If the last playoffs showed anything, it's that Chiarot can give you 25min of reliable hockey in the playoffs.

That's easily worth a first to some team, at least according to most people reporting him as a prime trade target.

Habs need to rebuild and leave room for Guhle, Romanov and Harris moving forward. Trading him is the right move, even if he's a solid player.
- Scabeh

Sure is.

It's absolutely not a stretch.

My basic argument went to the fact that I wouldn't go out of my way to trade for Primeau - really only because I don't believe in him anymore than the the guys we already have - if Scott can stay healthy (big *IF*), or if Woll develops further, or Kallgren turns out to be a magical overaged signing . .

I see his former accolades. Almost all of these guys have been THE Man on their teams or in their leagues in the past. Let's face it - they are the best of the best (which tells you how much of a fall from grace it really is when they suck at the NHL level - that's a solid kick in the confidence).

So I'm not ignoring your point - it's not without merit - it's just not the sign we want it to be.
- Monkeypunk

you could be right, but the Leafs are going to need some players that are low risk, high reward..
Until the cap goes up, they'll need to find ways to get creative and having players that cost little against the cap and consistently perform well is needed, it will help.

If the Habs are truly entering rebuild territory then the late 1st that he can potentially fetch for them is worth more than Chiarot would be to the team. I think they're pretty thin in the minors or in prospects. You've got Romanov, Suzuki, Caulfield, Guhle . . .I'm not too sure who's after that (I guess Poehling, but he's not wowing anyone these days).
- Monkeypunk

Lots of young guys in the Habs system are at the very least interesting.

Jordan Harris, Struble, Farrell, Guhle, Mailloux (despite everything) are all guys I am interested in watching moving forward.

Though we might lose Harris as a UFA at the end of the year.

Lots of young guys in the Habs system are at the very least interesting.

Jordan Harris, Struble, Farrell, Guhle, Mailloux (despite everything) are all guys I am interested in watching moving forward.

Though we might lose Harris as a UFA at the end of the year.
- Scabeh

giving up on Poehling already? I like it.

Getting rid of Holl isn't the big challenge IMO. The bigger issue is actually getting a replacment that isn't a bigger pile of poop. Chewy for a pick and or prospect falls in the Nick Foligno fail spectrum for me.
- winsix

Exactly. If you have two piles of them, then you're back to sheltering both of them.
Doubt that adds up to a winning formula.

giving up on Poehling already? I like it.
- PatC80

You'll notice I didn't include players currently in the NHL.

Poehling looks like a solid 3rd line centre in the making.

At the very least, a bottom 6 NHL player for sure.

giving up on Poehling already? I like it.
- PatC80

already reached the NHL


on the worst team in the NHL standings

If you measured the difference with a feeler gauge, works out most likely around. .010"
Like we should trade whatever to accomplish so little. Yea baby, let's do it, two steps forward and three back.
- Leafsmart

I don't want the Leafs to make a move just to make a move but if we're being serious, any move improves on Holl.

If the last playoffs showed anything, it's that Chiarot can give you 25min of reliable hockey in the playoffs.

That's easily worth a first to some team, at least according to most people reporting him as a prime trade target.

Habs need to rebuild and leave room for Guhle, Romanov and Harris moving forward. Trading him is the right move, even if he's a solid player.
- Scabeh

Gorton and Hughes are going to be busy. I'm hoping Leafs don't go for Chiarot

This is the problem I'd have in acquiring Chairot. If we have to use that and add a bit, we can come out of this with a player we can go forward with from another team. A player with term is most likely the direction that Kyle will go.

Chairot is not good enough to waste a first. Just sayin'

Thanks man, I enjoy what you bring to this site. Keep it coming.
- Leafsmart

The word is teams don't want term with the flat cap.

Gorton and Hughes are going to be busy. I'm hoping Leafs don't go for Chiarot
- winsix

Well since he's better on the left side, I don't think he's a fit for the Leafs.

I do think you'd need a guy just like him on the right side though.

This is the problem I'd have in acquiring Chairot. If we have to use that and add a bit, we can come out of this with a player we can go forward with from another team. A player with term is most likely the direction that Kyle will go.

Chairot is not good enough to waste a first. Just sayin'

Thanks man, I enjoy what you bring to this site. Keep it coming.
- Leafsmart

I agree. I think we need the 1st. Dubas' and co. have done a pretty solid job of finding potential & talent in the 2nd round (Robertson, Knies, Niemela, Hirvonen). But they've had one first round pick in 3 years (Amirov). Even from the perspective of trade capital they need to get some picks in the 1st round because until they establish themselves, typically the _value_ your former 1sts is greater than then value for your former 2nds, and so on.

This year Toronto only has a 1st, 2nd and 7th. The only way a 1st (late) should go out is if it's also going to bring us an early 2nd in exchange. So if you're doing a deal for a defenseman and you give up the 1st, it's something like 1st + prospect for Player + 2nd, and the value of the prospect is dependent upon the value of the player and I don't think they should move any of the 5 previously mentioned unless the player comes with term and is affordable (I just checked, LA is out of people to trade for).

If the last playoffs showed anything, it's that Chiarot can give you 25min of reliable hockey in the playoffs.

That's easily worth a first to some team, at least according to most people reporting him as a prime trade target.

Habs need to rebuild and leave room for Guhle, Romanov and Harris moving forward. Trading him is the right move, even if he's a solid player.
- Scabeh

Not sure about that, could also get a Hall return as well.

Chychrun will likely completely take a buyer off the market. Lots of D available.

I agree. I think we need the 1st. Dubas' and co. have done a pretty solid job of finding potential & talent in the 2nd round (Robertson, Knies, Niemela, Hirvonen). But they've had one first round pick in 3 years (Amirov). Even from the perspective of trade capital they need to get some picks in the 1st round because until they establish themselves, typically the _value_ your former 1sts is greater than then value for your former 2nds, and so on.

This year Toronto only has a 1st, 2nd and 7th. The only way a 1st (late) should go out is if it's also going to bring us an early 2nd in exchange. So if you're doing a deal for a defenseman and you give up the 1st, it's something like 1st + prospect for Player + 2nd, and the value of the prospect is dependent upon the value of the player and I don't think they should move any of the 5 previously mentioned unless the player comes with term and is affordable (I just checked, LA is out of people to trade for).
- Monkeypunk

I think you are thinking too much of the TDL.

Engvall, Kase, Mrazek...2 out of the 3 likely are traded this offseason for picks.

Also throw in Dermott, likely fetches a mid round pick. Maybe even a few.

You'll notice I didn't include players currently in the NHL.

Poehling looks like a solid 3rd line centre in the making.

At the very least, a bottom 6 NHL player for sure.
- Scabeh

that's fair, but he just turned 23, I think he can only get better..

Not sure about that, could also get a Hall return as well.

Chychrun will likely completely take a buyer off the market. Lots of D available.
- Santo_44

Arizona isn't in a hurry to thradew Chychrun though.

Habs are definetely trading Chiarot.

They'll get their first pick imo.

that's fair, but he just turned 23, I think he can only get better..
- PatC80

And it's becoming obvious that every player on the Habs might do better under new coaching.

Arizona isn't in a hurry to thradew Chychrun though.

Habs are definetely trading Chiarot.

They'll get their first pick imo.
- Scabeh

Idk, everything I read says a deal likely gets done before the TDL.

If so it would be a massive hit to the buyers market.

Then you have guys like Giroux(if he hits the market) and Hertl who would 100% take 1st round picks.

There are just players before Chiarot that will need 1sts to get it done...He is not a player like Giroux or Hertl where the 1st is a guarantee.

The sheer amount of D available waters the D market a bit as well.

Lots of young guys in the Habs system are at the very least interesting.

Jordan Harris, Struble, Farrell, Guhle, Mailloux (despite everything) are all guys I am interested in watching moving forward.

Though we might lose Harris as a UFA at the end of the year.
- Scabeh

We all have those guys though, right? Guhle, I think, is an NHL'er. The others I'm not sure about. I mean, I think Harris and Farrell were probably bottom-6 projects and Farrell is pretty small - but he's on Team USA, so that's gotta count for something (seriously). I'm just discounting Mailloux because I don't want to talk about him, but he's a big guy so he's always got a chance.

Getting rid of Holl isn't the big challenge IMO. The bigger issue is actually getting a replacment that isn't a bigger pile of poop. Chewy for a pick and or prospect falls in the Nick Foligno fail spectrum for me.
- winsix

It's a bigger challenge than it needs to be, though, because he's insanely got a partial no trade list.

And it'd take an absolute miracle for someone to come in and be worse than Holl.

Arizona isn't in a hurry to thradew Chychrun though.

Habs are definetely trading Chiarot.

They'll get their first pick imo.
- Scabeh

If Arizona trades Chychrun, I can only assume the Leafs won't be in on it. I don't see Dubas moving the pieces Arizona would want.

Well since he's better on the left side, I don't think he's a fit for the Leafs.

I do think you'd need a guy just like him on the right side though.
- Scabeh

Agree on getting a dman. It will really depend on the cost, Leafs are thin in draft picks.

I am curious how Habs deal with Carey Price. Can't see him wanting to be part of a 5 year rebuild. Honestly, the Habs are going to suck for some time, even 50% retained to move him to Edmonton or Colorado would help the Habs. Probably off season move, but hard to see him sticking around.

I don't want the Leafs to make a move just to make a move but if we're being serious, any move improves on Holl.
- GreatGigInTheSky

That's my point. We need a bruiser to take some of the load from Muzz. Plus he's got to be defensively aware at the same time.

Probably a package to get it, I'm sure

It's a bigger challenge than it needs to be, though, because he's insanely got a partial no trade list.

And it'd take an absolute miracle for someone to come in and be worse than Holl.
- GreatGigInTheSky

Its only a ten team list and if its a choice of accepting a deal or being on the taxi squad, he'll happily wave it.

I agree. I think we need the 1st. Dubas' and co. have done a pretty solid job of finding potential & talent in the 2nd round (Robertson, Knies, Niemela, Hirvonen). But they've had one first round pick in 3 years (Amirov). Even from the perspective of trade capital they need to get some picks in the 1st round because until they establish themselves, typically the _value_ your former 1sts is greater than then value for your former 2nds, and so on.

This year Toronto only has a 1st, 2nd and 7th. The only way a 1st (late) should go out is if it's also going to bring us an early 2nd in exchange. So if you're doing a deal for a defenseman and you give up the 1st, it's something like 1st + prospect for Player + 2nd, and the value of the prospect is dependent upon the value of the player and I don't think they should move any of the 5 previously mentioned unless the player comes with term and is affordable (I just checked, LA is out of people to trade for).
- Monkeypunk

You probably need to factor in the cost of getting someone to retain salary if they’re looking for serious dude to play on the second pair. Either way, I’m pretty sure it’ll have to be a rental.