I think a goalie can bail out defensive turnovers. However, strong defense can help a struggling goalie regain some confidence. When both are playing as bad as possible you get 51 goals against in 11 games. The forwards need to play like they did in the first 50 mins of of the Isles game on Thursday. That would be a good start.

Simply competing with more intensity and within the system this team will improve. Needs to start there. If not, they will not recover this season.

From the Athletic (CO'C):

Top 10 ten reasons for Flyers recent debacle.

1. Goaltending. 2. Schedule 3. Coaching 4. Poor play by young payers. 5. Niskanen gap 6. Pood team D. 7. Almost nothing from Oskar, NoPa. 8. No fight in team (literally and in spirit) 9. Special teams 10. Bad luck.

I will post parts from the top 2 reason below, for those who don't have subscriptions and b/c we were talking about goalie/vs team D couple of days ago.
- PT21

I just read it....honestly number one should be poor team D. .....followed by no fight in team.

I just read it....honestly number one should be poor team D. .....followed by no fight in team.
- landros 2

Poor system structure
Poor defense and goalie play

Clean up the first one and the second one automatically gets better.

Good hockey trades always make sense when the opportunity comes along to improve your team, regardless of how the team is playing at the moment. For example, I have been big on getting Ekholm. I watched him again last night and saw a very good player that if he played like that for the Flyers could really help this team now. If the Flyers can get a player like Ekholm now for a reasonable price that still enables the Flyers to keep their top prospects and not impact their ED plans too much, they must do it, regardless of whether this team is making the playoffs this year or not. Sure Ekholm will not be enough to put this team over the top, but he is a step in the right direction. Now if you are like others that believe Myers and Sanheim will turn into a player even better than Ekholm, you stand pat and do nothing, but I personally don't believe in this approach.
- jd250

At this point there isn’t a trade that would vault the Flyers into instant cup favourite, but your 100 %correct, Fletcher needs to identify the needs of this team and start to address them. The only deals that make no sense are the “rental player” type. Clocks starting to tick on Fletcher ....can’t blame the previous guy....you’ve been in charge for two years.

Poor system structure
Poor defense and goalie play

Clean up the first one and the second one automatically gets better.
- mickel25

See that’s were I am kinda at....I do think Hart needs to be better...but hard to judge when the team D is so inept right now.

1. The goaltending

Whenever the Flyers’ goaltending is brought up in relation to their overarching problems, a loud contingent of the fan base perks up and screams into the ether that blaming everything on Carter Hart (and to a lesser extent Brian Elliott) undersells the depth of the team’s issues.

And that’s absolutely true. Goaltending isn’t Philadelphia’s only problem. But it is its biggest one.

The truth is that nothing has a larger impact on the perception of a team’s quality than goaltending. The list of coaches who earned Jack Adams Awards on the backs of their unexpectedly fantastic netminding is long; the list of those fired because of surprisingly poor goalie play is even longer. And the Flyers this season have absolutely received poor goalie play.

Right now, they sit second-to-last in the NHL in team save percentage at .880. And at five-on-five (.884), no team is worse — not even the Ottawa Senators (.891). Philly’s goalies are simply not stopping enough pucks.

But what about the defense, you might ask? We’ll get to that. It’s been a problem, too. But an .880 save percentage goes far beyond defensive issues. Since 2007-08, the worst full-season save percentage from an NHL team was .885 by the 2008-09 Toronto Maple Leafs. There have been plenty of teams over the past 13 seasons with terrible team defenses, but none have been less efficient at preventing pucks from ending up in the back of the net than these Flyers. Their defense isn’t great; it’s not true-talent historically bad.

Over the past few weeks, the Flyers have made more defensive mistakes than they should. But one of an NHL netminder’s primary duties is to erase mistakes — not just once in a while, not sometimes, but most of the time. Defensive breakdowns happen to every team; fans tend to remember only the ones that lead to goals. A lot of them have led to goals recently.

It goes beyond erasing mistakes, as well. Both Hart and Elliott are giving up truly weak goals seemingly on a nightly basis, especially during this recent swoon. Think back to March 6, when the Flyers were leading 3-2 with time running down in the second period only to watch Elliott allow a softie. Or this Thursday, when the skaters were stifling the Islanders in the third period up 3-0 until Hart whiffed on a harmless-looking Michel Dal Colle shot that gave New York life and ultimately sparked their comeback. Or even Saturday, when he let Casey Cizikas beat him on a clean-look wrist shot glove side and then later served up an easy empty-net goal to Josh Bailey with a poor pass attempt.

Some were game-changing goals against; others have come with the outcome no longer in doubt. But they all add up and make it impossible for any fair-minded person to argue that the only reason the Flyers are allowing so many goals is because of the defense. The Philadelphia goalies — both of them — are struggling mightily.
- PT21

And this was a surprise? The goalies have been terrible and so has the team D
Edit: I don’t think Elliot overall has been terrible

I think a goalie can bail out defensive turnovers. However, strong defense can help a struggling goalie regain some confidence. When both are playing as bad as possible you get 51 goals against in 11 games. The forwards need to play like they did in the first 50 mins of of the Isles game on Thursday. That would be a good start.

Simply competing with more intensity and within the system this team will improve. Needs to start there. If not, they will not recover this season.
- mickel25

Yes. Trickle effect. Early season the goalies both played ok. Saw a lot of shots. The team then got picked apart by Boston and harts confidence went imo. Others said it and we’ve seen it. He plays deeper in net but also isn’t “playing big”.

A physical agitating winger should not cost that much to procure. I like to see that deal made right now.

just for kicks-

if you had to part with one of Oscar or Patrick who would it be?

Oscar is a 200 foot player

Patrick has that rep too


I think I would keep Patrick because he has a higher ceiling, Flyers lack that on the whole

man stay healthy, can absolutely shoot...


https://theahl.com/ahl_vi...s-vs-phantoms-mar-21-2021

Phantoms game seemed much better than when I watched last season, really moving the puck. The goal tending reminded me of the Flyers goal tending, no bueno

Teams know what Prosser is. He is an AHL depth defenseman. He has a very low value at the trade deadline if any at all. Teams also know what Gustafsson is. Teams already have plenty of games to watch Gustafsson to know what he brings.
I pray that Fletcher makes the proper assessment of this team for this season and waits until the off season to make some smart moves.
- MJL

I am not sure about the “rules” taxi, expansion draft, etc. do you know if they could bring in York to help the short term needs (or at least get him some experience this year) without having him exposed to the expansion draft or any other negative effects - except potentially throwing him in to early?

When you say "hockey trade", most people are thinking the kind of trade where it's NHL player(s) for NHL player(s), both teams filling immediate needs. Johanson for Seth Jones, Pronger for Shanahan, Rico/LeClair for Recchi, etc.

I'd be all for that.

Trading youngsters/picks for a 30+ vet or a pure rental is a completely different can of worms. One that I hope Fletch avoids.
- Tomahawk

Yes, this team is no where close to being in a position to attain pure rentals, but a good player with term is something different.

Poor system structure
Poor defense and goalie play

Clean up the first one and the second one automatically gets better.
- mickel25

I can't blame the system because when this team actually executes it, it has proven to work well and win hockey games.

From the Athletic (CO'C):

Top 10 ten reasons for Flyers recent debacle.

1. Goaltending. 2. Schedule 3. Coaching 4. Poor play by young payers. 5. Niskanen gap 6. Pood team D. 7. Almost nothing from Oskar, NoPa. 8. No fight in team (literally and in spirit) 9. Special teams 10. Bad luck.

I will post parts from the top 2 reason below, for those who don't have subscriptions and b/c we were talking about goalie/vs team D couple of days ago.
- PT21

I'd say number 8 is the top one on my list, because its the most disturbing to me.

just for kicks-

if you had to part with one of Oscar or Patrick who would it be?

Oscar is a 200 foot player

Patrick has that rep too


I think I would keep Patrick because he has a higher ceiling, Flyers lack that on the whole
- wcorvette

Oskar's had to deal with chemo, cancer, Covid, a benching.... and he's still managed to be more effective than Patrick so far this year. Let that sink in for a moment.

NP is running out of excuses. I personally trade him before Oskar without any hesitation.

I can't blame the system because when this team actually executes it, it has proven to work well and win hockey games.
- jd250

I worded that wrong. I meant poor execution of system.

They can't play well consistently ... its been like this for the better part of a decade over 4 coaches, including 2 Stanley Cup winners and a 2 time Stanley Cup runner up. Listen, I love G, I really do, but I have concluded now that its time to move on from him and Jake, this teams needs a new culture and a new attitude. They also need some toughness, man I wish Morin had worked out for this team!
- jd250

I understand the fans frustrations but I always get a chuckle when I read about the last decade. That time is irrelevant to now. I think it's completely absurd and shear lunacy to say it's time to move on from Giroux. Unless you're blown away by a deal.

I am not sure about the “rules” taxi, expansion draft, etc. do you know if they could bring in York to help the short term needs (or at least get him some experience this year) without having him exposed to the expansion draft or any other negative effects - except potentially throwing him in to early?
- leon neon

He wouldn’t be exposed. Farabee isn’t exposed this year.

just for kicks-

if you had to part with one of Oscar or Patrick who would it be?

Oscar is a 200 foot player

Patrick has that rep too


I think I would keep Patrick because he has a higher ceiling, Flyers lack that on the whole
- wcorvette

Agree. He can go to wing and right now Oscar gets you more.

I understand the fans frustrations but I always get a chuckle when I read about the last decade. That time is irrelevant to now. I think it's completely absurd and shear lunacy to say it's time to move on from Giroux. Unless you're blown away by a deal.
- MJL

I think it's completely absurd and shear lunacy to say it's not time to move on from Giroux.

There is no offer as he controls his own fate.

I think a goalie can bail out defensive turnovers. However, strong defense can help a struggling goalie regain some confidence. When both are playing as bad as possible you get 51 goals against in 11 games. The forwards need to play like they did in the first 50 mins of of the Isles game on Thursday. That would be a good start.

Simply competing with more intensity and within the system this team will improve. Needs to start there. If not, they will not recover this season.
- mickel25

I briefly read it. Anyone writing that the goaltenders are expected to erase mistakes at the rate and level that the Flyers have been making on a regular basis is truly clueless.

man stay healthy, can absolutely shoot...


https://theahl.com/ahl_vi...s-vs-phantoms-mar-21-2021
- wcorvette

Thanks for sharing.

I am not sure about the “rules” taxi, expansion draft, etc. do you know if they could bring in York to help the short term needs (or at least get him some experience this year) without having him exposed to the expansion draft or any other negative effects - except potentially throwing him in to early?
- leon neon

It would be a huge mistake to burn a year of an ELC for York on this team. If anything, sign him to an ATO and get him some time on the Phantoms if he is ready to turn pro.

I briefly read it. Anyone writing that the goaltenders are expected to erase mistakes at the rate and level that the Flyers have been making on a regular basis is truly clueless.
- MJL

submit your resume to them.