having average size and strength, don’t see him sniping cuz he’s not a sniper. I see a good 2nd line center. That’s nothing to scoff at for a 22yr old. I don’t get how that’s hating.
- MartysBetter88

Stop with the Nico hate… my eyes are burning…

Can we all just go back to female doging about how bad Zacha is?

I was focused on our 1st round picks and named them all as being reasons the rebuild is taking as long as it is. I’m not playing the hindsight game and saying we should have done (referencing Makar), just saying the guys we’ve landed in the draft haven’t made an immediate impact (I don’t expect Hischier or Jack to carry a franchise in their first 3 years), which is part of why it’s taken long.

I can’t say it enough. I’m not hating on Nico. I keep defending that cuz you guys interpret any criticism as hating and have an irrational zealous reaction to defend him against something that’s not meant as an attack. I think he’s a good 2nd line center at this point in his young career. I think he was given the C too young. I think hefty deals for any young player not putting up big points is something I’m iffy on in general.

I expect more from him cuz I would expect more from any young player that was projected to be the best among his peers in the draft. Tatar isn’t a reason why our rebuild is taking long. Who you draft in general is of course a huge part of how a team’s rebuild unfolds.. but a first overall.. or 6th.. a team only gets so many opportunities to pick that high, so you gotta hope that player pans out to be good enough to be a significant part of improving a team.

When I watch the games I see Nico is responsible on both ends, takes care of the puck and limits turnovers, is good enough in the circle, and can make some good plays, decent hand-eye. I don’t see him creating something out of nothing due to not having brilliant playmaking ability or speed, don’t see him protecting the puck with his body due to having average size and strength, don’t see him sniping cuz he’s not a sniper. I see a good 2nd line center. That’s nothing to scoff at for a 22yr old. I don’t get how that’s hating.
- MartysBetter88

Then your expectations are just way too high. So thats your own fault. Just because someone is a 1st overall pick doesnt mean theyre going to light the league on fire or be a surefire top line player. Especially when said player wasnt projected to be that, or said player is coming out of a draft that was considered the weakest draft in over a decade, and is also weaker than any draft after it so far as well. His draft position is completely irrelevant.

You need to re-evaluate your expectations and set them more accurately. Its that simple.

We know Zacha and McLeod were bad picks. Theres no hindsight involved there. Everybody i know and talked to wanted multiple other players over both guys. Smith was a good pick, still TBD how that plays out but he was the BPA at his spot and it was a shock that he even fell to us. Holtz and Mercer are good picks, would've still preferred Rossi or Perfetti over Holtz but its still not a bad pick. Luke Hughes was obviously the right pick as well. They all look like they're on the right development path. Outside of the Zacha and McLeod picks, our OWN 1st round picks have been fine tbh.

The issues are when we sell off assets and acquire additional 1sts then throw them away for guys like Mukhamadullin and Stillman when MUCH better players are on the board. Mercer was the only good pick out of three additional 1sts the last few years. On top of everything i said about 2nds and 3rds, thats how you stagnate a rebuild. Our rebuild stagnating has absolutely nothing to do with Jack or Nico.

Friedman reporting that the Devils are once again showing interest in Conor Garland, and have had talks with VAN. Fitz tried to get him in the offseason before Arizona moved him as well so that makes sense.

Friedman reporting that the Devils are once again showing interest in Conor Garland, and have had talks with VAN. Fitz tried to get him in the offseason before Arizona moved him as well so that makes sense.
- vlongo4419

Wondering what the price tag would be. I like Garland a lot but always depends on the price.

Wondering what the price tag would be. I like Garland a lot but always depends on the price.
- Pomegrant

Zacha and a pick.... Do it Fitz. But being serious, I have no idea. Since it's VAN I assume they'll want a hockey deal and not futures

He's on a good deal now too. 4.95 for 4 more years after this, so I assume it won't be cheap.

Zacha and a pick.... Do it Fitz. But being serious, I have no idea. Since it's VAN I assume they'll want a hockey deal and not futures
- vlongo4419

When Benning was GM he'd probably love a player like Zacha. 3rd line defensive center with marginal offensive upside. Now that they have the culture shift there, who knows. We don't have a lot of interesting assets worth trading outside of the protected core.

When Benning was GM he'd probably love a player like Zacha. 3rd line defensive center with marginal offensive upside. Now that they have the culture shift there, who knows. We don't have a lot of interesting assets worth trading outside of the protected core.
- Pomegrant

Yeah the only reason i think theyd like Zacha is because hes cheaper than Garland, and hockey men like players like him for some reason. One of the big reasons theyre looking to potentially move him and Miller is to clear up some cap space so they have more wiggle room in the future since that OEL boat anchor is unmovable, especially because Pettersson took a bridge.

I honestly dont think Zacha and a pick is too far off, depending on the pick. Maybe someone else but idk. Unless they want a D, then maybe they try to pry Sevo from us? But if we're giving up Sevo, i'd want Boeser. No idea what Rutherford and the rest of that staff are thinking though

No idea what Rutherford and the rest of that staff are thinking though
- vlongo4419

That. Rutherford is notorious for shaking up rosters, sometimes unexpected… who knows what he’s thinking. He’s not afraid to trade anyone and anything for anyone and anything…

Sevs, Zacha, bahl, boqvist and a couple firsts for Quinn Hughes… lol

Then your expectations are just way too high. So thats your own fault. Just because someone is a 1st overall pick doesnt mean theyre going to light the league on fire or be a surefire top line player. Especially when said player wasnt projected to be that, or said player is coming out of a draft that was considered the weakest draft in over a decade, and is also weaker than any draft after it so far as well. His draft position is completely irrelevant.

You need to re-evaluate your expectations and set them more accurately. Its that simple.

We know Zacha and McLeod were bad picks. Theres no hindsight involved there. Everybody i know and talked to wanted multiple other players over both guys. Smith was a good pick, still TBD how that plays out but he was the BPA at his spot and it was a shock that he even fell to us. Holtz and Mercer are good picks, would've still preferred Rossi or Perfetti over Holtz but its still not a bad pick. Luke Hughes was obviously the right pick as well. They all look like they're on the right development path. Outside of the Zacha and McLeod picks, our OWN 1st round picks have been fine tbh.

The issues are when we sell off assets and acquire additional 1sts then throw them away for guys like Mukhamadullin and Stillman when MUCH better players are on the board. Mercer was the only good pick out of three additional 1sts the last few years. On top of everything i said about 2nds and 3rds, thats how you stagnate a rebuild. Our rebuild stagnating has absolutely nothing to do with Jack or Nico.
- vlongo4419

I hear your point about expectations and it’s valid.
I didn’t say the rebuild stagnating had to do with Jack. The nico bit was saying that he simply wasn’t a Crosby, kane, Matthew, McDavid, etc- like how half the other teams land a guy 1st overall who is a game changer for them. I never expected Nico to be that. I was saying the picks over the years have been duds (going back to Matteau and Quenneville-Zacha and McLeod) and when we’re luck enough to pick 1st, we didn’t get one of those superstars. All are variables in the lengthy rebuild. Then you have what trades are made and not made and ufas etc.
Yea I agree with your other points. I think Nico can be a part of a successful future. I feel the same way about Jack, remains to be seen with the rest, but I’m optimistic on them. Stillman was another bang head against the wall pick.

That 6 on 5 at the end was demoralizing to watch. You’d think the Canes had the extra man for that long minute+

I hear your point about expectations and it’s valid.
I didn’t say the rebuild stagnating had to do with Jack. The nico bit was saying that he simply wasn’t a Crosby, kane, Matthew, McDavid, etc- like how half the other teams land a guy 1st overall who is a game changer for them. I never expected Nico to be that. I was saying the picks over the years have been duds (going back to Matteau and Quenneville-Zacha and McLeod) and when we’re luck enough to pick 1st, we didn’t get one of those superstars. All are variables in the lengthy rebuild. Then you have what trades are made and not made and ufas etc.
Yea I agree with your other points. I think Nico can be a part of a successful future. I feel the same way about Jack, remains to be seen with the rest, but I’m optimistic on them. Stillman was another bang head against the wall pick.
- MartysBetter88

The Matteau and Quenneville picks are completely irrelevant. We werent even rebuilding at that time. Those picks are sandwiched between Lou trading a top 10 pick for a goalie. Rebuilding teams dont do that. The rebuild officially started with Zacha in 2015, and our own 1st round picks since 2017 through now have been good. Again, it sucks to have missed on those picks and everybody except our own scouting staff at the time wanted someone else, it goes further beyond just messing up on Zacha and McLeod. Our 2nd and 3rd round picks since 2015 have produced almost nothing for this organization. Thats far more of an issue than our 1sts, BY FAR.

Our 2nd and 3rd since the rebuild started.

2015: 2nd - Blackwood(kinda sucks now?); 3rd - Blake Speers(bust)
2016: 2nd - Bastian(4th liner); 3rd - Joey Anderson(bust)
2017: 2nd - Boqvist(bust); 3rd - Zetterlund(maybe bottom 6er?)
2018: 2nd - Traded; 3rd - Traded
2019: 2nd - Traded our own early 2nd, had Bostons very late 2nd Okhotiuk(bottom pair at best?); 3rd - Misyul(looking like a bust, maybe never coming over from Russia?)
2020: 2nd - Traded; 3rd - Daws(No idea what he becomes, goalie voodoo)
2021: 2nd - Traded; 3rd - Salminen(maybe can become a bottom 6 player)

Having a 6th round pick like Bratt hit and become a legit top 6 winger should be a bonus for teams, but for us its been a necessity because of that right there.

And obviously throw in Muk and Stillman. But that right there. Not a single impact player, or anyone who looks like they have the upside to be an impact player, drafted. That is why this team has not taken a step yet.

Is Misyul the guy who quit hockey to be a social media influencer in Russia? Cause one of our prospects literally did that this season lmao.

Friedman reporting that the Devils are once again showing interest in Conor Garland, and have had talks with VAN. Fitz tried to get him in the offseason before Arizona moved him as well so that makes sense.
- vlongo4419

To add onto this, I just saw a clip of it. He was very specific, and said NJ is talking Garland and possibly other Canucks forward with term and team control... So maybe Boeser?

Is Misyul the guy who quit hockey to be a social media influencer in Russia? Cause one of our prospects literally did that this season lmao.
- Pomegrant

LOL nah I believe it was Nikita Popugaev

LOL nah I believe it was Nikita Popugaev
- vlongo4419

Correct. Made it official in September or October past I believe…

I'm checked out. How many more months of this we got?
- Pomegrant

Years