This group of forwards would be ok if they had one more legit forward piece and a legit D man besides Provy.

Fact is we’ve never had that and what sense does it make to keep what core you do have together for an entire decade if you’re not going to get them the help they need.

They’ve wasted so many years that I honestly don’t know how we fix this without tearing this core down for cap space and prospects/draft picks.
- hereticpride

I think next season is really the year that you see a lot of longterm decisions made. Somebody will get claimed in the ED. Giroux and Coots are in the last year of there contracts. That could end up with Voracek, G and Coots not being here for the 2022-2023 season. Of course all three could still be here too.

They need to resign Hart and Sanheim this offseason. They have an opportunity to reshape this team if that is the direction they choose to go.

This group of forwards would be ok if they had one more legit forward piece and a legit D man besides Provy.

- hereticpride

Personally, I don't think that would make us contenders. Nisky was "legit", so that would mean we were almost there last year.

We struggled mightily against the #24 ranked team and then had the most one sided 7 game series I have seen in recent memory.

I think there is a glaring absence of high end talent on this club.

Great hypothetical. A big factor here would be what kind of salary Laine is looking for on his next deal. He's younger than Couts, and has the offensive stats that get paid. I'm still a big Provy fan despite his current struggles. I think he has all the tools to be a true #1, and I believe he'll get there. He's just not ready yet. He's being asked to shoulder too much too soon IMO.

In the end, I wouldn't do this deal. Don't really want to pay Laine at the expense of losing Couts, and I'm not ready to give up on Provy. Although Jones is mighty tempting..
- Big_E_88

Does he?



Laine
17-18 44g 82gm 70p
18-19 30g 82gm 50p
19-20 28g 68gm 63p
20-21 9g 24gm 16p
4 year total:
111g 199p


Couturier
17-18 31g 82gm 76p
18-19 33g 80gm 76p
19-20 22g 69gm 59p
20-21 7g 20gm 21p
4 year total:
93g 232p

Ill take Couturier's scoring and overall play over Laine ANY day.

Does he?



Laine
17-18 44g 82gm 70p
18-19 30g 82gm 50p
19-20 28g 68gm 63p
20-21 9g 24gm 16p
4 year total:
111g 199p


Couturier
17-18 31g 82gm 76p
18-19 33g 80gm 76p
19-20 22g 69gm 59p
20-21 7g 20gm 21p
4 year total:
93g 232p

Ill take Couturier's scoring and overall play over Laine ANY day.
- MBFlyerfan

It's not even close!

Chuck says we’ve had a rough month but we still have a good hockey team. Lol

Looks like I’ll be rooting for another team next year. Sigh
- hereticpride

is he cracked?

Does he?



Laine
17-18 44g 82gm 70p
18-19 30g 82gm 50p
19-20 28g 68gm 63p
20-21 9g 24gm 16p
4 year total:
111g 199p


Couturier
17-18 31g 82gm 76p
18-19 33g 80gm 76p
19-20 22g 69gm 59p
20-21 7g 20gm 21p
4 year total:
93g 232p

Ill take Couturier's scoring and overall play over Laine ANY day.
- MBFlyerfan

laine is light year better it's not comparable

Lets stick to the veteran forwards on this team because that is where the bulk on the cap money is going. Is Giroux elite? I would say at this stage no he is not. He is a good player but not a player you build around. JVR had a hot start to the season but you are now seeing the JVR we all know and love once again. He has rarely put together a consistent season yet, even in this shortened season. Hayes is nothing short of a disaster at this point in time. He is far from elite. Jake is Jake, he has some good moments but the bad far outweighs the good with him. Couturier is the closest thing to elite this team has.

In the offseason if I were Fletcher, I would sign Dougie Hamilton and trade for either Ellis or Ekholm. If that means I give up Patrick, Ghost, Myers, Haag or Sanheim so be it, because I would be fine going into next season with Hamilton, Provorov, Ekholm, York, and two younger players.

On offense, I would steer Seattle to pick up JVR, and I would trade Jake to whomever wants him and cover 2M-25M in salary for the remainder of this term. Then I would try to sign or trade for a top 6 winger, and let the kids fill in the remaining spots.

You see, I give you specifics, not insults!
- jd250

You would have the team is salary cap hell while not being good enough. Short on young players with no chance of getting that elite player you covet because the team is stuck in the middle of not being good enough or bad enough. Well done.

At one time G was as close to a franchise center as the Flyers have had since Lindros. At the time of his last contract he was the face of the franchise, while attendance was falling. I never was a fan of Homers as a GM but he had little choice. Waiting too long to trade Voracek and Simmonds can be blamed on him along with so many other bad decisions.

Asked how much blame for the Flyers’ season – they are 4-8-1 in March and have fallen to 15-12-4 overall – he placed on the coaches, Fletcher pointed a finger at himself.

“It starts with me,” he said. “I’m responsible for the overall direction of the team, from hiring the coaches to bringing in the players. At this point in time, everyone is accountable. We’re all accountable for where we’re at in the standings. Having said that, we’re still in the middle of the playoff battle here. We’re pushing to get back in.”

yes, but I would be paying over $4M for a 3rd paring defenseman ... why on Earth would I want to do that?
- jd250

You just think you would be paying for a 3rd pair defenseman. That is not accurate.

Ill take Couturier's scoring and overall play over Laine ANY day.
- MBFlyerfan

IMO the gap between Jones and Provorov is just as big.

While interesting. Who says he wants to sign here? Do you not think others may drive the price up. Are you willing to give him 6x7.
- Peter Richards

I don't think it would take 7M to sign him.

is he cracked?
- 2Real

In a wide-ranging video interview with the media Wednesday, Fletcher said he did not consider himself to be a seller – at least at the moment – before the April 12 trade deadline and still believed the Flyers would make a playoff run.


“We’re certainly not looking at selling right now,” Fletcher said, adding that he has received “very few calls” from inquiring general managers, and that he has “made many.”

https://www.inquirer.com/...des-ekholm--20210324.html

1. Yes.
2. The reason he has received so few calls is that everybody knows the pieces we want to trade are not worth the price they would have to take on.

Does he?



Laine
17-18 44g 82gm 70p
18-19 30g 82gm 50p
19-20 28g 68gm 63p
20-21 9g 24gm 16p
4 year total:
111g 199p


Couturier
17-18 31g 82gm 76p
18-19 33g 80gm 76p
19-20 22g 69gm 59p
20-21 7g 20gm 21p
4 year total:
93g 232p

Ill take Couturier's scoring and overall play over Laine ANY day.
- MBFlyerfan

Valid point. And personally I take Couts over Laine too and it's not really close. I wasn't necessarily trying to compare the two, just point out that I think Laine still carries more of an offensive/goal-scoring reputation. And that coupled with his age leads me to believe that he will be looking to get paid, and some GM will likely ante up. At least they would under normal circumstances. Who knows with the upcoming financial landscape. I guess what I was trying to say is look at Jeff Skinner. Granted he was directly coming off a huge year, but again I think Laine still carries that premier goal-scoring rep. At least to some extent.

Why? Because you did not backread?

The original point was that Giroux is not an impact playoff player anymore, and if he stays here, will soak up $ that could be diverted to other FAs. Given that we will resign Couts and are committed to Hayes, this likely means you have 3 forwards with a net AAV of 7 million and no one among them who can be a true impact player in the playoffs.
- PT21

The other players can be the impact players. The best team wins. I don't care if the Flyers have some overpaid support players if they win the Cup.

For those who still don't believe that GMs are taking expansion and the flat cap seriously... that's straight from the horses mouth.
- Tomahawk

Nope. One poster is trading Giroux at the deadline with the Flyers retaining salary to a team. That team will then after this year, trade Giroux while also retaining salary. All the while out of the other side of his mouth lecturing on probabilities.

2. The reason he has received so few calls is that everybody knows the pieces we want to trade are not worth the price they would have to take on.
- PT21

It's simply term. GMs want those expiring deals. No matter the cap hit, b/c poop's all prorated at this point.

Jake on an expiring deal would be a hot commodity. Ditto JVR.

It apparently is.

People go on and on about how Giroux is not a bad player and so on. But dang it, no one is saying he is a dog.

He is however not enough in the playoffs and hogs up resources. As do many other vets. None of whom are dregs.

How many frikking dollars are we going to apportion to "not bad but not good enough players" before we run out of $ and run out of our lifetimes without another cup?
- PT21

Giroux is not a playoff impact player yet you suggest a team would trade for him and then retain money after this season when they trade him to another team. If he is not an impact player in the playoffs, why would a team do that?

It's simply term. GMs want those expiring deals. No matter the cap hit, b/c poop's all prorated at this point.

Jake on an expiring deal would be a hot commodity. Ditto JVR.
- Tomahawk

Not hard to understand the kind of players teams are looking for at the deadline.

It's simply term. GMs want those expiring deals.

Jake on an expiring deal would be a hot commodity. Ditto JVR.
- Tomahawk

I simply refuse to believe it is so binary. Nothing in life, nothing in business is ever so binary.

Term and salary retained are tradeoffs. Compensate for the former by enough of the latter and for sure it can happen.

You were talking about Laine. Right this year, in the middle of all this reluctance, he was traded with almost 2 million retained.

Giroux is not a playoff impact player yet you suggest a team would trade for him and then retain money after this season when they trade him to another team. If he is not an impact player in the playoffs, why would a team do that?
- MJL

Because he would be playing on a better team where he could do more, and because the team I mentioned is in a bind where there are not players of his caliber that could be moved to them.

1.5 mil salary retained for 1 year is nothing.

I simply refuse to believe it is so binary. Nothing in life, nothing in business is ever so binary.

Term and salary retained are tradeoffs. Compensate for the former by enough of the latter and for sure it can happen.

You were talking about Laine. Right this year, in the middle of all this reluctance, he was traded with almost 2 million retained.
- PT21

It was the only way that trade was happening b/c the Jackets needed space to ink Roslovic. It wasn't some inducement to get the Jackets to accept Laine.

Not to mention that you're talking about a swap of early 20-somethings. Foundational pieces.

Not 30+ vets on sunset deals they likely won't finish out.

You would have the team is salary cap hell while not being good enough. Short on young players with no chance of getting that elite player you covet because the team is stuck in the middle of not being good enough or bad enough. Well done.

- MJL

Laugh it up fuzzball! You can state whatever you want but this plan would work, the Flyers would have cap space, young talent and much better veteran players under this plan.

You just think you would be paying for a 3rd pair defenseman. That is not accurate.
- MJL

So your saying you would want Larsson in your top 4 playing 22 minutes a night? Delusional!

It was the only way that trade was happening b/c the Jackets needed space to ink Roslovic. It wasn't some inducement to get the Jackets to accept Laine.
- Tomahawk

Where did I suggest it was? Salary cap space is fungible. All trades are correlated.

If we cannot trade anyone this TDL, fine. But lets play our ED cards carefully. Its almost like a buyout opportunity. One of Voracek or JVR must go, and they will absolutely not go without inducements.