Who are they projected to take?
- PT21

NAK, by most of the drafts I have flipped through

I believe Jake works hard, is trying (most of the time) and has talent. But the executive group needs to look at this more high level rather than at any one player. I also believe G works hard (most of the time) and has talent. Same thing however, we're getting the same results for 9+ years now. We've gone through how many coaches? (Lavy, Berube, Hakstol and Gordon) At some point you have to look at the chemistry of the roster long term. They have already had their house cleaning, but again, we're back to square one. Put simply, we need different players who make DIFFERENT DECISIONS on the ice than the ones that are currently being made. Bill made a point about too many rushes up ice ending up without a chance. Believe it or not, this one is the biggest indicator of what needs to be changed. Why aren't veterans consistently skating to the high percentage areas in front of the net? Why do so many plays end up with one too many passes ? Why do open looks end up with no shot ? This is the stuff of complacency or lack of killer instinct. I conclude that we just need different players in order to see different results.

I don’t disagree with your assessment of the young players. Spot on. But there is more to being a captain than points. There is zero hustle on his part every since he leveled crosby in the playoffs & got a fat contract. Although he does a good job of acting like he’s hustling some times so I get it. And especially when they’re down 3-0 in the first 5 minutes of games than he gets an “angry face”. Have first period starts not been a huge problem basically the whole tenure under hakstol & now under AV? Isn’t a leader supposed to make sure his troops are ready or does it fall on a 22 year old?
- Fopa21

I love Giroux but I can't argue with the points you make. The captain sets the tone for the rest of the team, and this team under Giroux has been plagued with slow starts and inconsistency. That is why I think a new captain is needed, if for nothing more than a new voice and a symbol that a new culture must be established. This is especially important for the younger players like York, Allison, Foerster, O'Brien, we want these guys stepping into a winning culture, a culture where things are done right and standards are high, otherwise these players will fall right in line with what we have been seeing for a decade more or less.

I agree he is talented. Great hands but to many subpar areas to be a teams “best player”
- Fopa21

Eh, I humbly disagree. Giroux was at worst a top 10 and possibly a top 5 forward for several years. He never had the sniper on his wing that could finish. He is the best player we have drafted in forever. I think there was a time when he could have been a 1C on a contending team.

We expected him to be a Crosby, and he is not that. But I could see him easily just a step below. He has earned his contract, imo.

That heel-skate deflection for the Couts tap-in last game blew my mind. I watched it 10 times.
- PT21

He has had dozens of those “amaze me” plays and goals over his career. He is really very talented. We now have young players who are plus shooters, and he should never be on a line without one of them again.

Giroux was not responsible for the lack of goal scorers, the draft choices, the development timeline of prospects, the line choices of the coaching now and more...

For what he is and what he can control, Giroux gets a B+ along with Farabee from me for this season.

I can understand the argument of giving the C to someone else, especially after this disappointing season. I don’t agree with it, don’t believe that Giroux is the central problem in the inconsistency or slow starts; however, I think I understand the argument.

I don’t think giving it to Couturier right now with one year left on his contract is the right move. Couturier has been here for all the same team issues as well. I also don’t think any of our young guys like Farabee or Provorov are ready for that role. Unless they acquire that guy to wear the C, I just don’t see it happening.

I think that the Flyers have spent years providing opportunities to Giroux to develop his leadership skills, and I would personally hope they give him that chance to show his growth next season in the last year of his big contract.

That BS about him not being a very good hockey player is just that...BS. He is not perfect, but he has made perfect plays that very few can do. He may not be what you envision, but he has willing carried the weight of being the face of the Flyers and the responsibility of wearing the C through thick and thin. I respect that.
- NC Flyers Fan

The “C” is just a letter. I don’t understand why the captaincy is suddenly in question. I don’t think anyone worked harder than Giroux since returning from Covid and I’m including Couturier.

Do not count out Braun being chosen. He’s better than ghost or hagg (way cheaper than ghost). Would bring a solid vet into a new expansion team environment. The more I think about it the more I think it could be him.
- Just5

Good point. He did just break his foot. I’m not a doctor and haven’t broke anything serious so I’m not sure how long recovery is. He may not get his full season training in

I believe Jake works hard, is trying (most of the time) and has talent. But the executive group needs to look at this more high level rather than at any one player. I also believe G works hard (most of the time) and has talent. Same thing however, we're getting the same results for 9+ years now. We've gone through how many coaches? (Lavy, Berube, Hakstol and Gordon) At some point you have to look at the chemistry of the roster long term. They have already had their house cleaning, but again, we're back to square one. Put simply, we need different players who make DIFFERENT DECISIONS on the ice than the ones that are currently being made. Bill made a point about too many rushes up ice ending up without a chance. Believe it or not, this one is the biggest indicator of what needs to be changed. Why aren't veterans consistently skating to the high percentage areas in front of the net? Why do so many plays end up with one too many passes ? Why do open looks end up with no shot ? This is the stuff of complacency or lack of killer instinct. I conclude that we just need different players in order to see different results.
- [email protected]

Spot on!

Remember the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over but expecting different results! Giroux, Hayes, JVR and Voracek are what they are and unfortunately they are not anywhere near top end talent compared to the rest of the league, yet they are taking up about 38% of your cap space. This to me is the NUMBER 1 reason this team Sucks, because the players you are paying he most have to be top end talent, and with the Flyers this is surely not the case!

This seems to be the same old song and dance we all participate in every year.

"The core needs to be changed!"

"No not player (x), he led the team in assists!"
"How are we going to replace this many goals?"
"This guy is a great locker room leader! Can't move on from him he isn't the problem!"

It's like in politics and how everyone seemingly supports term limits and thinks Congress is corrupt, but when it comes down to it the jurisdictions double down on the same clowns that ran the show before. "It wasn't my guy that is corrupt, it's everyone else!"

Of course, this misses the point entirely. The sum of this team has always been lesser than its parts for many years now. Changing the player mix may result in a "loss" of some form or another on paper but there is gain to be found on the ice and as a team.

That heel-skate deflection for the Couts tap-in last game blew my mind. I watched it 10 times.
- PT21

It was a awesome play! That the issue great individual play a handful times a year, not dismissing that and don’t want to trade him, but I envision a captain leading and rallying a team. Making other players play better, believe in themselves, call out the team or individual players ( privately of course) to get team results. That’s the part I feel is missing with Claude.

Not looking to trade him just looking a more team results oriented captain. I’m not sure this team has that guy, maybe 14, but it’s definitely a missing piece on this team.

Giroux has taken over several games for us this season where we deserved the L and got us a win. You are a moron. He's not perfect but he also is not the problem.
- Richieattack18

You do understand “taking over games” has nothing to do with scoring goals necessarily. Yeah, he scored two goals in the final 3 minutes a few games ago against a team they had no business loosing to. But taking over a game is about controlling the puck winning every battle creating scoring chances. Please tell me one game where G is out battling anyone in the corners/front of the net skating around the O zone with the puck on his stick???? Everytime he gets the puck entering the O zone he pulls up inside the blue line. He is consistently the third forward high in the O zone meaning rarely in front of the net or in the corners.

The “C” is just a letter. I don’t understand why the captaincy is suddenly in question. I don’t think anyone worked harder than Giroux since returning from Covid and I’m including Couturier.
- SuperSchennBros

I'm asking this sincerely, not to poke fun at you. Have you ever played a team sport at a high level, whether in HS, college, whatever? If you have then you should know that the player wearing the 'C' is typically your best player, or at least the player that sets the tone in the locker room and on the field. I played hockey up through HS and I will tell you all of us feared our captain if we stunk out the joint that night. We would hear it after the game, and the next day at practice would be brutal. But I am glad he was like that, because he raised the bar high for the rest of us to strive to and we were a successful team for the years I played. In team sports like hockey when playing at a high level, the player wearing the 'C' matters! I love Giroux and want to the Flyers to win a cup with him on the team, however its more than time that a new player gets the 'C'.

Spot on!

Remember the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over but expecting different results! Giroux, Hayes, JVR and Voracek are what they are and unfortunately they are not anywhere near top end talent compared to the rest of the league, yet they are taking up about 38% of your cap space. This to me is the NUMBER 1 reason this team Sucks, because the players you are paying he most have to be top end talent, and with the Flyers this is surely not the case!
- jd250

Bravo to both of you. Spot on

The “C” is just a letter. I don’t understand why the captaincy is suddenly in question. I don’t think anyone worked harder than Giroux since returning from Covid and I’m including Couturier.
- SuperSchennBros

Oh I agree! I was addressing the argument as really the question has been around for years and doesn’t really go away. It’s louder now because of the terrible team results this season.

He has had dozens of those “amaze me” plays and goals over his career. He is really very talented. We now have young players who are plus shooters, and he should never be on a line without one of them again.

Giroux was not responsible for the lack of goal scorers, the draft choices, the development timeline of prospects, the line choices of the coaching now and more...

For what he is and what he can control, Giroux gets a B+ along with Farabee from me for this season.
- NC Flyers Fan

Well, he gets an A- from me. An A- for Farabee (motivational grade to get him to aspire more and also the long drought) and JVR and a solid A for Couts for sustained excellence while the walls crumbled around him.

I thought Bill's grade for Carter's April (C+) was a tad harsh. He stopped 122 of 134 shots for a avg of 0.910. This coming off a horrendous March shows not just competent play but a bounce-back capacity.

Eh, I humbly disagree. Giroux was at worst a top 10 and possibly a top 5 forward for several years. He never had the sniper on his wing that could finish. He is the best player we have drafted in forever. I think there was a time when he could have been a 1C on a contending team.

We expected him to be a Crosby, and he is not that. But I could see him easily just a step below. He has earned his contract, imo.
- PT21

I hear you & respect you humbly disagreeing. Back to team Canada though. If he was a top 10 heck I’ll even give you top 20 in the league why was he relegated to 14th forward duty on team Canada?

This seems to be the same old song and dance we all participate in every year.

"The core needs to be changed!"

"No not player (x), he led the team in assists!"
"How are we going to replace this many goals?"
"This guy is a great locker room leader! Can't move on from him he isn't the problem!"

It's like in politics and how everyone seemingly supports term limits and thinks Congress is corrupt, but when it comes down to it the jurisdictions double down on the same clowns that ran the show before. "It wasn't my guy that is corrupt, it's everyone else!"

Of course, this misses the point entirely. The sum of this team has always been lesser than its parts for many years now. Changing the player mix may result in a "loss" of some form or another on paper but there is gain to be found on the ice and as a team.
- StepfordSam

Replace Jake, JVR and Ghost with Schwartz, Saad/Foligno and Ekholm and I say this team is significantly improved. I also believe this is a very obtainable outcome between a good hockey trade and free agency this off season.

I hear you & respect you humbly disagreeing. Back to team Canada though. If he was a top 10 heck I’ll even give you top 20 in the league why was he relegated to 14th forward duty on team Canada?
- Fopa21

Again. You said he led the league in points over a period of time yet isn’t a good hockey player. Dumbest thing I’ve read on this site.

It was a awesome play! That’s the issue great individual play a handful times a year, not dismissing that and don’t want to trade him, but I envision a captain leading and rallying a team. Making other players play better, believe in themselves, call out the team or individual players ( privately of course) to get team results. That’s the part I feel is missing with Claude.

Not looking to trade him just looking a more team results oriented captain. I’m not sure this team has that guy, maybe 14, but it’s definitely a missing piece on this team.
- Hosher12

Again. You said he led the league in points over a period of time yet isn’t a good hockey player. Dumbest thing I’ve read on this site.
- Ftown19125

Explain that to the people running team Canada. Tim Tebow scored a lot of touchdowns running the bowl as a QB so he’s a good QB in your eyes?

You do understand “taking over games” has nothing to do with scoring goals necessarily. Yeah, he scored two goals in the final 3 minutes a few games ago against a team they had no business loosing to. But taking over a game is about controlling the puck winning every battle creating scoring chances. Please tell me one game where G is out battling anyone in the corners/front of the net skating around the O zone with the puck on his stick???? Everytime he gets the puck entering the O zone he pulls up inside the blue line. He is consistently the third forward high in the O zone meaning rarely in front of the net or in the corners.
- Fopa21

Thats not Gs game, but he does excel in other areas. When we had a shooter like Hartnell, G excelled even more. G is a setup guy, and we need shooters to set up. Hughes definately does not take over a game. I love watching barzal, but he doesn't take over a game, he has some amazing shifts and i think him under a different coach he would be dominant, but he doesnt take over games. Now if you want to compare G to crosby, ovi, and marchand. Go ahead, they are better than G. Lets face it, G in on the downside of his career, and thats why he only has 1 year left on his contract. But he is still a good player.

Well, he gets an A- from me. An A- for Farabee (motivational grade to get him to aspire more and also the long drought) and JVR and a solid A for Couts for sustained excellence while the walls crumbled around him.

I thought Bill's grade for Carter's April (C+) was a tad harsh. He stopped 122 of 134 shots for a avg of 0.910. This coming off a horrendous March shows not just competent play but a bounce-back capacity.
- PT21

I think you are crazy to give any player on this team an A because the fact is no one exceeded expectations as far as I am concerned. JVR could have met expectations by playing consistently throughout the year, but that big drop off in March was disappointing. And Carter Hart did bounce back in April before he got hurt, but overall for the year you have to give him a C because did not meet expectations.

BTW, the way I view grades is A - exceeded expectations, B- met expectations, C- below expectations, D - really below expectations and F - you Suck with a capital 'S'!

This is not a critique but a genuine question: do we have the slowest group of top 9 forwards in the NHL? I was casually watching a bunch of teams across the league, and they all seem faster than us. Or play faster.
- PT21

I totally agree!! I think this all the time watching this team. They have no true speed or snipers.

I hear you & respect you humbly disagreeing. Back to team Canada though. If he was a top 10 heck I’ll even give you top 20 in the league why was he relegated to 14th forward duty on team Canada?
- Fopa21

Because they were flush with centers and he would be miscast as a checking line center or a 4th line center. Also, iirc, that year when he was overlooked for the Olympics, he got off to a slow start.

NAK, by most of the drafts I have flipped through
- JW98FlyerFan

Why in the world would they take NAK