You really emphasize my point. The pieces from inside should not be supplemental. They should be the main pieces. If they aren't then you aren't ready yet and you should remain patient.
- MJL

But, the fact is the Flyers do NOT have main pieces coming out of their system. They have not drafted and developed well enough, so what do you do then, wait another decade an hope you get lucky? I think drafting and developing is important and it must improve over what has been done for the past several years, but if being patient means I have to watch what I watched last season again, no thank you!

or they just are not as good as you prop them up to be
- hello it's me 2050

Clearly the players in the Flyers' system were not as good as they were made out to be, otherwise the significant off season moves would not have been made, along with the signing on Hayes and more recently Brassard. What I disagree with is that the Flyers are now somehow in cap jail, which can be no farther from the truth. Fletcher will have tons of cap space after this season, and should have less holes to fill.

What are peoples feelings on this upcoming Canada west road trip?
Edmonton and Mcdavid are unbeaten.
Vancouver best is opening night in our own barn.
Calgary looks better then last year.
I think it’s going to be a very thought trip on the Flyers and could see them easily go 1-2 or 0-2-1.
I just don’t like the speed of other teams they are playing against. We seem to struggle against quick teams with a very good transition game.
I’d be happy to go 1-1-1 honestly.
- Buzzo

I would like the Flyers to be at least 2-1-0 on this trip, and maybe 3-0. The Oilers are off to a fast start, but they still can't play defense, so the Flyers just have to take away time and space from them.

But, the fact is the Flyers do NOT have main pieces coming out of their system. They have not drafted and developed well enough, so what do you do then, wait another decade an hope you get lucky? I think drafting and developing is important and it must improve over what has been done for the past several years, but if being patient means I have to watch what I watched last season again, no thank you!
- jd250

I'm going to throw something out because I feel I fall in the middle of both of these approaches.

Drafting and developing always needs to be a primary focus, the latter of which the Flyers do indeed need to improve on. I will also say, that its quite hard to build a talented enough core while picking near the middle of the first round. The Flyers sadly do not have a concrete idea of what that future young core will be. We are not at the point where only a tweak or two is needed. There does need to be some sort of aggression, to gather some higher level talent.

As an example, I look at a team like the Senators currently. Likely to pick around that 6th overall mark, but at some point Melnyk does need to mandate a step forward there too. Its where I'd like the Flyers to be aggressive.

Sanheim with the emergence of York and Zamula does become a calculated risk in moving. In a package deal with the Flyers 1st rounder, and perhaps other components to the overall deal, its the kind of move I think the Flyers need to look at making.

Where did I say he had no coaching experience? Please show me that.

Berube was also a top assistant, not low level. Go flyers. Lappy rules.
- hello it's me 2050

Well let’s go over this again with your original post.

Baffles me how you hire a guy with zero head coaching experience to lead the charge to develop your prospects. That decision makes zero sense then and now. What did or has "lappy" done to warrant getting that job?

Samu needs to go to juniors where he can you hope flourish. AHL is not for him imo.

They have some good quality AHL vets that shouldn't be struggling this bad.
- hello it's me 2050

Lappy was the Flyers player development coach which qualifies him to develop and an NHL assistant head coach, which logic might tell you, the next step might be head coach. What’s lazy is your lack of logic.

You really emphasize my point. The pieces from inside should not be supplemental. They should be the main pieces. If they aren't then you aren't ready yet and you should remain patient.
- MJL

In my eyes the main pieces are the TK farabee , still Coots, Provy Sanheim Hart. All those guys, some very good players going forward. We have some good older guys too in Ellis G . We brought in supplemental players in Risto Yandle Brass Atkinson, what we are missing is impact players on ELCs, the young guys who contribute and on cheaper deals whether they are ELC or a second contract. We just don’t have that.

Well let’s go over this again with your original post.




Lappy was the Flyers player development coach which qualifies him to develop and an NHL assistant head coach, which logic might tell you, the next step might be head coach. What’s lazy is your lack of logic.
- SuperSchennBros

what part of zero head coaching experience was misleading holmes?

No it doesn't qualify him if he was bad or incompetent at his job. How long did he last in the development role? Why was he taken out of it? What exactly was his role?

He has been moved around as an assistant. Never promoted to top assistant. Even demoted. Yep it was a great hire.

I'm going to throw something out because I feel I fall in the middle of both of these approaches.

Drafting and developing always needs to be a primary focus, the latter of which the Flyers do indeed need to improve on. I will also say, that its quite hard to build a talented enough core while picking near the middle of the first round. The Flyers sadly do not have a concrete idea of what that future young core will be. We are not at the point where only a tweak or two is needed. There does need to be some sort of aggression, to gather some higher level talent.

As an example, I look at a team like the Senators currently. Likely to pick around that 6th overall mark, but at some point Melnyk does need to mandate a step forward there too. Its where I'd like the Flyers to be aggressive.

Sanheim with the emergence of York and Zamula does become a calculated risk in moving. In a package deal with the Flyers 1st rounder, and perhaps other components to the overall deal, its the kind of move I think the Flyers need to look at making.
- FlyerFan3260

Its possible. The thing is, the Flyers do have options and flexibility. Right now they are projected to have $20M come off the books next season, and another $7M if they trade JVR like I think they will, then decide if they want to resign G and RR and if so for how much. Also York and Zamula should be ready to step in and play for the big club by then, and there is also the possibility the Flyers go with a young goalie from their system to fill the backup spot, saving even more money. So I think any direction this team wants to go to continue to build a true contender can happen, there are no restrictions!

In my eyes the main pieces are the TK farabee , still Coots, Provy Sanheim Hart. All those guys, some very good players going forward. We have some good older guys too in Ellis G . We brought in supplemental players in Risto Yandle Brass Atkinson, what we are missing is impact players on ELCs, the young guys who contribute and on cheaper deals whether they are ELC or a second contract. We just don’t have that.
- ClaudeFather

Yup, we really have not had any luck in regards to an impact ELC, except maybe Farabee who is on the last year on his ELC. Teams like Tampa got lucky with Kucherov and Point, and not many teams can find impact players without picking in the top 10 or even top 5. Patrick was supposed to be this player for us, and, well, we know how that worked out.

I think it’s very difficult when it is time to actually take that next step. Flyers probably thought a guy like Frost was ready to take the reigns, he’s on the verge of being a guy that might never make it. I think the prospect pool was thought of very highly the past few years, and that might not be the case. I worry we are in a spot that we made the move to take that next step and the supplemental pieces will never be there from inside the organization.
- ClaudeFather

in the off season I said after this season we would have a close to final grade on Hextalls draft. If Frost stagnates, TK doesn't get into form, Allison stays hurt etc etc, Hextall goes from a little better than average to slightly below average. Which in the end really has an impact on the current Flyers.

Yup, we really have not had any luck in regards to an impact ELC, except maybe Farabee who is on the last year on his ELC. Teams like Tampa got lucky with Kucherov and Point, and not many teams can find impact players without picking in the top 10 or even top 5. Patrick was supposed to be this player for us, and, well, we know how that worked out.
- jd250

is it lack of luck or incompetence on the flyers end? Or both?

Allison is not on LTIR. He is on SOIR. I agree that the 3rd line doesn't have chemistry. They do need a puck carrier. I think Lindblom is fine individually. That line as a whole just doesn't have much chemistry offensively. You have two players who are forecheckers and net crashers in Laughton and Lindblom and then you have another player who can score but needs a set up guy. Hayes is a puck carrier and he may start out on that line when he comes back. We'll see.
- MJL

What is SOIR ?

What is SOIR ?
- BluehorseShoe64

Season Opening Injured Reserve.

is it lack of luck or incompetence on the flyers end? Or both?
- hello it's me 2050

How is it on the FLyers?

Who should they have picked over Patrick?

See, this where I disagree with you. This happened this off-season, but happening once in what, the past decade?, does not equate to a trend or a drastic shift in team plans. Fletcher had no choice this off season, the vibe on his team had to be addressed. There were several huge holes on this team, and clearly no young prospects or players to fill them all, in fact, as we saw this camp, a player like Frost could not even make the team. Fletcher had to fill these holes with outside players, there were no other options. Now I believe there is a some stability on this team, and they can now at least contend in their division, maybe even more. There is no doubt drafting and developing must continue, and be a lot more effective than it has been so far, if this team is going to grow, but I think its an exaggeration to state that the Flyers have changed their direction and want to sign and trade their way to a cup. Again, if the moves made by Fletcher this off season were not made, you can forget about signing Coots and Farabee to long term, team-friendly deals!
- jd250

No it started before that. They signed Hayes to a long term 7 year deal two seasons ago. Traded for Justin Braun. Whenever I read that it was just one off season I wonder if any thought is given to the future? If the Flyers fall short this season, what is going to be their response? Are they just going to stand pat or are they going to continue to be aggressive. What if they're in a playoff race this season? Are they going to trade more future assets at the deadline if they can? Move out more young players with impatience? I agree that Fletcher had to make moves but not strictly for hockey reasons. He was forced by upper management and mandated. Is that going to end after one off season? Such tunnel vision to think it's only one off season.
I also disagree that they wouldn't have been able to sign Couturier and Farabee to the same deals. That's absurd. Farabee was offered 5M a year after one 20 goal season. He's going to pass that up? To do what? Hold out? LOL. Couturier is a Flyer and wants to be a Flyers his whole career.

But, the fact is the Flyers do NOT have main pieces coming out of their system. They have not drafted and developed well enough, so what do you do then, wait another decade an hope you get lucky? I think drafting and developing is important and it must improve over what has been done for the past several years, but if being patient means I have to watch what I watched last season again, no thank you!
- jd250

So Frost, Foerster, Tuomaala, York, Zamula and Allison aren't potential main pieces? How about a player they draft first overall in the upcoming draft? Last season was an anomaly.

Clearly the players in the Flyers' system were not as good as they were made out to be, otherwise the significant off season moves would not have been made, along with the signing on Hayes and more recently Brassard. What I disagree with is that the Flyers are now somehow in cap jail, which can be no farther from the truth. Fletcher will have tons of cap space after this season, and should have less holes to fill.
- jd250

Maybe but again, have to make projections and look at the move they made. The Flyers are a cap team and will be again next year. You're assuming that the Flyers can move JVR without taking money back. You're also assuming that Giroux is going to take a cheap deal.

So Frost, Foerster, Tuomaala, York, Zamula and Allison aren't potential main pieces? How about a player they draft first overall in the upcoming draft? Last season was an anomaly.
- MJL

anyone can be a potential main piece. Just like JOB Rubstov Ginning Isaac NAK Labarge were potential main pieces.

How is it on the FLyers?

Who should they have picked over Patrick?
- opeth_pa

go re read the post I responded to. Not just about Patrick at all.

In my eyes the main pieces are the TK farabee , still Coots, Provy Sanheim Hart. All those guys, some very good players going forward. We have some good older guys too in Ellis G . We brought in supplemental players in Risto Yandle Brass Atkinson, what we are missing is impact players on ELCs, the young guys who contribute and on cheaper deals whether they are ELC or a second contract. We just don’t have that.
- ClaudeFather

Not yet so why make all the moves and cap out? To be a playoff bubble team. With each year those players get older. Pretty soon Kevin Hayes is a 7M a year role player.

No it started before that. They signed Hayes to a long term 7 year deal two seasons ago. Traded for Justin Braun. Whenever I read that it was just one off season I wonder if any thought is given to the future? If the Flyers fall short this season, what is going to be their response? Are they just going to stand pat or are they going to continue to be aggressive. What if they're in a playoff race this season? Are they going to trade more future assets at the deadline if they can? Move out more young players with impatience? I agree that Fletcher had to make moves but not strictly for hockey reasons. He was forced by upper management and mandated. Is that going to end after one off season? Such tunnel vision to think it's only one off season.
I also disagree that they wouldn't have been able to sign Couturier and Farabee to the same deals. That's absurd. Farabee was offered 5M a year after one 20 goal season. He's going to pass that up? To do what? Hold out? LOL. Couturier is a Flyer and wants to be a Flyers his whole career.
- MJL

Hayes was signed because Saint Ronnie drafted damaged goods. So there was logic behind it.

Braun was a good trade. The young D were getting eaten alive and had no solid vet leaders to help them along. That Braun trade has really set this organization back. let me tell you. Braun also wasnt on a long term contract.

Its possible. The thing is, the Flyers do have options and flexibility. Right now they are projected to have $20M come off the books next season, and another $7M if they trade JVR like I think they will, then decide if they want to resign G and RR and if so for how much. Also York and Zamula should be ready to step in and play for the big club by then, and there is also the possibility the Flyers go with a young goalie from their system to fill the backup spot, saving even more money. So I think any direction this team wants to go to continue to build a true contender can happen, there are no restrictions!
- jd250

Incorrect. With JVR, the Flyers are projected to have 13M of cap space. Needing to re-sign Giroux, Ristolainen and a backup goalie. Also have to decide about Braun and Yandle.

Not yet so why make all the moves and cap out? To be a playoff bubble team. With each year those players get older. Pretty soon Kevin Hayes is a 7M a year role player.
- MJL

I think part of it is anticipation of a guy like Frost, thinking he’d be ready at some point, you sign an insurance policy with a guy like Brass. I also think these moves were geared toward being a top team in the metro, time will tell. The team is playing decent, definitely some things to clean up but I like what I’m seeing from Hart outside of the 1 period in Vancouver.

Hayes was signed because Saint Ronnie drafted damaged goods. So there was logic behind it.

Braun was a good trade. The young D were getting eaten alive and had no solid vet leaders to help them along. That Braun trade has really set this organization back. let me tell you. Braun also wasnt on a long term contract.
- hello it's me 2050

Braun has more than justified his trade imo

What are peoples feelings on this upcoming Canada west road trip?
Edmonton and Mcdavid are unbeaten.
Vancouver best is opening night in our own barn.
Calgary looks better then last year.
I think it’s going to be a very thought trip on the Flyers and could see them easily go 1-2 or 0-2-1.
I just don’t like the speed of other teams they are playing against. We seem to struggle against quick teams with a very good transition game.
I’d be happy to go 1-1-1 honestly.
- Buzzo

I agree...this will be a tough roadtrip.

The Oilers despite any issues on the back end, will be tough. They will be very well rested, not having played since Friday, and Koskinen has played extremely well in place of Smith. Throw their speed in the mix and it could spell trouble for the Flyers. The Flyers need to have a huge game, and come ready to play from opening puck drop. Match the effort that McDavid and crew are guaranteed to bring. Special teams will be key. A win there can set the tone for the rest of the trip.

Having a back to back with Vancouver could be troublesome, as the Canucks have an off day. Won't be surprised if Demko stands on his head.

And Calgary is your typical Sutter team. Muller has done a good job on that staff too. They know their identity and know the type of game they need to play to win. Hard working, solid forecheck and solid defense, and Markstrom in net. Huge effort and solid team game will be needed from the Flyers or the Flames will outwork them.