If he's willing to waive, then he's turning the page and he's done as a Flyer.

Trade and re-sign is a dream. How often has that ever happened?
- Tomahawk

Normally yes, with CC all bets off.

Also keep in mind with how they want to "compete" again next year I can easily see some some mid level player/vet as the return for CC instead of picks/prospects.

Sanheim is an odd case where the advanced stats say one thing and the eye test says something else.
- MBFlyerfan

or like ho wpeople made the argument for Laughton....he was scoring at a high pace 5v5...his numbers were on par or better than g one year....sooooo.....

If he's willing to waive, then he's turning the page and he's done as a Flyer.

Trade and re-sign is a dream. How often has that ever happened?
- Tomahawk

could easily see him waiving and returning due to family. could also see him do the more shane doan or marleau route. sign for a couple more years maybe one or two year deals....then go in a few years.

but...he looks miserable right now like he knows its almost over. just defeat in his face.

or like ho wpeople made the argument for Laughton....he was scoring at a high pace 5v5...his numbers were on par or better than g one year....sooooo.....
- Peter Richards

Lol analytics at its finest

I think it will be to 1 team only if he waives.
- hello it's me 2050

Any guess on what team. That means return will be maybe a 2nd

One day the dummies will come up with a better retort than that.

One day.
- Tomahawk

who needs to retort? It is what it is

Normally yes, with CC all bets off.

Also keep in mind with how they want to "compete" again next year I can easily see some some mid level player/vet as the return for CC instead of picks/prospects.
- hello it's me 2050

They've been saying that "compete" line to him every year since it actually applied. He's certainly not the last person on earth who's realized that the Flyers have wasted almost his entire career.

Any guess on what team. That means return will be maybe a 2nd
- hfc355

i think the teams he would waive for are...toronto (simmer connection), tampa, canes, avs, and maybe vegas, washington.

Could totally see a scenario where G might not want to leave, and Chuck covering for him, would say didnt get a valuable enough offer for G so we are keeping him. Would totally take the heat off of him.

No, that's fair. I believe Fletcher deserves a chance to put his actions where his mouth is and make the right moves to turn this around. If the team is floundering next year then I perceive Fletcher will be fired and I think that would be an appropriate action given the results.
- jd250

We disagree. That's fine.

The Hartnell move didn't work out. Umberger did not help on the ice at basically the identical cap hit for two years, then got bought out. The 2015-16 Flyers were a 96-point playoff team. They could still have used Hartnell that year. And even in his final year in Columbus, when Umberger was being paid 1/3 of his salary on the cap to not play here, at least Hartnell eked out 13 goals and 37 points despite being in Torts' doghouse.

Truth of the matter is that Hexy didn't particularly like having Hartnell in the mix or feel that keep him was conducive to the conditioning/dietary program Ron was implementing here or that he'd be a good influence on getting young players coming into the system to buy into it. Felt Hartsy preferred to go his own way rather than buying in with what Hakstol was trying to do.

The Hartnell for Umberger trade was spun as a cap move. Cap was actually secondary. RJ was always in great shape. Scotty joked about himself and Voracek needing to go to "Fat Camp". Umberger chafed a bit at being on the 4th line while simultaneously taking heat for not scoring anymore; and there was some merit to that complaint but, in all due respect, he was in decline by time he got here.
- bmeltzer

Bill, your insight is awesome and thank you for sharing it with us today after yesterday's press conference.

I know I'm a little late to the conversation but the Umberber/Hartnell trade drove me nuts and I'm a Hextall fan. Question though, you mention Hartnell not buying into what Hakstol was doing? Wasn't Berube still the coach when Hartnell was traded. I was always convinced Berube wasn't thrilled with Hartnell's conditioning. If that's the case, I understand the move, but feel the could have gotten a better return, and if not, just don't make the trade.

Could totally see a scenario where G might not want to leave, and Chuck covering for him, would say didnt get a valuable enough offer for G so we are keeping him. Would totally take the heat off of him.
- bradster

They probably owe him at least that.

Could totally see a scenario where G might not want to leave, and Chuck covering for him, would say didnt get a valuable enough offer for G so we are keeping him. Would totally take the heat off of him.
- bradster

This is Philly. No way it takes heat off anyone

They probably owe him at least that.
- ClaudeFather

they have been paying his salary, that's enough for me. I don't think they owe him anything. But i understand people think that way.

Any guess on what team. That means return will be maybe a 2nd
- hfc355

Not a clue. As I said earlier is he tight with anyone on other teams?

They've been saying that "compete" line to him every year since it actually applied. He's certainly not the last person on earth who's realized that the Flyers have wasted almost his entire career.
- Tomahawk

My problem with CC is he knows he has been wasted. Or he should. Yet he has never asked out. That doesn't sit well with me for that caliber of player.

Exactly, Hexy cared about 200 foot players much more than highly skilled players. He had no balance in his drafting which I think hurt his chances of finding those Kucherov type players.
- jd250

Konecny, Frost and Sanheim were all known as 200 foot players?

They've been saying that "compete" line to him every year since it actually applied. He's certainly not the last person on earth who's realized that the Flyers have wasted almost his entire career.
- Tomahawk

His "entire career" or his prime? Because his NHL coming out party was the 2010 Stanley Cup Finals and he sure as hell wasn't being wasted when the Flyers upset the Penguins in 2012.

Basically, you have to draw a dividing line after 2013-14. Hexy was willing to keep enough in place to at least be a playoff bubble team but his No. 1 priority was the farm system rebuild. Except for trading for Mrazek for the 2018 stretch drive with Elliott and Neuvirth (as always) both dealing with injuries, Ron passed on chances to acquire latter-20s to early 30s vets in exchange for picks/prospects and admitted they might have helped -- with no guarantees -- the team to win a round or even two.

Ron did once say he came close on a blockbuster acquisition but the deal fell through. He never said who it was. The rumor was always Panarin (this is ca. 2017-18 when he was still in Columbus) but that was never confirmed by anyone on the inner circle of the time. Besides, it never seemed like Jarmo was willing to part with Panarin until the bitter end when he walked as a UFA.

His "entire career" or his prime? Because his NHL coming out party was the 2010 Stanley Cup Finals and he sure as hell wasn't being wasted when the Flyers upset the Penguins in 2012.

Basically, you have to draw a dividing line after 2013-14. Hexy was willing to keep enough in place to at least be a playoff bubble team but his No. 1 priority was the farm system rebuild. Except for trading for Mrazek for the 2018 stretch drive with Elliott and Neuvirth (as always) both dealing with injuries, Ron passed on chances to acquire latter-20s to early 30s vets in exchange for picks/prospects and admitted they might have helped -- with no guarantees -- the team to win a round or even two.

Ron did once say he came close on a blockbuster acquisition but the deal fell through. He never said who it was. The rumor was always Panarin (this is ca. 2017-18 when he was still in Columbus) but that was never confirmed by anyone on the inner circle of the time. Besides, it never seemed like Jarmo was willing to part with Panarin until the bitter end when he walked as a UFA.
- bmeltzer

Would you say that was a success?

His "entire career" or his prime?
- bmeltzer

I tossed in that "almost" qualifier to account for his early career.

😉

My problem with CC is he knows he has been wasted. Or he should. Yet he has never asked out. That doesn't sit well with me for that caliber of player.
- hello it's me 2050

He’s just not a selfish player.

My problem with CC is he knows he has been wasted. Or he should. Yet he has never asked out. That doesn't sit well with me for that caliber of player.
- hello it's me 2050

He’s just not a selfish player.

My problem with CC is he knows he has been wasted. Or he should. Yet he has never asked out. That doesn't sit well with me for that caliber of player.
- hello it's me 2050

He’s just not a selfish player.

My problem with CC is he knows he has been wasted. Or he should. Yet he has never asked out. That doesn't sit well with me for that caliber of player.
- hello it's me 2050

Stockholm syndrome can apply to players, too. 🤣

Wow, this is defending is absurd. You inferring how they were alienated is ridiculous. You pick and choose what you want to hear. How about all those other statements I made during his tenure?
- ClaudeFather

No I don't pick and choose what I want to hear. I evaluate everything and come to a conclusion. This franchise has been run the same way with the exception of when Hextall was in charge. With poor results overall since the cap was instituted. It's clear that they need to change. One guy tried to change it. They booted him out went right back to the old way. How is it working? It is crystal clear what the issues are with this organization. It's crystal clear how the teams that are succeeding are run. I don't think Hextall was great or perfect. I think his approach was the correct approach. I think he did a solid job overall and was not given the opportunity to see it through. Which was an obvious mistake.