I was thinking about it and i really thought the Blackhawks would of struggled to score last year. They almost scored 3 points per game, without Toews and technically Dach.

I for sure think JC is really good at coaching offense, our problem has been giving up over 3 goals per game the past few years.

This year will be interesting for sure and in a way think Jones coming here and JC coaching will actually help him offensively. We'll see.

I was thinking about it and i really thought the Blackhawks would of struggled to score last year. They almost scored 3 points per game, without Toews and technically Dach.

I for sure think JC is really good at coaching offense, our problem has been giving up over 3 goals per game the past few years.

This year will be interesting for sure and in a way think Jones coming here and JC coaching will actually help him offensively. We'll see.
- BetweenTheDots

This can't possibly happen. It's a foregone conclusion that every aspect of the Hawks will suck this year and will continue to until there is a new GM, coach, staff, pipeline and roster.

Hopefully that takes covers everything so that we can actually get to discussing your points.

This can't possibly happen. It's a foregone conclusion that every aspect of the Hawks will suck this year and will continue to until there is a new GM, coach, staff, pipeline and roster.

Hopefully that takes covers everything so that we can actually get to discussing your points.
- Chunk

That last paragraph, hahaha

I also think our group of forwards are better than last year, and last years forwards would of been better than the year before if Toews and Dach played.

I was thinking about it and i really thought the Blackhawks would of struggled to score last year. They almost scored 3 points per game, without Toews and technically Dach.

I for sure think JC is really good at coaching offense, our problem has been giving up over 3 goals per game the past few years.

This year will be interesting for sure and in a way think Jones coming here and JC coaching will actually help him offensively. We'll see.
- BetweenTheDots

One thing to remember about last year is that the PP was astonishing for the first 1/4-1/3 of the season, so that skewed the numbers a bit. That said, they still scored those goals. I don't like the argument that 5v5 is the end all-be all when evaluating a team. How many games were there last year with no penalties called. If any, I would bet you can count them on one hand. Special teams are an important part of every team.

I personally don't care too much about shot totals unless I know the context of the game. Did one team score 4 in the first? Were the shots close, but one team was leading by 2 going into the third, etc? I'll be most interested in how the team defends as a unit, how the PK looks/performs and if they can get some production from all four lines.

This can't possibly happen. It's a foregone conclusion that every aspect of the Hawks will suck this year and will continue to until there is a new GM, coach, staff, pipeline and roster.

Hopefully that takes covers everything so that we can actually get to discussing your points.
- Chunk

You forgot new anthem singer, Zamboni driver, and beer vendor!

This can't possibly happen. It's a foregone conclusion that every aspect of the Hawks will suck this year and will continue to until there is a new GM, coach, staff, pipeline and roster.

Hopefully that takes covers everything so that we can actually get to discussing your points.
- Chunk

Oi Vey! You just pulled everybody off the ledge...

You forgot new anthem singer, Zamboni driver, and beer vendor!
- powerenforcer

One thing to remember about last year is that the PP was astonishing for the first 1/4-1/3 of the season, so that skewed the numbers a bit. That said, they still scored those goals. I don't like the argument that 5v5 is the end all-be all when evaluating a team. How many games were there last year with no penalties called. If any, I would bet you can count them on one hand. Special teams are an important part of every team.

I personally don't care too much about shot totals unless I know the context of the game. Did one team score 4 in the first? Were the shots close, but one team was leading by 2 going into the third, etc? I'll be most interested in how the team defends as a unit, how the PK looks/performs and if they can get some production from all four lines.
- Chunk

The PP died about the time Kane got hurt once we found out he was hurt. The second half the PP was so bad not giving up a short handed goal was a good PP.

God forbid dare I say it, I think Keith has always sucked quarterbacking the PP. It was bad even when we were winning cups which never made sense when you looked at the Forward personnel? Coaches were blamed but at the end of the day, players play and coaches coach. If something is bad I believe in looking at the players.

Special teams are very important we lost a lot of games with a terrible PK 2018-Now. Some of it was defensive personnel (many rookies and AHL players) oriented but a lot had to do with Hossa leaving. We've had Forwards try it recently who were PK'ers in the past. But were they good PK'ers? Anyone can PK, not giving up goals is what counts.

The PP died about the time Kane got hurt once we found out he was hurt. The second half the PP was so bad not giving up a short handed goal was a good PP.

God forbid dare I say it, I think Keith has always sucked quarterbacking the PP. It was bad even when we were winning cups which never made sense when you looked at the Forward personnel? Coaches were blamed but at the end of the day, players play and coaches coach. If something is bad I believe in looking at the players.

Special teams are very important we lost a lot of games with a terrible PK 2018-Now. Some of it was defensive personnel (many rookies and AHL players) oriented but a lot had to do with Hossa leaving. We've had Forwards try it recently who were PK'ers in the past. But were they good PK'ers? Anyone can PK, not giving up goals is what counts.
- rpeters01

I really don’t think you are going to get many arguments about Keith’s issues on the PP. it doesn’t make him a bad player. It just was a flaw in his game. Even the best are allowed to have them.

Good point about the PP the second half of the year, although I think they started to pick it up again toward the end of the year?

Do you consider the Hawks current D (top four at least) to be NHL quality?

I believe that the Hawks currently have three quality top four defensemen in McCabe, Murphy, and Jones, with two or three others maybe capable of stepping up, but not a given. I’d like to see Stan extend Murphy for three more years, hopefully to a reasonable aav.

I believe that the Hawks currently have three quality top four defensemen in McCabe, Murphy, and Jones, with two or three others maybe capable of stepping up, but not a given. I’d like to see Stan extend Murphy for three more years, hopefully to a reasonable aav.
- Angotti

What’s reasonable?

I really don’t think you are going to get many arguments about Keith’s issues on the PP. it doesn’t make him a bad player. It just was a flaw in his game. Even the best are allowed to have them.

Good point about the PP the second half of the year, although I think they started to pick it up again toward the end of the year?

Do you consider the Hawks current D (top four at least) to be NHL quality?
- Chunk

Keith was a great defenseman and for most of his career offensively piled up tons of assists. It was only the PP I was referring too.

If McCabe and de Haan are healthy our "top 4" are real NHL defensemen. In reality, McCabe and Murphy you would like to play 2nd pairing (I don't mean together only that's about where they top out), and de Haan 3rd pairing. Are they great? Probably average which is a far cry from where we have been the last two years. They won't be the quickest group but they shouldn't get pushed around either. I don't want to hear JC blamed for his "f'ing system" at the end of the day they're hockey players the other team gets paid to score and you have to stop them.

I believe that the Hawks currently have three quality top four defensemen in McCabe, Murphy, and Jones, with two or three others maybe capable of stepping up, but not a given. I’d like to see Stan extend Murphy for three more years, hopefully to a reasonable aav.
- Angotti

There's a loaded term if I ever saw one.

I'm bullish on Stillman. He showed competence in his own end and was able to not be completely devoid in the O-zone. I really like Kalynuk (even if he does not start the season with the Hawks). I expect much better overall defensive results this year. I like the forward and D options much better individually and as a group. I like that Strome, Nylander and Borgstrom (not to mention any of the D prospects) will all have to prove that they belong in order to get on the ice.

What’s reasonable?
- Ogilthorpe2

I expect he's going to hit ~$5M aav give or take a few bucks.

Keith was a great defenseman and for most of his career offensively piled up tons of assists. It was only the PP I was referring too.

If McCabe and de Haan are healthy our "top 4" are real NHL defensemen. In reality, McCabe and Murphy you would like to play 2nd pairing (I don't mean together only that's about where they top out), and de Haan 3rd pairing. Are they great? Probably average which is a far cry from where we have been the last two years. They won't be the quickest group but they shouldn't get pushed around either. I don't want to hear JC blamed for his "f'ing system" at the end of the day they're hockey players the other team gets paid to score and you have to stop them.
- rpeters01

Um... er... yeah. I don't have anything to add. That was perfect (in my best James Carville voice).

The PP died about the time Kane got hurt once we found out he was hurt. The second half the PP was so bad not giving up a short handed goal was a good PP.

God forbid dare I say it, I think Keith has always sucked quarterbacking the PP. It was bad even when we were winning cups which never made sense when you looked at the Forward personnel? Coaches were blamed but at the end of the day, players play and coaches coach. If something is bad I believe in looking at the players.

Special teams are very important we lost a lot of games with a terrible PK 2018-Now. Some of it was defensive personnel (many rookies and AHL players) oriented but a lot had to do with Hossa leaving. We've had Forwards try it recently who were PK'ers in the past. But were they good PK'ers? Anyone can PK, not giving up goals is what counts.
- rpeters01

As much i like Keith, he has a ton of miles on him and the superior quick twitch ability he had over other professional athletes is gone now.

Don't know about McCabe but if he's a really good dman without the puck the Hawks defense is so much better this year.

It would be really nice if Kalynuk or some other dman steps up and can play a very competent 20 minutes a night.

With MAF and Lanky we might actually be able to win more games 2-1 or 3-2.

I expect he's going to hit ~$5M aav give or take a few bucks.
- rpeters01

Jesus, don't say that around Dots. He's gonna have a coronary!

Jesus, don't say that around Dots. He's gonna have a coronary!
- Chunk

If he doesn't sign, do they trade him at the dead line, if they aren't in the playoff race

If he doesn't sign, do they trade him at the dead line, if they aren't in the playoff race
- BetweenTheDots

I would guess that would depend on how likely they feel they would be able to sign him in the offseason. It would also depend on how they feel about what they have in house to replace him.

Just watching how Stan has operated the last two years, I would say he would more than likely be gone.

What’s reasonable?
- Ogilthorpe2

=<$5M

I would guess that would depend on how likely they feel they would be able to sign him in the offseason. It would also depend on how they feel about what they have in house to replace him.

Just watching how Stan has operated the last two years, I would say he would more than likely be gone.
- Chunk

And also how Mitchell/Kalnyuk/Beaudin are progressing .

And also how Mitchell/Kalnyuk/Beaudin are progressing .
- LAHawk

Yup. I considered them part of the "in house" options.

I would guess that would depend on how likely they feel they would be able to sign him in the offseason. It would also depend on how they feel about what they have in house to replace him.

Just watching how Stan has operated the last two years, I would say he would more than likely be gone.
- Chunk

Agreed, especially if they have someone else stepping up. Mitchell, Kalynuk and Beaudin are the usual suspects.

Since the last three of us said this i just noticed I'll add we're assuming Stillman and the other Jones are "ok" and no significant injuries.

I expect he's going to hit ~$5M aav give or take a few bucks.
- rpeters01

Let him walk if he wants that for 4th d man who not good skater and is aging with back concerns. Trade at the tdl this year and see what you can get. Imo

Let him walk if he wants that for 4th d man who not good skater and is aging with back concerns. Trade at the tdl this year and see what you can get. Imo
- Scott1977

Travis Sandheim just signed for $4.7M, Rasmus Anderson $4.55, Oleksiak $4.6, Goligoski $ 5 mil. , Leddy $5.5, Schmidt $5.95, Tyler Myers $6 mil, etc. etc, Murphy if he goes free agent would definitely get $5 mil.