Or they have soured on Frost and it isn't shoulder related.
- hello it's me 2050

Frost has given them no reason to sour on him unless it's the shoulder. Nor have they ever indicated that. He's their top prospect and will be an important of our future. If they trade him, I consider that a big mistake.

Ok, good points. Well my first hope is Fletcher can trade the pick, but I like that he has taken a firm stand to not trade it simply for cap relief. I guess in the end getting another really good prospect is not a bad result.
- jd250

What return are you looking for by trading our first round pick? Just curious.

If you are referring to Myers or Patrick, any criticism of them had absolutely NOTHING to do with Covid. I know when players have the goods and when they don't, and these two players IMO don't have the goods and were the worst two players on the Flyers last year, and that is saying something because there was a lot of badness to choose from. Going into last season I am sure you will recall I was very critical of both Patrick and Myers, and you killed me for it. But in the end, Fletcher saw what I saw and they are both gone. As for Hart, he could have played better, no doubt about it, but he was more impacted by the continuous bad, and at times comical, play in front of him. I am banking on Hart rebounding because 1. I think he has the goods and 2. the play in front of him will be much improved.
- jd250

those 2 were horrible last year, they deserve the criticism. Not sure how other teams can perform well with covid, but its an excuse for us. Weird. The lack of compete and same mistakes over and over i dont think can be blamed on covid

Frost has given them no reason to sour on him unless it's the shoulder. Nor have they ever indicated that. He's their top prospect and will be an important of our future. If they trade him, I consider that a big mistake.
- dubc55

They can sour on one for many reasons. If they trade him it wont be a mistake until you see the return. Jury is still out on him big time. Lots to prove.

those 2 were horrible last year, they deserve the criticism. Not sure how other teams can perform well with covid, but its an excuse for us. Weird. The lack of compete and same mistakes over and over i dont think can be blamed on covid
- bradster

covid and flat cap are what Flyers fans like to use more than anyone it seems.

They can sour on one for many reasons. If they trade him it wont be a mistake until you see the return. Jury is still out on him big time. Lots to prove.
- hello it's me 2050

Fair enough.

covid and flat cap are what Flyers fans like to use more than anyone it seems.
- hello it's me 2050

its convenient.
ITs funny how Hextall was the one to clean up our mess. He did an OK job restocking our pipeline, maybe a little less than ok. But he signed Ghost, Jake, JVR etc....everyone we are trying to unload.

If you are referring to Myers or Patrick, any criticism of them had absolutely NOTHING to do with Covid. I know when players have the goods and when they don't, and these two players IMO don't have the goods and were the worst two players on the Flyers last year, and that is saying something because there was a lot of badness to choose from. Going into last season I am sure you will recall I was very critical of both Patrick and Myers, and you killed me for it. But in the end, Fletcher saw what I saw and they are both gone. As for Hart, he could have played better, no doubt about it, but he was more impacted by the continuous bad, and at times comical, play in front of him. I am banking on Hart rebounding because 1. I think he has the goods and 2. the play in front of him will be much improved.
- jd250

Agreed! I can't believe people were still babying Patrick. He very well may have been the worst forward in the entire NHL last season. Enough is enough! He probably won't be in the league in a few years. Myers took a major step back last year and that has to be concerning. He seems to really lack hockey IQ and I'm not sure that can be fixed. I wanted them to trade Ghost a couple years ago when he still had value......oh well. At least they haven't lost anyone off the roster so far that I will miss.

its convenient.
ITs funny how Hextall was the one to clean up our mess. He did an OK job restocking our pipeline, maybe a little less than ok. But he signed Ghost, Jake, JVR etc....everyone we are trying to unload.
- bradster

I am not going to totally grill him on those signings. JVR for all the grief he gets is steady and was a market deal. Have no issue keeping him. Now at that time i would have passed on him.

Jake never liked the deal from day 1 as he never earned that type of deal to me. Yes he produces though many just fail to realize there is more to hockey than just points.

Ghost he took a shot and gambled. His injury history just had more of a negative effect than anything. Got him for his prime years. I understand why he signed him. Just didn't pan out. AV doesn't like him for whatever reason and imo never utilized him the way he should.

Would love to see them move up for one of these D men but I’m not sure how they do it without moving a future 1st. Frost, York, Foerster untouchables obviously

Would love to see them move up for one of these D men but I’m not sure how they do it without moving a future 1st.
- hereticpride

Flyers first? Usually underwhelming. And I am not including Patrick

Would love to see them move up for one of these D men but I’m not sure how they do it without moving a future 1st. Frost, York, Foerster untouchables obviously
- hereticpride

Why is Frost an untouchable?

https://theathletic.com/2...p-move/?source=dailyemail

Good write on the why of the Ghost trade. A little in case you don't use the Athletic

OK, so sure, the Flyers needed to clear cap space, York is on the way and Gostisbehere was a clear change-of-scenery candidate. But even with all of that in mind, why were the Flyers forced to send a second- and a seventh-round pick to the Coyotes just for them to take him? After all, Gostisbehere had a solid bounce-back campaign, and he’s still a useful defenseman— right? Was his $4.5 million cap hit really that onerous?

At the very least, it doesn’t track with Dom Luszczyszyn’s GSVA model. While it does project Gostisbehere to deliver slightly negative value relative to his cap hits across the next two seasons, we’re talking about $8.5 million worth of projected value against $9 million of actual cost. Is $500,000 of excess price really worth a second-round pick?

Why is Frost an untouchable?
- hello it's me 2050

Because HeX gave up a now SC winner in Brayden Schenn for him! And Hex has built this version of the flyers. Not perfect as we see now.

Would love to see them move up for one of these D men but I’m not sure how they do it without moving a future 1st. Frost, York, Foerster untouchables obviously
- hereticpride

Just going to get a little creative here. If we include Sanheim in that trade along with our 1st this year, we can save around 4mil with Sanheim gone. Use that money plus our other cap space from the Ghost trade towards another high end Dman. A lot would be riding on York being successful. Then we plug in a number 5 or 6 defender for cheap.

So we get another good Dman for right now and a future top prospect on D.

https://theathletic.com/2723692/2021/07/22/why-the-flyers-paid-the-price-to-trade-shayne-gostisbehere-to-coyotes-this-is-purely-a-cap-move/?source=dailyemail

Good write on the why of the Ghost trade. A little in case you don't use the Athletic

OK, so sure, the Flyers needed to clear cap space, York is on the way and Gostisbehere was a clear change-of-scenery candidate. But even with all of that in mind, why were the Flyers forced to send a second- and a seventh-round pick to the Coyotes just for them to take him? After all, Gostisbehere had a solid bounce-back campaign, and he’s still a useful defenseman— right? Was his $4.5 million cap hit really that onerous?

At the very least, it doesn’t track with Dom Luszczyszyn’s GSVA model. While it does project Gostisbehere to deliver slightly negative value relative to his cap hits across the next two seasons, we’re talking about $8.5 million worth of projected value against $9 million of actual cost. Is $500,000 of excess price really worth a second-round pick?
- wcorvette

Like chuckles would use the GSVA model

He is always the smartest guy in the room

https://theathletic.com/2723692/2021/07/22/why-the-flyers-paid-the-price-to-trade-shayne-gostisbehere-to-coyotes-this-is-purely-a-cap-move/?source=dailyemail

Good write on the why of the Ghost trade. A little in case you don't use the Athletic

OK, so sure, the Flyers needed to clear cap space, York is on the way and Gostisbehere was a clear change-of-scenery candidate. But even with all of that in mind, why were the Flyers forced to send a second- and a seventh-round pick to the Coyotes just for them to take him? After all, Gostisbehere had a solid bounce-back campaign, and he’s still a useful defenseman— right? Was his $4.5 million cap hit really that onerous?

At the very least, it doesn’t track with Dom Luszczyszyn’s GSVA model. While it does project Gostisbehere to deliver slightly negative value relative to his cap hits across the next two seasons, we’re talking about $8.5 million worth of projected value against $9 million of actual cost. Is $500,000 of excess price really worth a second-round pick?
- wcorvette

Here is why Ghost had to go- The coaching staff was never going to give him a fair shot. They did not like him for whatever reason. He never got the benefit of the doubt the others did. Had the coach played to his strengths maybe it would have worked out differently. Though when you have a Hagg on your team no need to play ghost.

So that is why imo they had to move him.

Like chuckles would use the GSVA model

He is always the smartest guy in the room
- corduroy

That is Hextall.

Why is Frost an untouchable?
- hello it's me 2050

Really? High upside/no one to replace him in the lineup at center.

I’m talking about moving up 5-6 spots in the draft. I’m not giving up Frost for that.

Really? High upside/no one to replace him in the lineup at center.

I’m talking about moving up 5-6 spots in the draft. I’m not giving up Frost for that.
- hereticpride

thought you meant untouchable period.

Here is why Ghost had to go- The coaching staff was never going to give him a fair shot. They did not like him for whatever reason. He never got the benefit of the doubt the others did. Had the coach played to his strengths maybe it would have worked out differently. Though when you have a Hagg on your team no need to play ghost.

So that is why imo they had to move him.
- hello it's me 2050

I don't disagree, they in essence drove down his value.

I don't disagree, they in essence drove down his value.
- wcorvette

and by driving his value down wasted assets

I don't disagree, they in essence drove down his value.
- wcorvette

I get what your saying though disagree only for the fact smart GM's look beyond that. The fact not one seemed really interested tells me his value would have stayed the same unless he just killed it.

I have no issue giving up the pick (not ideal) as peeps put way to much value on NHL picks outside the 1st rd. Just need to pick your spot when giving it up.

I wont be shocked to hear some negative stuff about Ghost come out either.

What return are you looking for by trading our first round pick? Just curious.
- dubc55

Package it to get a another top 4 defenseman for the 2nd pairing to play with Sanheim.

Agreed! I can't believe people were still babying Patrick. He very well may have been the worst forward in the entire NHL last season. Enough is enough! He probably won't be in the league in a few years. Myers took a major step back last year and that has to be concerning. He seems to really lack hockey IQ and I'm not sure that can be fixed. I wanted them to trade Ghost a couple years ago when he still had value......oh well. At least they haven't lost anyone off the roster so far that I will miss.
- Phillywhiteout

What sealed it for me about Myers is when AV said in presser that Myers is not willing to take a hit to make a play, i.e. he is softer than an overripe melon. I don't care if he's tall, can skate and is a RHD, the bottom line is he lacked compete and the willingness to put his body on the line, and NO team can win with players like that!