The Hextall defending is really getting old, the guy sucked, it’s in the past, can we just leave it at that?
- ClaudeFather

What’s getting old dwelling on poop that doesn’t matter anymore. Hextall has been gone 3 or 4 years now.

Gudas had his own issues in his last year here as well. He looks a hell of a lot better then he did here, but who wouldn’t when you consider the roster break down. Look at Montreals, d last year…the reason in my view why they went to the cup. Big, physical, mobile guys. The one thing I agreed with yesterdays presser was that the team is still not hard to play against…guys like Risto are the answer not the problem.
- landros 2

Montreal lost. They rode Price as far as he could take them. How's that big, beefy, old d corps doing this season? How bout the Isles and their beefy old team that Chuck is so fixated on?

It was also mentioned at the time that Hexy didn't appreciate Hartsy being a wisecracking dumbass too, so it was definitely part of the trade calculus.
- Tomahawk

It was. RJ cracks wise, too, just at a lower volume than Scott.

My favorite related story: Flyers used to use powder blue practice jerseys for the 4th line (or sometimes yellow for 4th line, powder blue for extra skaters).

One day, after being in powder blue for several days, RJ quipped "They might as well make it sh*t brown instead of powder blue."

Stuff like that.

There are probably 20-30 players that fit that "physical play" requirement. Most are third pair guys. Most won't be paid $6+ mil a year for that single attribute.
- mickel25

I could not agree more.

Funny, my feeling is exactly the opposite. He is built for putting on a show for the regular season. His severe tactical shortcomings makes him too high a risk for contending teams.

I hope we get to find out who is right soon.
- PT21

Seriously lol

It's like Schenn and Bogosian... some team may be interested in that kind of player for their 6/7 slot, but not at the trade price that the Flyers would expect for RR.

Bill just broke down the Hartnell move at great length. According to Bill it was not just a cap move. I’m gonna go w Bill.
- Joe Nardone

Facts matter to you ?

It was. RJ cracks wise, too, just at a lower volume than Scott.

My favorite related story: Flyers used to use powder blue practice jerseys for the 4th line (or sometimes yellow for 4th line, powder blue for extra skaters).

One day, after being in powder blue for several days, RJ quipped "They might as well make it sh*t brown instead of powder blue."

Stuff like that.
- bmeltzer

😂🤣

There are probably 20-30 players that fit that "physical play" requirement. Most are third pair guys. Most won't be paid $6+ mil a year for that single attribute.
- mickel25

I know that 100%. Want him to answer as he never gives examples but always wants others to then tries to talk down to them when they give an opinion.

Funny, my feeling is exactly the opposite. He is built for putting on a show for the regular season. His severe tactical shortcomings makes him too high a risk for contending teams.

I hope we get to find out who is right soon.
- PT21

How can a player who is continually out of position and has major lapses in coverage be a player built for the playoffs. As you state, most of hits are simply pure entertainment and the majority of the time are ineffective. Hit within the flow of play. Hit to separate the player from the puck. When you run a player after the puck is gone, you're taking yourself out of the play.

Montreal lost. They rode Price as far as he could take them. How's that big, beefy, old d corps doing this season? How bout the Isles and their beefy old team that Chuck is so fixated on?
- Tomahawk

If you watched Montreal last year, especially against Toronto, that d punished their opponents every game. They were hard to play against every shift. Of course Price played great. To say MTL lost is relevant, they beat some really good teams to get there. Yes this year, they are done, take away the best of the bunch, Shea Weber, and that will happen. (And price) As far as the Islanders, I like their d as well. You take away Risto, you take away the most physical guy we have…I’m not saying he’s the best d we have, but the element he brings is something they need. You live with some of the mistakes he makes.

What gets old is the hyperbole and inaccuracies. He didn't suck. Give a fair and accurate analysis. Can you leave it at that?
- MJL

Ok, so he alienated and pissed of everyone. Some of the older guys that’s fine but not your own scouts. He drafted some decent talent, not one guy that can drive a line on his own which is a huge issue for this team. Hart solid. Some crappy signings and cleaned up the cap. So he was extremely average until you come to the blunder at #2 which would bring his regime down to the guy sucked. Is that fair?

What’s getting old dwelling on poop that doesn’t matter anymore. Hextall has been gone 3 or 4 years now.
- SuperSchennBros

Bill’s post above really is a good breakdown…It can really be left at that.

Montreal lost. They rode Price as far as he could take them. How's that big, beefy, old d corps doing this season? How bout the Isles and their beefy old team that Chuck is so fixated on?
- Tomahawk

It's a skating, passing skill game. The prototype NHL defenseman are offensive puck movers and attackers. Even today's "defensive" defenseman have evolved. The best defenders are player like McDonagh, Slavin, Pelech etc. Those are the kind of players you need in your top 4. Neanderthals like Ristolainen aren't what's needed.

I don't agree. But I do think you need a strong top 3 to deploy him effectively as the 4.
- bmeltzer

what part you disagree with?

Yes you need a strong top 3 and a perfect partner for him. I can buy that to an extent. Flyers do not have that.

I think they made some change over the years. But Fletcher pointed out yesterday that he loves his scouting staff for what it’s worth.
- landros 2

Then we all better love being a Columbus blue jackets clone.

If you watched Montreal last year, especially against Toronto, that d punished their opponents every game. They were hard to play against every shift. Of course Price played great. To say MTL lost is relevant, they beat some really good teams to get there. Yes this year, they are done, take away the best of the bunch, Shea Weber, and that will happen. (And price) As far as the Islanders, I like their d as well. You take away Risto, you take away the most physical guy we have…I’m not saying he’s the best d we have, but the element he brings is something they need. You live with some of the mistakes he makes.
- landros 2

It's funny how after they started calling cross checks to the lower back again both of those teams suddenly became ineffective.

We need to stop emulating things that worked in a specific point in time. The league has moved on already.

If Ristolainen want to tests the UFA market, he absolutely needs to be dealt ahead of the deadline. Fletcher wants to resign him -- and made that clear yesterday -- and said that's because the team has a need for physical/competitive players as well as adding more high-end skill. I agree with both, and he put Ristolainen in the correct category, too. He's not, and never will be, a "stats" guy. Doesn't mean there's no value there. I think he's done OK. But certainly hasn't addressed what Plan B was for a workaround if Ellis got injured.

To me, it's a matter of cap hit. I'm fine if they want to give him a three-year deal. But not at a higher cap hit than he's already pulling down.

If he moves on, fine. But he's filled a role the Flyers haven't been able to address since Gudas was here, and he's also better when up-ice than Gudas, although not better in the angles/gaps when defending and more prone to gambling.
- bmeltzer

I agree 100% Bill. Risto has filled a role here, however I am fine if he is gone to UFA because I have been disappointed in a few areas of this game, specifically his PK play and his ability to move the puck up ice. Risto does a great job of hitting players and separating them from the puck, but what he does with the puck once he gets it is typically just a blind push up the boards that routinely gets intercepted by pinching players. I expected more from him in this regard. Also, lately, Risto has not done a good job in net front coverage, I have seen him losing positional battles there which is something he was much better at earlier in the season.

What gets old is the hyperbole and inaccuracies. He didn't suck. Give a fair and accurate analysis. Can you leave it at that?
- MJL

Take your own advice Cliff. You casually leave your Dad out of conversation as to why the flyers are on the mess they are in currently. He shares some of the blame like several others.

Ok, so he alienated and pissed of everyone. Some of the older guys that’s fine but not your own scouts. He drafted some decent talent, not one guy that can drive a line on his own which is a huge issue for this team. Hart solid. Some crappy signings and cleaned up the cap. So he was extremely average until you come to the blunder at #2 which would bring his regime down to the guy sucked. Is that fair?
- ClaudeFather

Do you know what cracks me up? The same guys who say the team is dysfunctional and needs to do everything better. Criticize Hextall for wanting to change everything and in doing so, alienated the same people we are stuck with. Wanted to change how the franchise was run.

We've litigated the 2nd pick numerous times. Hextall picked the player that was a consensus top 2 pick who everybody had as a legit future #1 NHL center.

Gudas is easily the better player over Ristolainen. It's becoming more and more comical every day that Fletcher gave up what he did for Ristolainen. The fact that he want's to re-sign him further proves the incompetence.
- MJL

If you watched Montreal last year, especially against Toronto, that d punished their opponents every game. They were hard to play against every shift. Of course Price played great. To say MTL lost is relevant, they beat some really good teams to get there. Yes this year, they are done, take away the best of the bunch, Shea Weber, and that will happen. (And price) As far as the Islanders, I like their d as well. You take away Risto, you take away the most physical guy we have…I’m not saying he’s the best d we have, but the element he brings is something they need. You live with some of the mistakes he makes.
- landros 2

And Vegas.

But 2 things:

1. First MTL lost, as Tomahawk points out. They were not competitive in the finals. Why exactly do you want to emulate a non-competitive final team's model again?

2. Montreal up front was a tenacious, fast, strong counterattacking/forechecking team. Of the turnovers the physical hits/avoidance produced, they went racing the other way. We don't have that forward corps. A single player is not going to change a team's nature of play. More likely, he will be an ill fitting part.

It's a skating, passing skill game. The prototype NHL defenseman are offensive puck movers and attackers. Even today's "defensive" defenseman have evolved. The best defenders are player like McDonagh, Slavin, Pelech etc. Those are the kind of players you need in your top 4. Neanderthals like Ristolainen aren't what's needed.
- MJL

Yes, the Flyers need to find a Slavin in the worst way.

Hexy -- whom I like, respect and do not believe should be thrown under the bus -- had strengths and weaknesses as a GM. He also is three years removed.

That being said, Hexy didn't do as well at cap management as some say he did.

The Hartnell-for-Umberger trade really saved almost nothing on the cap for two years, and while Hartnell still had two 20-goal and 50-60 point seasons left in him, RJ was no longer effective and ended up being bought out, spreading the remaining cap residuals over two years. That one didn't work out.

Dale Weise at four years for a $2.35M cap hit didn't work out, on or off the ice.

The Andrew MacDonald contract was a) the first major contract negotiated by Hexy (still the assistant GM at the time officially but already chosen behind the scenes as next GM, and empowered to be the one to negotiate it), and b) MacDonald's open-market value that offseason. Detroit, for one, was prepared to offer almost an identical contract if MacDonald had made it to UFA status. Yes, Holmgren was on board with it and still the GM, but Hexy and Homer were in lockstep on this particular deal. Can't blame one and absolve the other.

It was Hexy who negotiated Jakub Voracek's monster extension. But keep in mind that Voracek had just been in the Art Ross Trophy race (leading it, in fact, for several weeks around midseason) leading up to it. Timing matters a lot on contracts. Also, while Voracek may not have been among the absolute elites of the NHL over the bulk of his Flyers years, he was still a good player.

Hexy's timetable to emerge from the "farm system restock" phase to trying to accelerate the push from being a bubble playoff team to a Cup contender had 2018-19 as the key year to take that step. The team was coming off a 98-point season and had blown a big Game 6 lead against Pittsburgh with a Game 7 within reach. The decision to sign JVR was Hexy's. It made sense at the time -- JVR was coming off his career-best year in Toronto, had been a Flyer before, the team needed a goal-scoring winger and it cost no assets to bring him in. The signing in and of itself hasn't been a disaster, but it hasn't really ever worked out as hoped.

Hexy's biggest mistake that offseason, though, was banking on Brian Elliott and Michal Neuvirth to get healthy. The result was the goalie carousel of 2018-19, and it really hastened the end of both Hexy and Hak.

Draft-wise, I don't want to rehash Patrick in 2017 or the 2014 Draft. In 2014, let us not forget that Hexy was prepared to make a push for the top overall pick and taking Ekblad and it was Florida who got cold feet. As for Sanheim vs Pastrnak, well, there were reasons at the time why Pastrnak was still on the board until 11 spots after the Flyers took Sanheim. There's nothing wrong with drafting a defenseman with all the tools that Sanheim had, nor has it been an unsuccesful pick. He's been a double rather than a home run. It happens.

As far as overruling scouts goes, that's a GMs prerogative. In 2011, the Flyers' scouts' consensus leaned toward Jonas Brodin. Paul Holmgren, having just traded Mike Richards and Jeff Carter for the 8th overall pick, said at the final predraft meeting "We need to rethink this." The scouts weighed in again. This time, they elevated Couturier a spot or two and, lo and behold, Homer picked Couturier.

No one has ever second-guessed it because it worked out fine (although Brodin has been a very good defenseman for Minnesota, albeit not a big point producer). Really, though, it wasn't all that different than Hexy leapfrogging the consensus that Heiskanen/Makar were better available prospects at No. 2 than they consensus felt Patrick would be. And there was plenty of justification for taking Patrick. That one just didn't work out. The biggest difference was, with Couturier, the scouts weighed in again (albeit with some arm-twisting) and got on board whereas the Patrick pick was apparently Hexy/Sarge going with Ron's gut feeling on the pick.

That's all back-story, however. There's a different decision-making chain now, a different GM and a mixed track record so far (jury is still out on the 2019 to 2021 drafts, so I'm referring only to NHL-level moves). Cap-wise, Chuck has been bold and spent to the cap ceiling, but Ron would likely have done the same by 2019-20 himself. Maybe not on the same players. Who knows?

What matters now is what the next steps will be. I am a believer in "judge by what they do, not by what they say".
- bmeltzer

Very interesting. Thanks for that, Bill.
I agree with the bold 100%.

Risto is for sure a player built for the playoffs. Playoff hockey is totally different than regular season hockey. One of the reasons Montreal did so well last year.
- bradster

He has schitt for brains. You need hockey sense for playoff hockey. He is a mistake prone dman. He bad outweighs the good

Do you know what cracks me up? The same guys who say the team is dysfunctional and needs to do everything better. Criticize Hextall for wanting to change everything and in doing so, alienated the same people we are stuck with. Wanted to change how the franchise was run.

With litigated the 2nd pick numerous times. Hextall picked the player that was a consensus top 2 pick who everybody had as a legit future #1 NHL center.
- MJL

I just told you I had no issue with him alienating the country club, but when you do it to your own scouts it’s pretty dumb. And it’s his pick to own. I just gave a fair analysis, he sucked, I’m sorry you can’t accept that.