Farabee is turning into a stud winger
- Robert's Plant

Ha ha.

Just like Hart was becoming a superstar goalie after last season?

Wait, dude. Its a long, long way to go between the first random flashes. At this stage, it is not even clear he is a top line winger on a contending club, let alone a stud winger.

From yesterday's blog:



Did not want to respond then as game was going on.

After putting Anders Lee on LTIR,and after putting Isles have fair bit of cap space. They will definitely be getting a high priced LW.

Taylor Hall, b/c of his expiring contract status, comes up often. But both Giroux and JVR are much better players now.

Trade:

Giroux to Isles, 1.5 mil withheld. 1st round pick, likely to be low anyway, back. After this season, Isles can easily trade him for another 1-2 mil withheld at most.

or

JVR to Isles. same amount withheld, same incentives, but a 3rd rounder back, or even Komarov (cleared waivers, 3 mil hit, but just 1 more year).
- PT21

So trade to basically clear cap space? To...? Sign a big UFA? I mean JvR makes some sense with his term, but most likely if you go the UFA route the team is back in the same situation years down the road.

Here is the case for trading not resigning Giroux, which to me seems compelling:

1. No one is disputing that Giroux is still a good player in regular season. You have to look however at his stats in playoff games. For a large data set, stretching back to NJ Devils in 2012, he has been 3rd line material.

2. However, if you resign Couturier, and of course have Hayes, then those two are your 1 and 2C for the next several years. Couturier is not a top 10 center in the league, and no external unbiased source thinks of him as such. Hayes is not a top 25 center.

3. Do we have stud wingers? No we do not.

The question then becomes this simple: If you keep Giroux, a mediocre playoff performer, you are siphoning away much of the $ you can use to get a more impact free agent winger. You are also keeping a guy good but not good enough and this will adversely affect your draft position.
- PT21

This core has not been successful. The team is really stuck in neutral ....I could justify Couts going forward, but am not sold on Giroux after next year....you pointed out what Tbay did....after they actually won a cup.
I’m not even on board with resigning guys like Raffl and Laughton....I like both guys but really there are guys coming up as there replacements. Allocation of $ going forward should be steered towards fixing the d and adding capable NHL d men, not 3rd and 4th line guys.

TK is struggling but I still keep him over Sanheim. Then again I keep Sanheim over Myers.
- landros 2

That’s a no from me...on trading Myers. The Flyers haven’t prioritized drafting of top-end right defense or no one has fallen to them or some combination of the two. However, Myers is a complete steal of a FA who for certain has top 4 potential without enough experience so far. If I am being honest, he has more potential plus he is right handed.

Last night, Myers had a great game with the exception of that moment facing the boards that lead to the turnover. Maybe teammates aren’t doing a good job talking on ice, maybe they need to communicate louder...it so that’s on them. If they are talking loudly, then I recommend a hearing test for Myers. He looked the best he has looked otherwise. I really don’t see Gus as an ideal partner though.

I wouldnt care how bad they were as long as they were fun to watch. Theyve been dreadfully boring for almost a decade now.
- Sir_Robot_Farts

This

This
- landros 2

So you want to go back to the days of the late 80's early 90's when I had to cheer for Norm Lacombe and felt bad for Eklund.

LA has cap room and a couple of high priced vets. Would they be interested in anything?

Jake and ghost for doughty. Wonder what the sweetener would be. Or jake for kopitar.

I do think it’s time to separate he and g.
- Peter Richards

Flyers have no business taking on Doughty's contract. Do I really have to give an opinion on whether LA would trade Kopitar for Voracek?

So trade to basically clear cap space? To...? Sign a big UFA? I mean JvR makes some sense with his term, but most likely if you go the UFA route the team is back in the same situation years down the road.
- Glak18

1. Yes, and improve draft position, frankly.

I am open to having Giroux stay out the 1 more year. But not after that, and this is largely because we will have 16 mil odd invested in Couts and Hayes.

We really need more dynamicism in the top 6 in this system. And if we go the Blues route, we really need more studs on D.

2. Why? Chara was a FA.

Weird that teams that win tend to do it more often.
- Glak18

tocchet

You think he accepts on what will likely be his last chance at a long term deal and pay day?
- login

Regrettably, in today's flat cap world, I think we're going to be seeing more players taking shortened or lesser deals than would be otherwise normal in an ever increasing cap scenario. The players all know the deal and the landscape in which negotiations are taking place. Not saying anything specific about Laughton but the general scenario is the same for every NHL player looking at new contracts in the coming year.

That’s a no from me...on trading Myers. The Flyers haven’t prioritizes drafting of top-end right defense or no one has fallen to them or some combination of the two. However, Myers is a complete steal of a FA who for certain has top 4 potential without enough experience so far. If I am being honest, he has more potential plus he is right handed.

Last night, Myers had a great game with the exception of that moment facing the boards that lead to the turnover. Maybe teammate aren’t doing a good job talking on ice, maybe they need to communicate louder...it so that’s on them. If they are talking loudly, then I recommend a hearing test for Myers. He looked the best he has looked otherwise. I really don’t see Gus as an ideal partner though.
- NC Flyers Fan

When I say Sanheim over Myers...I’m not suggesting I’m a big fan of either. They are still relatively young, but some of their decision making really has been poor. Obviously the Flyers thought they both would take steps this year, enough that they didn’t bother to replace Niskanen. Both have shown spurts of being very good, but for the most part have failed to come close in meeting expectations. Not sure what the Flyers think internally, l just know what they say publicly , but after watching the first 30 games this year I would venture to guess there’s a ton of concern. No choice but to try and stay the course and by the end of the season perhaps a more clear answer will present itself.

This
- landros 2

I am the exact opposite. I don't care how bad they are and how unfun they are as long as they steadily move towards the ultimate goal.

1. Yes, and improve draft position, frankly.

I am open to having Giroux stay out the 1 more year. But not after that, and this is largely because we will have 16 mil odd invested in Couts and Hayes.

We really need more dynamicism in the top 6 in this system. And if we go the Blues route, we really need more studs on D.

2. Why? Chara was a FA.
- PT21

Clearing space to add Chara? I would pass.

Only UFA I see this offseason I can see fans wanting is Dougie and I personally see that as a disaster in the making. The rest of the crop is re-signing with their team or guaranteed disappointment unless it's a depth signing.

So you want to go back to the days of the late 80's early 90's when I had to cheer for Norm Lacombe and felt bad for Eklund.
- Glak18

What I agree with is that if you suck, which they do, then at least entertain me. The guys right they are not a very entertaining team and haven’t been for a long time.

I am the exact opposite. I don't care how bad they are and how unfun they are as long as they steadily move towards the ultimate goal.


- PT21

I would prefer both.

You wrote a lot of measured, sensible stuff today. And it's fine you agree and disagree with whatever you like.

But teams who have judiciously dwelled in the cellar for some time (extended is a subjective time, of course) and refrained from trying to correct the issue with signings have a much higher chance of future success than the mushy strategy of "drafting and developing well".

You can look at the data, which is unambiguous (we have gone through this a million times). Or you can look at examples. The examples of Chicago and Pens are of course a prime exhibit. But look also at Tampa Bay and Colorado.

Tampa Bay

Just a few years after winning the cup, with Lecavalier and St. Louis still playing at a very high level, Tampa started shedding assets. They traded Prospal (almost a ppg player then), Brad Richards (two years removed from a 91 p season, 52 points in 61 games in current season), and Boyle (their #1D) after 1 year. They made no significant moves to add players to a star studded roster.

Result? Stamkos and Hedman in successive years.


- PT21

How many years after drafting Stamkos and Hedman did it take them to reach the ultimate goal?

Colorado:

For a period of almost 10 years, Colorado did well in some years, very poorly in others. One thing stands out though: During these years, Avs signed not a single marquee free agent except Parenteau, and even he was quickly shipped out after 2 years. They adopted a strategy of modest additions and significant subtractions (Duchene, Stastny, Shattenkirk, Anderson, Elliott were not kept).

Result? Many misses, but Landeskog, Mackinnon, Rantanen and Makar as hauls

Colorado hasn't won anything yet. Do you doubt they will in the near future though?
- PT21

We'll see. They have to prove it.

Regrettably, in today's flat cap world, I think we're going to be seeing more players taking shortened or lesser deals than would be otherwise normal in an ever increasing cap scenario. The players all know the deal and the landscape in which negotiations are taking place. Not saying anything specific about Laughton but the general scenario is the same for every NHL player looking at new contracts in the coming year.
- Letterkenney

disagree as the stars will stull get paid and get their contract. Mid to lower guy's will get squeezed.

If they don't trade him; Let Laughton test free agency to see what is offered before resigning hm.

I would prefer both.

- landros 2

That never happens.

tocchet
- login

If that is in reference to a gem in later rounds then...

1) Long time ago
2) Way different era to go by
Tocchet was no more than a tough guy when drafted that luckily developed in to a scorer, which many teams drafted like that.

3) If that is the best example for the Flyers...that explains a lot.

How many years after drafting Stamkos and Hedman did it take them to reach the ultimate goal?



We'll see. They have to prove it.
- MJL

It was coming. They went to the SCF in 15, and the CF a year later.

Ditto for Colorado now. Similar stage.

The Flyers young 'uns are not even in the same galaxy as the young talent on those teams in a similar stage.

If that is in reference to a gem in later rounds then...

1) Long time ago
2) Way different era to go by
Tocchet was no more than a tough guy when drafted that luckily developed in to a scorer, which many teams drafted like that.

3) If that is the best example for the Flyers...that explains a lot.
- Glak18

was all I got!!!

How many years after drafting Stamkos and Hedman did it take them to reach the ultimate goal?



We'll see. They have to prove it.
- MJL

Did it take some time for those players to develop, especially Hedman...yes. Did it take a decent amount of time for them to finally win a cup...yes.

But in the meantime they did have quite a few dominating seasons in between to make fans happy. When was the last time the Flyers were consistently finishing seasons as one of the top teams in the league over spans of years?

There is one thing to have your team as one of the best in the regular season and have trouble finding that answer for the playoffs and having the Flyers who you don't know if you are going to get the best team or worst team in the league at a game to game basis for a decade.

Here is the case for trading not resigning Giroux, which to me seems compelling:

1. No one is disputing that Giroux is still a good player in regular season. You have to look however at his stats in playoff games. For a large data set, stretching back to NJ Devils in 2012, he has been 3rd line material.


- PT21

I have no doubts that Giroux could produce at a high level in the playoffs playing on a quality team.

2. However, if you resign Couturier, and of course have Hayes, then those two are your 1 and 2C for the next several years. Couturier is not a top 10 center in the league, and no external unbiased source thinks of him as such. Hayes is not a top 25 center.


- PT21

Couturier is one of the top 2 way centers in the league. I doubt yo know the opinion of every external unbiased source in the league or outside of it. I bet if you polled NHL GM's, they'd rank him in the top 10, or close to it. Those external sources you so rely on go for the glitter and rank players who are not better than Couturier higher than him. Couturier is a legit #1 NHL center.

3. Do we have stud wingers? No we do not.


- PT21

I know we have two young wingers in Konecny and Farabee with the skill to score 25-30 goals and 70 points. What's a stud winger? JVR is currently having a pretty good year.

The question then becomes this simple: If you keep Giroux, a mediocre playoff performer, you are siphoning away much of the $ you can use to get a more impact free agent winger. You are also keeping a guy good but not good enough and this will adversely affect your draft position.
- PT21

I disagree. No question that Giroux can still be a very good player on a good team for a number of years. Not capable of being "the" top player and carrying a team anymore. However he is still a very good player.

Clearing space to add Chara? I would pass.

Only UFA I see this offseason I can see fans wanting is Dougie and I personally see that as a disaster in the making. The rest of the crop is re-signing with their team or guaranteed disappointment unless it's a depth signing.
- Glak18

Ha ha. I meant when Boston signed him as a FA and this led to a 10+ year run where they were consistently in the upper echelon (and won once and almost again)

What I agree with is that if you suck, which they do, then at least entertain me. The guys right they are not a very entertaining team and haven’t been for a long time.
- landros 2

Well if the Flyers are going to suck then this is probably the year for them....since the draft crop doesn't have a close to sure fire impact player, which seems to be when the Flyers like to draft high.