But elite players are typically developed outside the organization. Go find an elite player who has spent more than half a season in the AHL. Most don’t spend anytime.

Drafting is the only plan so why not draft with the higher probability of success. It has worked for the overwhelming majority of Stanley cup winners. You can’t say in one breath that the Flyers drafted the talent of what you expect from the middle of first round and then say they can get elite players there regularly. Either those are traditional the types of talent you get or there are better talent available at those spots and the Flyers drafting has been awful. Which is it?
- psuhockey

You are expecting logical consistency from this guy, you are whistling into the wind.

Those who point to "good players" being drafted outside the top are numbskulls who will never assimilate how low the odds are of that, and how cherry-picking counterexamples do not contradict the concept of odds.

I got the "impression" that Coots and Ellis will be out for the rest of the season. Both should get whatever surgery they need NOW and be ready for next season.
- MBFlyerfan

Ellis will get surgery when the season is over then not be ready until mid camp!!

They’d be crazy not to deal him at the deadline. They can always bid for him again in the off-season. Might as well get the assets
- hereticpride

On a good term at a reasonable cap hit I like the player. At his age he fits. But why would he want this team when he’s only 6 months away from picking his own destination that’s not as inept as the current one he’s in.

If Fletcher pulled those 3 pieces into the organization, he'd be our lord and savior lmao


Fletcher needs to get on the phone with Holland 100%. He just cant help himself making bad deals. Maybe we can trick him into parting with Drasaitl
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

I am most optimistic about the Rangers. Or Leafs. Both are getting impatient imo. Some of the other contenders: Canes, Bolts, Avs... are too canny.

You are expecting logical consistency from this guy, you are whistling into the wind.

Those who point to "good players" being drafted outside the top are numbskulls who will never assimilate how low the odds are of that, and how cherry-picking counterexamples do not contradict the concept of odds.
- PT21

Actually, he is inaccurate in his depiction of my statement. I did not state at any time that you can get elite players regularly in the positions that the Flyers have been drafting on average. You are also inaccurate in stating that others don't undertstand the odds.

Of course you delivered what was expected with again, personal insults levied against others. That's most certainly an expected consistency.

Being a fan of this franchise is like being slowly worn down by the Chinese water torture drops of stupidity.

Not sure how many times I have to state it. I'm aware that the odds of having an elite player are much higher drafting higher in the draft. I'm against tanking and won't support it. I'm not stating that you are wrong if you advocate for it. I don't. We most likely have a different view point on what tanking is.
- MJL

I am just trying to illustrate what a low probability it is to expect the Flyers to actually build a Stanley cup contender without bottoming out or tanking or full rebuild or whatever words you find acceptable to use. Bill and other anti-tankers had used the fear of getting stuck at the bottom for tens year as an argument against completely overlooking the distinct possibility that a team can get trapped in the mediocre middle for ten years as well as this team currently has been and after listening to the press conference today will still be for the foreseeable future. Both carry the same terrible outcome. I choose tanking for high picks because one that’s what the majority of recent Stanley Cup winning teams have done since the salary cap has been instituted and two because the players at the top of the draft bring near instantaneous excitement back to the fans. Say what you want about the failures of Edmonton and Buffalo but has there been anywhere near the excitement of this fan base in the last 10 years as there was for those two franchises when they drafted McDavid and Eichel. Look at what Matthews has done to the Toronto market even though they haven’t won anything. Ovechkin has brought almost two decades of excitement to Washington since 2006 even with all the playoff failures. Patrick Kane and Toews single handedly revitalized the Chicago market even before they won cups. The Flyers need that type of player and they are overwhelmingly only available at the top of the draft. The retool these bozos are offering will be met with more empty rinks.

This is a good quick read

https://flyersnittygritty...extall-had-only-listened/

I dont think he or his wife like it here and he is stringing this out
- RajaAmpat

He can always retire.

Actually, he is inaccurate in his depiction of my statement. I did not state at any time that you can get elite players regularly in the positions that the Flyers have been drafting on average. You are also inaccurate in stating that others don't undertstand the odds.

Of course you delivered what was expected with again, personal insults levied against others. That's most certainly an expected consistency.
- MJL

You are right you never said elite players can be drafted regularly from those spots but that is exactly the plan you are advocating the Flyers take. The front office flat out said today they need 2-3 elite players so the Flyers would have to get lucky 2-3 times outside of the top five. It’s a low percentage of success plan.

I hope so. I want to make it perfectly clear that I was not endorsing what Fletcher said. I want no part of Ristolainen long term.
- MBFlyerfan

And this is the key right here.

Personally I don’t have the same issues with Ristolainen as some of those who are Compulsively obsessed with hating him, both attacking his play and personality. I think there is a lot of give and take in terms of how bad that second pair is. With this said, I’ve seen a lot of strange comparisons of Risto to Andrew MacDonald or Dennis Gauthier. The hate Parade didn’t really begin for MacDonald until he signed along term deal he couldn’t live up to, adding to the fact that he’d been used as a top pair defenseman too often once Timonen left. He offered limited to no offense from the blue line and sent to the minors multiple times. Mac’s journey in Philly direct issue was the long term contract. Gauthier only offered hits and nothing else. He couldn’t score to save his life. In fact I don’t think he has a career goal with the Flyers. Gauthier also had term and was sent down. Ristolianen currently could find his way out without Hassle.

I am just trying to illustrate what a low probability it is to expect the Flyers to actually build a Stanley cup contender without bottoming out or tanking or full rebuild or whatever words you find acceptable to use. Bill and other anti-tankers had used the fear of getting stuck at the bottom for tens year as an argument against completely overlooking the distinct possibility that a team can get trapped in the mediocre middle for ten years as well as this team currently has been and after listening to the press conference today will still be for the foreseeable future. Both carry the same terrible outcome. I choose tanking for high picks because one that’s what the majority of recent Stanley Cup winning teams have done since the salary cap has been instituted and two because the players at the top of the draft bring near instantaneous excitement back to the fans. Say what you want about the failures of Edmonton and Buffalo but has there been anywhere near the excitement of this fan base in the last 10 years as there was for those two franchises when they drafted McDavid and Eichel. Look at what Matthews has done to the Toronto market even though they haven’t won anything. Ovechkin has brought almost two decades of excitement to Washington since 2006 even with all the playoff failures. Patrick Kane and Toews single handedly revitalized the Chicago market even before they won cups. The Flyers need that type of player and they are overwhelmingly only available at the top of the draft. The retool these bozos are offering will be met with more empty rinks.
- psuhockey

Again, I don't think you understand what tanking actually is. Trading off players that aren't in your future for draft picks is not tanking.
The Flyers not that long ago, had the 2nd overall pick in the draft. They used a 7th overall pick for Provorov who I think is an very good player stuck on bad teams. If they don't improve they're likely going to get a top 10 pick in the next draft. Make it count! Make some strong picks in later rounds. Make some smart deals and use cap space to get steals from other teams. That's how most top teams have been built. Of course you have to have the correct management team in place to execute it. We don't.

You are right you never said elite players can be drafted regularly from those spots but that is exactly the plan you are advocating the Flyers take. The front office flat out said today they need 2-3 elite players so the Flyers would have to get lucky 2-3 times outside of the top five. It’s a low percentage of success plan.
- psuhockey

The plan I'm advocating for is a draft and develop approach. Stay out of free agency except for short term low cost stop gaps. Make smart trades. Take advantage of teams that have cap space issues. The exact opposite approach that it appears the Flyers are going to continue to take.

This is a good quick read

https://flyersnittygritty...extall-had-only-listened/
- bradster

this site is trash

You are right you never said elite players can be drafted regularly from those spots but that is exactly the plan you are advocating the Flyers take. The front office flat out said today they need 2-3 elite players so the Flyers would have to get lucky 2-3 times outside of the top five. It’s a low percentage of success plan.
- psuhockey

Sounds to me like they might make a run at an RFA.....

Did the GM or Scott hold themselves accountable in any way?

The plan I'm advocating for is a draft and develop approach. Stay out of free agency except for short term low cost stop gaps. Make smart trades. Take advantage of teams that have cap space issues. The exact opposite approach that it appears the Flyers are going to continue to take.
- MJL

Without bottoming out into the top 3 or at the very least top 5, it’s a low percentage plan.

Again, I don't think you understand what tanking actually is. Trading off players that aren't in your future for draft picks is not tanking.
The Flyers not that long ago, had the 2nd overall pick in the draft. They used a 7th overall pick for Provorov who I think is an very good player stuck on bad teams. If they don't improve they're likely going to get a top 10 pick in the next draft. Make it count! Make some strong picks in later rounds. Make some smart deals and use cap space to get steals from other teams. That's how most top teams have been built. Of course you have to have the correct management team in place to execute it. We don't.
- MJL

trading players for picks is definitely not trying to win now

At this point, would it be a violation on my part to allow my 9 year old son to start rooting for a new team? Or, asked differently, is it child abuse to force him to continue being a Flyers fan knowing very well what lies ahead these next few years?

Sounds to me like they might make a run at an RFA.....
- bradster

Fletcher is the ultimate hockey lifer and go along to get along type of GM. He isn’t going to piss of his fellow GMs with an offersheet. Expect free agents and aging stars on big contracts other teams want to dump if he is going after elite players.

trading players for picks is definitely not trying to win now
- bradster

all semantics with Cliff. Losing is loosing no matter how you slice it.

Did the GM or Scott hold themselves accountable in any way?
- hello it's me 2050

Fletch seemed to.

Dave Scott pulled out every excuse under the sun.

He can always retire.
- landros 2

permanent LTIR trade him to a bottom spender for cap compliance and they LTIR every training camp

At this point, would it be a violation on my part to allow my 9 year old son to start rooting for a new team? Or, asked differently, is it child abuse to force him to continue being a Flyers fan knowing very well what lies ahead these next few years?
- Big_E_88

Im rooting for a new team until this mess sorts itself out.

Rooting for the Flyers now is like being a Washington Football Team fan. What’s the point.

This is a good quick read

https://flyersnittygritty...extall-had-only-listened/
- bradster

Its all hindsight, many gms passed over a lot of the names mentioned