Doesn't add up. The Flyers can easily be positioned to be able to add a player with a 6M cap hit at the deadline. How many trades are they going to make?
- MJL

Idk, it’s the only reasonable explanation to waiving him right now imo. I’m sure he’ll be pressed for a reason.

I am sorry if I did that, can you remind when this exchange started? what was the post I commented on of yours? I am at work and can't seem to find it
- wcorvette

Last page. We were going back and forth.

Why is Lindblom sitting tonight? He just had a reset.

And Gostisbehere sitting for Gustafsson.

This franchise is a train wreck
- PLindbergh31

probably wanting to showcase people we actually want to trade

Looks like AV is making the vets do some work tonight. Good.

19/20 NHL Season Hart trophy voting

1) Draisaitl 3rd overall
2)McKinnon 1st overall
3)Panarin Undrafted
4)Pasternak 25th overall
5)McDavid 1st overall
6)Hellebuych 138th overall
7)Josi 38th overall
8)Eichel 2nd overall
9)Marchand 71st overall
10)Malkin 2nd overall

As we see here. 50% of the players ranked in the top 10 in Hart trophy voting last year were drafted outside of PT21's coveted top 5 overall spot.

You can get a star player drafting outside of the top 5. What do you know!

Looks like AV is making the vets do some work tonight. Good.
- black_francis

Let’s see if they show up before the 3rd

That was not my argument in any of the 20 odd times we have debated this.
- PT21

Duuuud e, I don’t care to hear the semantics argument. It’s a fact that you advocate for tanking at every turn, and you state the motivation for that is the higher percentage of superstars are found at the top 1-5 of the draft. You also have stated many times that you don’t believe a superstar (forward, defenseman) exists on the Flyers roster or in it’s near prospect ranks, and that you are confident the Flyers will not win a cup in the next 4 years.

If you ever want to visit real facts, we can talk on this again. I am not here for you to just keep pretending I missed something in your many words. We have differing opinions. And I repeat...It is NOT because I haven’t understood your view and it is not because I haven’t looked at the composition of past cup winners and even runner-ups and playoff teams star power levels. I have.

1.GREAT I have been saying the Hextall-era "half-tank" was time wasted. Look where we are now.

2. I agree completely about tanking. Look at this Sixers team. They have the best player in the league, and a great #2. Haters can go f*** off.

3. Until Embiids 'fragile body' gives out totally? The Process was a success and will be validated THIS YEAR.

You read it here first folks. Expect another parade with tons of red & royal blue.
- DrMidnite

I think in Hockey and Basketball (less clear in football where draft talent for future play is far deeper; don't really know that much about baseball), the numbers correlating championship success to drafting high are so numerically overwhelming that the people who debate them are zealots or idiots.

A bigger sociological question is, why do so many want to not accept it? some reasons I can think of:

1. Sports fans want sports to be a refuge from the logic of reality. Its not a refuge from logic, but one can coast along and not have to face the reality because it is at the end of the day not affecting anything more than entertainment.

2. It destroys the "life is a box of chocolates" narrative, where beyond hard work, it is luck that determines outcomes, not long term analytical factors.

3. There is a pejorative connotation associated with drafting high. Teams that have proud franchises (us, Habs) often have to have substantial fig leafs to cover what they are really doing.

4. There is of course the huge ticket sale hit franchises would have to take if they go the sensible route. Thus, management leverages the feelings of fans in 1-3 and can laugh their way to not have to take the hit.

I still don't understand why Ghost played Monday , got waived the next day with the idea he would clear, and then is sent to the taxi squad for Erik f'ing Gustafson. makes zero sense to me.

I wouldn't mind sitting one of Patrick or Lindbolm if they had decent alternatives to step in for them. But they don't. Twarynski can't skate at the NHL level. He just can't.
- Briere

Vigneault gave a logical explanation, whether people want to hear it or not. Both from the biofeedback from the team's sports science department and his own observations on Monday, both Lindblom and Patrick are worn down physically right now. After tonight, the Flyers have two idle nights. It's a 72 hour reset, essentially. There was no morning skate today. Tomorrow's an off-day. Friday's a practice. Saturday's a game. They'll be back then.

With the Flyers currently carrying 3 goalies on the roster, in order to make everything work out roster limit and cap wise, they had to put Ghost on the Taxi Squad today.

I still don't understand why Ghost played Monday , got waived the next day with the idea he would clear, and then is sent to the taxi squad for Erik f'ing Gustafson. makes zero sense to me.

I wouldn't mind sitting one of Patrick or Lindbolm if they had decent alternatives to step in for them. But they don't. Twarynski can't skate at the NHL level. He just can't.
- Briere

They are showcasing the talented Gustafson for the trade deadline.

Now for the most important position on the ice. Goaltending

19/20 Vezina trophy voting

1)Hellebuyck 130th overall
2)Rask 21st overall
3)Vasilevskiy 19th overall
4)Markstrom 31st overall
5)Merzlikins 76th overall
6)Lehner 46th overall
7) Binnington 88th overall
8)Jarry 44th overall
9)Keumper 161st overall

See, you can get a star player outside of the top 5 overall.

Vigneault gave a logical explanation, whether people want to hear it or not. Both from the biofeedback from the team's sports science department and his own observations on Monday, both Lindblom and Patrick are worn down physically right now. After tonight, the Flyers have two idle nights. It's a 72 hour reset, essentially. There was no morning skate today. Tomorrow's an off-day. Friday's a practice. Saturday's a game. They'll be back then.

With the Flyers currently carrying 3 goalies on the roster, in order to make everything work out roster limit and cap wise, they had to put Ghost on the Taxi Squad today.
- bmeltzer

Given all they've been through the last 18 months that is perfectly understandable.

Duuuud e, I don’t care to hear the semantics argument. It’s a fact that you advocate for tanking at every turn, and you state the motivation for that is the higher percentage of superstars are found at the top 1-5 of the draft. You also have stated many times that you don’t believe a superstar (forward, defenseman) exists on the Flyers roster or in it’s near prospect ranks, and that you are confident the Flyers will not win a cup in the next 4 years.

If you ever want to visit real facts, we can talk on this again. I am not here for you to just keep pretending I missed something in your many words. We have differing opinions. And I repeat...It is NOT because I haven’t understood your view and it is not because I haven’t looked at the composition of past cup winners and even runner-ups and playoff teams star power levels. I have.
- NC Flyers Fan

Dude,

No offense, but rudimentary lapses of logic are not semantical errors. Nor is the provision of empirical evidence that refute propositions that were never made.

You are a faith guy. You stated at the beginning of the season that you thought it was conceivable that Frost, Allison and Ratcliffe would be a dandy 3rd line. That's fine. I admire your optimism.

But as long as you come to argue with me about empirically provable propositions, and say statements similar to "I believe a fair coin will turn up heads the next ten times", I am afraid I will provide the reasoning to refute you, and point out that this is not really a difference in opinion. It is a difference in likelihood.

Given all they've been through the last 18 months that is perfectly understandable.
- Scoob

I can only imagine what the season must look like now for these 2 kids. It must be a mental blur. Not to speak of their physical travails.

19/20 Norris trophy voting

1) Josi 38th overall
2) Carlson 27th overall
3)Hedman 2nd overall
4)Pietrangelo 4th overall
5)Slavin 120th overall
6)Theodore 26th overall
7)Hamilton 9th overall
8)Werenski 8th overall
9)Makar 4th overall
10)McAvoy 14th overall


Hey, what do you know. You can get a star player outside of the top 5 in the draft.

if we lose today is it bad given we won a few games before this?

Been busy at work. As for the lineup changes tonight.

Would like to see tanner and Allison up. But an weary with how the team has played and how the phantoms are rolling. If they wanted too does anyone know how long it would take for them to clear?

So in conclusion, out of the 29 top players last season in the NHL, 20 out of 29 players in post season awards. Were drafted outside of the top 5 in the draft.

Last page. We were going back and forth.
- PT21

but I thought that was where you commented on my post initially?

Dude,

No offense, but rudimentary lapses of logic are not semantical errors. Nor is the provision of empirical evidence that refute propositions that were never made.

You are a faith guy. You stated at the beginning of the season that you thought it was conceivable that Frost, Allison and Ratcliffe would be a dandy 3rd line. That's fine. I admire your optimism.

But as long as you come to argue with me about empirically provable propositions, and say statements similar to "I believe a fair coin will turn up heads the next ten times", I am afraid I will provide the reasoning to refute you, and point out that this is not really a difference in opinion. It is a difference in likelihood.


- PT21

It’s not that I don’t enjoy reading what you post, but man you spill a lot of ink to argue that it’s easier to win with superstars that are selected higher. Is anyone really arguing that it isn’t easier? Maybe I don’t actually focus enough on it and am spotty when I pop in so if that’s a gross oversimplification then that’s on me. I just think the prevailing sentiment the other way is yeah it’s easier but it’s not the only way. That being said, most teams in all leagues embrace some degree of tanking at some point. Do have to give the flyers credit though. Perhaps to their own detriment at times, but they never have.

Now for the most important position on the ice. Goaltending

19/20 Vezina trophy voting

1)Hellebuyck 130th overall
2)Rask 21st overall
3)Vasilevskiy 19th overall
4)Markstrom 31st overall
5)Merzlikins 76th overall
6)Lehner 46th overall
7) Binnington 88th overall
8)Jarry 44th overall
9)Keumper 161st overall

See, you can get a star player outside of the top 5 overall.
- MJL

Goalies can't be left legs, sorry. They're more like middle legs.

19/20 Norris trophy voting

1) Josi 38th overall
2) Carlson 27th overall
3)Hedman 2nd overall
4)Pietrangelo 4th overall
5)Slavin 120th overall
6)Theodore 26th overall
7)Hamilton 9th overall
8)Werenski 8th overall
9)Makar 4th overall
10)McAvoy 14th overall


Hey, what do you know. You can get a star player outside of the top 5 in the draft.
- MJL

but if you get a #1 pick you have to more than likely win a cup, right?

Dude,

No offense, but rudimentary lapses of logic are not semantical errors. Nor is the provision of empirical evidence that refute propositions that were never made.

You are a faith guy. You stated at the beginning of the season that you thought it was conceivable that Frost, Allison and Ratcliffe would be a dandy 3rd line. That's fine. I admire your optimism.

But as long as you come to argue with me about empirically provable propositions, and say statements similar to "I believe a fair coin will turn up heads the next ten times", I am afraid I will provide the reasoning to refute you, and point out that this is not really a difference in opinion. It is a difference in likelihood.


- PT21

You just keep making up stuff...I would not have referenced those 3 together for this season, I was speaking of in future years. I believe the context was ideal wingers types for Frost (once again, in the future, not this season). It was meant to be an example of player type.

You know nothing about how I think. You make up this crap to put other posters down and never voice any consideration in self-evaluating the errors you make in your thesis.

I think in Hockey and Basketball (less clear in football where draft talent for future play is far deeper; don't really know that much about baseball), the numbers correlating championship success to drafting high are so numerically overwhelming that the people who debate them are zealots or idiots.


- PT21

In my opinion, people who can't understand that many teams with a superstar player drafted in the top, don't win, are zealots or idiots. People that can't understand that drafting high is not the only reason why a team has won. We see many teams that haven't won when drafting high. They don't win because they didn't surround the player with a quality team. That proves that it's not the top 5 player that is the biggest reason why they won. They won because they built the best team. Along with many other factors that are involved. Such as what Tomahawk tried in vain to educate you on.

Vigneault gave a logical explanation, whether people want to hear it or not. Both from the biofeedback from the team's sports science department and his own observations on Monday, both Lindblom and Patrick are worn down physically right now. After tonight, the Flyers have two idle nights. It's a 72 hour reset, essentially. There was no morning skate today. Tomorrow's an off-day. Friday's a practice. Saturday's a game. They'll be back then.

With the Flyers currently carrying 3 goalies on the roster, in order to make everything work out roster limit and cap wise, they had to put Ghost on the Taxi Squad today.
- bmeltzer

ah, thank you