https://www.1stohiobatter...points-against-hurricanes

Was just reading about this. Not sure how accurate this is, but pretty f’d up & embarrassing for the league.

Why didn't they challenge it? Wasn't watching the game so have no idea.
- 668710

They did challenge it, and the refs got it wrong.

They did challenge it, and the refs got it wrong.
- j.boyd919

Wow

https://www.1stohiobattery.com/columbus-blue-jackets-news/2021/02/5691/bizarre-ruling-on-challenge-costs-blue-jackets-chance-at-two-points-against-hurricanes

Was just reading about this. Not sure how accurate this is, but pretty f’d up & embarrassing for the league.
- wsldck

That's nuts. Why even admit it? At that point just let it go.

https://www.1stohiobattery.com/columbus-blue-jackets-news/2021/02/5691/bizarre-ruling-on-challenge-costs-blue-jackets-chance-at-two-points-against-hurricanes

Was just reading about this. Not sure how accurate this is, but pretty f’d up & embarrassing for the league.
- wsldck

Wow that's terrible. They said he was off-sides later, took away the penalty for bad challenge, but let the goal stand?

Wow that's terrible. They said he was off-sides later, took away the penalty for bad challenge, but let the goal stand?
- Tojo.

Yep

I agree some of these guys couldn't be kept under the cap. It's just when comparing rosters to the last Stanley Cup winner those are significant.

If I we could take today's team with 2017-2018 versions of Crosby, Malkin, Letang and Dumoulin, this team might really be a contender. Which is why I feel it was right to push in rather than rebuild at that point, it's hard to replace what we lost in age.

Honest view not hindsight, I thought they overpaid for Hunwick who had such a small sample of success. And not doing the Reaves trade you likely have Sundqvist helping the bottom 6 on an ELC and a 1st to move elsewhere or use. It was a big price for a move that looked bad at the time from the outside and on the inside Sully wasn't committed to which should have been figured out before the trade.

And that cap space I thought should have gone to a 3C. I was torn on if it should be Bonino (I was thinking 3.5M per) because it was a slight over pay but might have been worth it to take the fit you knew worked. Hindsight says keeping Bonino was probably the right call, me at the time felt they should have aimed higher then McKegg and hope for a 3C to trade for later.
- Tojo.

The other thing with asset management that you can’t determine is even though, for example, klim kostin was picked with pitts pick, that doesn’t mean that is who pitt would take, and that doesn’t mean that pick wouldn’t have been moved at another point for a better/worse player say at the trade deadline.

I think jr did generally a pretty good job with the forwards although sundquist and a first for reaves was ridiculous and I said it here the day the trade was made. His issue, or whomever he has evaluating talent, seems to be with defence.

It’s hysterical to me that anyone would defend GMJRs asset management.

Matheson hurt in practice. McCaan not at practice (not that anybody would notice).

Matheson hurt in practice. McCaan not at practice (not that anybody would notice).
- madmike71

Is Matheson Beau Bennett in disguise?

The other thing with asset management that you can’t determine is even though, for example, klim kostin was picked with pitts pick, that doesn’t mean that is who pitt would take, and that doesn’t mean that pick wouldn’t have been moved at another point for a better/worse player say at the trade deadline.

I think jr did generally a pretty good job with the forwards although sundquist and a first for reaves was ridiculous and I said it here the day the trade was made. His issue, or whomever he has evaluating talent, seems to be with defence.
- 10inchTerror

Except, for the 1,000th time, it was just a 20 spot move down in the draft, which is near meaningless. Kostin sucks, the guy the Pens drafted sucks (or was prohibitively injured), and the guy the Pens might have drafted would have sucked. It was basically Sundqvist for Reaves. Sund wasn't doing anything at the time and even now he is just a 4C. Big deal. Reaves could have been good except Sully doesn't like guys who are too physical.

Sully thinks he can win with 4 lines of water bugs who just flit around and steal the puck and score so fast the other team won't know what happened. This model works ok to amass some regular season points and then when the playoffs come around, they are completely unprepared and unable to compete.

They need to hire a GM who will fire Sully right away and replace him with someone of his choosing. Long past due. Sully has completely lost this team.

Matheson hurt in practice. McCaan not at practice (not that anybody would notice).
- madmike71

When ZAR is on the 3rd line people will notice.

When ZAR is on the 3rd line people will notice.
- Tojo.

LOL

It’s hysterical to me that anyone would defend GMJRs asset management.
- Feds91Stammer

Yeah. That's why I didn't bother engaging much with him. I don't know how to break something down that's already so obviously clear.

Yeah. That's why I didn't bother engaging much with him. I don't know how to break something down that's already so obviously clear.
- Rinosaur

There’s like 6 players left from the cup. Sid, Geno, Jake, Letang, Dumo and Ruh.

That’s how much turnover this roster has had with no clear direction. Even this seasons roster has no clear direction IMO.

There’s like 6 players left from the cup. Sid, Geno, Jake, Letang, Dumo and Ruh.

That’s how much turnover this roster has had with no clear direction. Even this seasons roster has no clear direction IMO.
- j.boyd919

Totally agree. Pens had holes in the bottom six and a surplus of LD's. What does JR do? He trades our best bottom six asset for another LD. An LD who makes $4M+ to play the third pair.

Great asset management. Totally clear direction... not.

Totally agree. Pens had holes in the bottom six and a surplus of LD's. What does JR do? He trades our best bottom six asset for another LD. An LD who makes $4M+ to play the third pair.

Great asset management. Totally clear direction... not.
- Rinosaur

It’s very reminiscent to Holland’s moves.

Prospects like Janmark or Jarnkrok that become good cheap 3rd liners.

Picks that became Vasy and Hintz.

People acting like all these futures being moved isn’t gonna show to be horrible in a few years.

There’s like 6 players left from the cup. Sid, Geno, Jake, Letang, Dumo and Ruh.

That’s how much turnover this roster has had with no clear direction. Even this seasons roster has no clear direction IMO.
- j.boyd919

Yeah, not to mention how many spots like 3C and bottom pair have had 3 or 4 guys in that span.

I think we're on our 7th 3C since Bonino left less then 4 years ago, and I'm probably missing some. McKegg, Sheahan, Brassard, Bjugstad, McCann, Jankowski, and for now Blueger.

Except, for the 1,000th time, it was just a 20 spot move down in the draft, which is near meaningless. Kostin sucks, the guy the Pens drafted sucks (or was prohibitively injured), and the guy the Pens might have drafted would have sucked. It was basically Sundqvist for Reaves. Sund wasn't doing anything at the time and even now he is just a 4C. Big deal. Reaves could have been good except Sully doesn't like guys who are too physical.

Sully thinks he can win with 4 lines of water bugs who just flit around and steal the puck and score so fast the other team won't know what happened. This model works ok to amass some regular season points and then when the playoffs come around, they are completely unprepared and unable to compete.

They need to hire a GM who will fire Sully right away and replace him with someone of his choosing. Long past due. Sully has completely lost this team.
- Hockey66

Dropping 20 spots to trade one up and coming 4th liner for a proven 4th liner is a lot to to give up. It’s a bug on the windshield in terms of the team but so was O’Connor’s turnover at the other teams blue line last game. In aggregate lots of little things make a big difference.

It’s very reminiscent to Holland’s moves.

Prospects like Janmark or Jarnkrok that become good cheap 3rd liners.

Picks that became Vasy and Hintz.

People acting like all these futures being moved isn’t gonna show to be horrible in a few years.
- Feds91Stammer

Dude is just confused on what asset management is. He thinks we're saying JR didn't make any good moves that helped the Pens, so I really didn't feel like explaining to him how despite good moves being made, bad moves can still have long-term repercussions.

Did you order the knives?

Yeah, not to mention how many spots like 3C and bottom pair have had 3 or 4 guys in that span.

I think we're on our 7th 3C since Bonino left less then 4 years ago, and I'm probably missing some. McKegg, Sheahan, Brassard, Bjugstad, McCann, Jankowski, and for now Blueger.
- Tojo.

Yep. Honestly though, if the PP was clicking and the PK was even average we’d probably be talking a bit different on the board.

Dropping 20 spots to trade one up and coming 4th liner for a proven 4th liner is a lot to to give up. It’s a bug on the windshield in terms of the team but so was O’Connor’s turnover at the other teams blue line last game. In aggregate lots of little things make a big difference.
- 10inchTerror

Well, the win-now team of the Pens needed more provens than maybes. And I think there was justification for targeting a guy like Reaves. But you're right, it is a bug on the windshield, but I think the fault there lies more with Sully than JR.

I can't remember if O'Connor's turnover led to Ceci getting beaten like a rented mule or Letang cutting off his own defenseman on his opposite side, both of which led to a goal. We could analyze the minutiae forever but the bottom line is this team is not good and hasn't been for a long time. Big decisions will need to be made soon.

Here's what I know:
* JR did pretty well overall with a couple of very noticeable gaffes but was trending in the wrong direction.

* Sully should have been gone a long time ago and each day that he is still the coach and the team is not making moves in one direction or another is lost time and potential.

Wow that's terrible. They said he was off-sides later, took away the penalty for bad challenge, but let the goal stand?
- Tojo.

Pretty much.

Yep. Honestly though, if the PP was clicking and the PK was even average we’d probably be talking a bit different on the board.
- j.boyd919

I remember times when we complained that all we do is score on the PP and can't do poop 5v5.

If the PP was clicking this team would be very dangerous in spite of their poop habits.

Well, the win-now team of the Pens needed more provens than maybes. And I think there was justification for targeting a guy like Reaves. But you're right, it is a bug on the windshield, but I think the fault there lies more with Sully than JR.

I can't remember if O'Connor's turnover led to Ceci getting beaten like a rented mule or Letang cutting off his own defenseman on his opposite side, both of which led to a goal. We could analyze the minutiae forever but the bottom line is this team is not good and hasn't been for a long time. Big decisions will need to be made soon.

Here's what I know:
* JR did pretty well overall with a couple of very noticeable gaffes but was trending in the wrong direction.

* Sully should have been gone a long time ago and each day that he is still the coach and the team is not making moves in one direction or another is lost time and potential.
- Hockey66

I think jr did a lot of good on offence but I think however his team came to evaluate defensive players, he has struggled mightily.

I think jr and sully are the 2 biggest problems on the team. 1 is gone and hopefully the 2nd show drops.

We’ll never know I guess if one protected the other or what relationship they had but it is 110% time to move on and get a gm/coach tandem that are on the same page. Whether Reaves was a good trade or not sully completely screwed that one.