It addresses having a better defense. Seems pretty easy to me. Unless you think Provy is better than Jones, which I don't think its even that close. Provy makes a lot of mistakes.
- bradster

1) Jones will cost about 30-50% more than Provorov to extend,

2) Jones isn't perfect, either.

Because I live in reality.

1) Next season is Couturiers last year on his current contract. You arent getting Eichel for a rental.

2) Why on earth would Couturier sign with Buffalo

3) We does this cap room for Eichel come from.

4) You call Couturier a "decent player" so why on earth would Buffalo trade Eichel for a "decent player+" Buffalo is not going to move Eichel unless it makes them a better team.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

1) pretty sure i said couts +. but change the narrative to your liking
2) Because the good teams are pretty much at the cap, the lower teams have money to spend. Are the flyers that much better than the sabers?
3) from moving couts +, maybe a sweetener to kraken to take something. I dont limit things because i think things cant happen. everything can be done....for a price.
4)because couts + could be worth eichel. you dont even know what the plus is and you are negating it. Man i am glad you arent a GM of the flyers.

1) Jones will cost about 30-50% more than Provorov to extend,

2) Jones isn't perfect, either.
- Tomahawk

nope he isnt, but he is pretty damn good.

Yes, you and I think completely different. What if you moved couts + for Eichel. Why do you only see us as losing a decent player, and not gaining anything in trades?
- bradster

Eichel is a very good player, but he isn't that much better than Coots offensively no matter how much you slice it. Some context....

Since Eichel Entered the league in 2015-2016:
Eichel 375 gp, 139 g, 216 a, 355 p -69
Coots 398 gp, 125 g, 194 a, 319 p +68

And Coots demonstrably makes those who play with him better.

This is by no means a slight towards Eichel, but I think we underestimate how good Coots is. IMO he is a better all around player than Eichel.

Eichel is a very good player, but he isn't that much better than Coots offensively no matter how much you slice it. Some context....

Since Eichel Entered the league in 2015-2016:
Eichel 375 gp, 139 g, 216 a, 355 p -69
Coots 398 gp, 125 g, 194 a, 319 p +68

And Coots demonstrably makes those who play with him better.

This is by no means a slight towards Eichel, but I think we underestimate how good Coots is. IMO he is a better all around player than Eichel.
- MBFlyerfan

He is a better scorer that Couts, and we need to change. Even if we trade a player for a similar caliber player. What we have isn't working, and changes need to be made. Cant just keep staying the same or we will get the same results

1) pretty sure i said couts +. but change the narrative to your liking
2) Because the good teams are pretty much at the cap, the lower teams have money to spend. Are the flyers that much better than the sabers?
3) from moving couts +, maybe a sweetener to kraken to take something. I dont limit things because i think things cant happen. everything can be done....for a price.
4)because couts + could be worth eichel. you dont even know what the plus is and you are negating it. Man i am glad you arent a GM of the flyers.
- bradster

How did I change them narrative? I clearly said in point 4 that it was Coots+. At the end of the Day Coots is supposed to be a big part of the deal. You dont make that trade unless you are 100% sure he stays. If the + is all they are after why bother including Coots at all? Good teams arent all at the cap. Some good teams have the Cap to sign Couturier to an extension this year if he was a UFA 1 year earlier. A lot more teams will have more contracts expiring the season after too.

Theres a reason there have been no trades with the Kraken, their price to take certain players is too high. All the Mock drafts have Seattle taking Ghost.

He is a better scorer that Couts, and we need to change. Even if we trade a player for a similar caliber player. What we have isn't working, and changes need to be made. Cant just keep staying the same or we will get the same results
- bradster

Bingo. This is such a trash mix of players.

Coots is great, sure. But what’s the point of having a shut down center when the team defense is absolutely horrendous, has been absolutely horrendous, and shows no signs of stopping. It almost makes more sense in invest in more offensively skilled players to try and out gun other teams.

Honestly if it’s me I’m trying to move Coots for Jones. Fix the defense mess first then we can worry about filling the hole at center. I don’t want to hear “you’re just creating a hole elsewhere” because it’s clearly not working as is.

Bingo. This is such a trash mix of players.

Coots is great, sure. But what’s the point of having a shut down center when the team defense is absolutely horrendous, has been absolutely horrendous, and shows no signs of stopping. It almost makes more sense in invest in more offensively skilled players to try and out gun other teams.

Honestly if it’s me I’m trying to move Coots for Jones. Fix the defense mess first then we can worry about filling the hole at center. I don’t want to hear “you’re just creating a hole elsewhere” because it’s clearly not working as is.
- hereticpride

I like it. Hopefully Frost turns out because he could be our #1C.
Honestly, the trade value of alot our young players are so low right now, it makes me cringe what we have to give up to get something back.

Eichel is a very good player, but he isn't that much better than Coots offensively no matter how much you slice it. Some context....

Since Eichel Entered the league in 2015-2016:
Eichel 375 gp, 139 g, 216 a, 355 p -69
Coots 398 gp, 125 g, 194 a, 319 p +68

And Coots demonstrably makes those who play with him better.

This is by no means a slight towards Eichel, but I think we underestimate how good Coots is. IMO he is a better all around player than Eichel.
- MBFlyerfan

The idea of Kevin Hayes as our shut-down center should be enough to scare anybody off this kind of trade.

Eichel is a very good player, but he isn't that much better than Coots offensively no matter how much you slice it. Some context....

Since Eichel Entered the league in 2015-2016:
Eichel 375 gp, 139 g, 216 a, 355 p -69
Coots 398 gp, 125 g, 194 a, 319 p +68

And Coots demonstrably makes those who play with him better.

This is by no means a slight towards Eichel, but I think we underestimate how good Coots is. IMO he is a better all around player than Eichel.
- MBFlyerfan

I agree - and with a better apparent attitude. I'd rather have Couturier than Eichel any day.

I like it. Hopefully Frost turns out because he could be our #1C.
- bradster

I'm Morgan Frost super fan #1, but that's one big leap of faith you're taking there.

I would say, maybe biasedly, that this off season is the most important off season in Chuck Fletcher's career as an executive. What he does, or doesn't do will define him the rest of his career in hockey; he will either be labeled a genius for turning this team around, or incompetent and the cause of all this in the first place. Fair or unfair, that is how it is shaping up for CF IMO.
- jd250

Absolutely agree. Can't just sit on his hands this offseason.

I'm Morgan Frost super fan #1, but that's one big leap of faith you're taking there.
- Tomahawk

I'm not saying its going to happen, but we may need it to lol. I do think he has good #2C ability though, and maybe he can surprise. I thought he looked good in every (very few) games he played also.

so we drafted morin instead of jones
if you dopes remember all we had to do was lose a few more games and we could have had him for free

see why getting these points at the end of the season is stupid

so we drafted morin instead of jones
if you dopes remember all we had to do was lose a few more games and we could have had him for free

see why getting these points at the end of the season is stupid
- 2Real

We most likely will finish 10+ points behind the rangers, think about that! This organization has really bottomed out, sad times.

1) Jones will cost about 30-50% more than Provorov to extend,

2) Jones isn't perfect, either.
- Tomahawk

no no he is, all other teams ahead of the Flyers have at least 1 perfect D man.

so we drafted morin instead of jones
if you dopes remember all we had to do was lose a few more games and we could have had him for free

see why getting these points at the end of the season is stupid
- 2Real

No we have to give it all every game and never give in cause some teams embarrassed us in the early 70s once lol.

Like I said last night. There is no reason to be pulling the goalie in games at this point. The Flyers need all the draft help they can get.

no no he is, all other teams ahead of the Flyers have at least 1 perfect D man.
- wcorvette

I love the Jones isn’t perfect argument. He’s damn good and our defense is a (frank)ing clown show. I’d be ecstatic if we got a D man half as talented as him.

I don’t understand your point? Was this much bigger guy than Myers a 6’6” professional hockey player because Myers is close to 6’5”. Have you ever endured over a year of Migraines and potential concussion syndrome prior to this shot to the head?
- SuperSchennBros

I was agreeing with you and giving the kid a break... Head injuries are no joke. I'm sorry I agreed with you.

I love the Jones isn’t perfect argument. He’s damn good and our defense is a (frank)ing clown show. I’d be ecstatic if we got a D man half as talented as him.
- hereticpride

100%

AV keeps playing Patrick, Laughton and Tragic Konecny because they are the ones who are actually doing things to improve our draft chances.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Patrick was second in the draft!. It's like a night in prison. You never know what's going to ram you.

I love the Jones isn’t perfect argument. He’s damn good and our defense is a (frank)ing clown show. I’d be ecstatic if we got a D man half as talented as him.
- hereticpride

That isnt the argument, the argument is that Jones doesnt fix the D if Provorov is traded for him

Per NHL.com

What is the offseason plan for the Philadelphia Flyers? Expansion draft, free agency, cap situation and the failing defense are hot-button topics, not to mention goaltending. -- @theashcity

The Flyers have a potentially complicated offseason ahead, including the NHL Draft Lottery if they fail to qualify for the Stanley Cup Playoffs. Philadelphia is sixth in the eight-team MassMutual East Division, 11 points behind the fourth-place Boston Bruins. The top four teams make the postseason.

Though most of the Flyers roster is signed for next season, three players can become a restricted free agent after this season (forward Nolan Patrick, defenseman Travis Sanheim and goalie Carter Hart), and goalies Brian Elliott and Alex Lyon are pending unrestricted free agents. If the Flyers are going to venture into free agency, trades might be their only way to create roster space for a new player or players.

One of their greatest needs is a right-shot defenseman to play with Ivan Provorov after realizing how much they miss steady but retired Matt Niskanen. Philadelphia has allowed 173 goals this season, most in the NHL. It might be better to focus there.

Progress will require a step forward from Hart, a 22-year-old who is 9-11-5, 3.67 GAA, .877 save percentage and one shutout and missed six games with a sprained knee. The Flyers also have some difficult choices ahead of the expansion draft, and it's likely they will lose a good player. Who of defensemen Provorov, Sanheim, Philippe Myers or Shayne Gostisbehere would you leave unprotected? Or what price would you pay Seattle to not pick one? The same conundrum will exist among forwards. Could one of Patrick, Jakub Voracek, James van Riemsdyk or Travis Konecny be exposed?

The Flyers have a pick in each of the seven rounds of the 2021 NHL Draft, so those assets, if needed, can help reshape the roster.

That isnt the argument, the argument is that Jones doesnt fix the D if Provorov is traded for him
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

I think it makes our D better. Get it done Chuck.