I am surprised he got extended as well. I am far from convinced he is not the answer to lead these guys. Time will tell but I predicted he would be the first coach fired this season. However the situation he is in is a tough one with all the key injuries. The season outlook is horrendous at present.

Agree that Shaw was pretty much the best Hawks. Suter was pretty decent too. The "top" line was pretty awful. Didn't mind Wallmark in general too, he was doing his job I thought.

On the back end, Murphy, De Haan and Mitchell were the better guys in my books. Zadorov did what he does best but seems to me he runs around a bit much. Keith had his moments but a lot of mistakes last night. Boqvist is not an NHL dman at this point.
- breadbag

The top line will continue to struggle because Strome skates like hes wearing concrete shoes. Hes not fast enough to keep up, and especially at the center position. This is where missing DACH is a big time negative.

The other guy who is going to lose his mind is Kubalik....there isn't enough depth skill on this team to put him in the best position to help this team score.

Thank you and I was thinking the exact same thing as i watching this.

See how long Kane can compose himself as Im sure getting his ass rollled each and every night will tax him. Especially if those around him cant convert when he gives them opportunities.

The criticism of JC is valid as this could easily be the same situation of where Nagy is trying to impose a system when he doesn't have the right pieces. The only thing I really worry about are

1. Young guys who will be on the ice getting exposed, not losing confidence in their own abilities
2. Young players developing bad habits because of JC's system. Lets all remember November of 2008 in Arizona when Q, freshly on the job, chained Sharp and Kane to the bench for making bonehead plays.

I am perfectly OK with trial and error and young guys gaining experience at the NHL level, but they need to be learning it the right way.

That game was 10-1 last night if not for some very nice saves by Suban and some posts being hit. I dont see how this team doesn't lead the league in goals against, in a bad way this year.
- SteveRain

All goalies make tough saves - even Vasilevsky made some tough ones last nite against an ineffective Chicago offense. Might as well say that if not for some nice saves by the goalie in blue, it could have been a tight game.

It’s not the saves they make as much as the ones they let in. I would say that 2 of the goals he gave up COULD have been stopped - and if a goalie COULD have stopped a shot, he SHOULD have. Two is too many to let in in a game against the Cup championss who WILL score a couple or more on their own (like last nite).

I’m not giving up on Subban - can’t after only one game in almost a year.

Not sure what everyone was expecting.

It was pretty much a known that even with Toews and Dach this team was going to struggle some. Subtract them and Saad, and consider that there were ZERO pre-season games, expectations should not be much.

I would give it a couple of weeks and some games before we start proclaiming booms and busts. There are a few vets we can see have not really changed their perceptions. Pirri is them same player he has always been, a fringe NHLer who should not be taking anyone's spot. You think there is a reason he has played for 5 teams over 10 years and has averaged less than 30 games a season? Subban's game last night was a perfect example of what he is. Capable of making some fantastic saves, just as capable of giving up some soft goals, inconsistent rebound control and positioning. There is a reason his career GAA is 3+ and his Save Pct is sub .900.

As I said to someone while watching last nights game. You are facing arguably on of the top teams in the NHL with a team that has ONE top line player, ZERO top pairing defensemen and a average at best backup goalie. What was the expectation?
- TheTrob

A lot of people were trying to warn about this before the season started, and you summarized it well. I understand that people are unhappy about the state of the team and wish they were more competitive. I even yelled at the TV once or twice last might.

The fact of the matter is that they are down two of their best three forwards (who are centers which makes it that much worse). They are not going to be good this year (despite my bullish projections). If I had to put money on it, I would bet that the front office said, "Look, it's going to be a crap year regardless since there likely won't be many fans and the season is shortened. Let's have a structured development year where we can bring a variety of players in to test out where they are." They will likely find some middle 6, or specialist type players that are useful and ideally at least a solid backup goalie.

The one thing that I would really like to see is Strome just say "eff it" and get more aggressive. He is a good hockey player (hands, IQ, etc), but he looks a bit passive on the ice.

Not sure what everyone was expecting.

It was pretty much a known that even with Toews and Dach this team was going to struggle some. Subtract them and Saad, and consider that there were ZERO pre-season games, expectations should not be much.

I would give it a couple of weeks and some games before we start proclaiming booms and busts. There are a few vets we can see have not really changed their perceptions. Pirri is them same player he has always been, a fringe NHLer who should not be taking anyone's spot. You think there is a reason he has played for 5 teams over 10 years and has averaged less than 30 games a season? Subban's game last night was a perfect example of what he is. Capable of making some fantastic saves, just as capable of giving up some soft goals, inconsistent rebound control and positioning. There is a reason his career GAA is 3+ and his Save Pct is sub .900.

As I said to someone while watching last nights game. You are facing arguably on of the top teams in the NHL with a team that has ONE top line player, ZERO top pairing defensemen and a average at best backup goalie. What was the expectation?
- TheTrob

Good points. I think the Hawks needed pre-season games a lot more than Tampa does and they are more of a well oiled machine with more talent.

The Hawks really couldn't afford to lose Toews or Dach and having them both out is going to be so tough.

This unfortunately is what I am prepared for.

You have 9 players new from last year's opeining day roster, 5 forward 3 defeseman and a goalie.

Due to injuries you have one forward (Kane) slotted correctly on a line, and arguably zero defenseman slotted correctly until the rookies hopefully take the next step.

You play the SCC with a 10 day exhibition training camp, with a team that has been together and been in the elite category for years.

I think the insertion of Pirri was because 1) replacement for Soderberg(obviously), and 2, try and get another skater that has played NHL hockey before. Putting Kurashev,Hagel in the first game against the Stanley Cup Champs could of been a deer in the headlights moment. They will both get their turn.

In the scrimmage and last night, seems Kampf has upped his game a little on offense. Might want to try Kampf/Kubalik/Suter as line 3 when Soderberg gets back.

Thank you and I was thinking the exact same thing as i watching this.

See how long Kane can compose himself as Im sure getting his ass rollled each and every night will tax him. Especially if those around him cant convert when he gives them opportunities.

The criticism of JC is valid as this could easily be the same situation of where Nagy is trying to impose a system when he doesn't have the right pieces. The only thing I really worry about are

1. Young guys who will be on the ice getting exposed, not losing confidence in their own abilities
2. Young players developing bad habits because of JC's system. Lets all remember November of 2008 in Arizona when Q, freshly on the job, chained Sharp and Kane to the bench for making bonehead plays.

I am perfectly OK with trial and error and young guys gaining experience at the NHL level, but they need to be learning it the right way.

That game was 10-1 last night if not for some very nice saves by Suban and some posts being hit. I dont see how this team doesn't lead the league in goals against, in a bad way this year.
- SteveRain

There will undoubtedly be some growing pains with Mitchell, Boqvist, Carlsson, Beaudin and the other young defensemen that will lead to some odd man breaks, break downs in coverage and other mistakes leading to goals, but with Keith, DeHaan, Murphy and Zadorov it should be better. You really need to question why it isn't. While none of them are necessarily top pairing defensemen anymore (or never have been), all of them are arguably 2nd pair worthy. That points to system, style of individual play, or mismatched pairings, being the issue. For example, Keith and Murphy are both capable D-men, they just don't seem to play well together, leading to more chances against than you would assume.

To add to that, the Goaltending will really need someone to step up and earn a spot. Subban made some nice saves, but the majority of them were after the game was decided. This team will not have the ability to dig themselves out of big holes, or survive soft goals in a tight game.

The top line will continue to struggle because Strome skates like hes wearing concrete shoes. Hes not fast enough to keep up, and especially at the center position. This is where missing DACH is a big time negative.

The other guy who is going to lose his mind is Kubalik....there isn't enough depth skill on this team to put him in the best position to help this team score.
- SteveRain

You are right there. I was really hoping Strome could find a little extra motor to keep his feet moving quicker, but he just continues to lag behind.

Kubalik is definitely missing the chemistry he had with Toews/Saad. The Hawks lacked possession of the puck on the attack for long stretches and they really need to get someone going that can feed Kubalik some open chances to shoot.

I also don't know what the official scoring folks consider a giveaway. Last night, each team was credited with one giveaway. That probably isn't far off for Tampa, but the Hawks...I think we had some guys who should have been credited with a handful.

Thank you and I was thinking the exact same thing as i watching this.

See how long Kane can compose himself as Im sure getting his ass rollled each and every night will tax him. Especially if those around him cant convert when he gives them opportunities.

The criticism of JC is valid as this could easily be the same situation of where Nagy is trying to impose a system when he doesn't have the right pieces. The only thing I really worry about are

1. Young guys who will be on the ice getting exposed, not losing confidence in their own abilities
2. Young players developing bad habits because of JC's system. Lets all remember November of 2008 in Arizona when Q, freshly on the job, chained Sharp and Kane to the bench for making bonehead plays.

I am perfectly OK with trial and error and young guys gaining experience at the NHL level, but they need to be learning it the right way.

That game was 10-1 last night if not for some very nice saves by Suban and some posts being hit. I dont see how this team doesn't lead the league in goals against, in a bad way this year.
- SteveRain

I do agree with #2, it's my concern as well, remember when Oduya came here and it took him the traded year to figure out how coach Q wanted him to play,

It's a bit troublesome when a forward skates in a dman picks him up and follows the forward out to the blue line, there's no protecting the house more like burning down the house in this D

All goalies make tough saves - even Vasilevsky made some tough ones last nite against an ineffective Chicago offense. Might as well say that if not for some nice saves by the goalie in blue, it could have been a tight game.

It’s not the saves they make as much as the ones they let in. I would say that 2 of the goals he gave up COULD have been stopped - and if a goalie COULD have stopped a shot, he SHOULD have. Two is too many to let in in a game against the Cup championss who WILL score a couple or more on their own (like last nite).

I’m not giving up on Subban - can’t after only one game in almost a year.
- StLBravesFan

where did I say I was giving up on him? He's a journeyman goalie, who wasn't a priority to resign give the length it took Bowman to do it. Still, he's likely their best option to start each and every night unless 1 of the 2 AHL guys step up.

There is NO point in nitpicking the goals against. The great saves and soft goals balance each other out....most nights.....the difference is the elite goalies have check marks in the great saves than they do soft goals.

This organization really needs to find a young goalie in the next 2 years to ride.....and that's assuming the system in front of said person gets a lot better.

I am sorry my prediction of there not being a Blackhawk goal in game one was incorrect, put to rest with 3.5 minutes left.

I found it very interesting that so many teams put first team power plays on the that include TWO defenseman, reserving the 4th forward option until the "training camp portion of the schedule, the first half-dozen games" ends.

So we saw a Cup waning team comfortable with their familiarity against an injured, team with a rookie goalie carousel.

I am not so sure we can be objective about it just yet.

I am surprised he got extended as well. I am far from convinced he is not the answer to lead these guys. Time will tell but I predicted he would be the first coach fired this season. However the situation he is in is a tough one with all the key injuries. The season outlook is horrendous at present.
- joegreif17

I've been trying to say this gently for a while now, but it does not make much difference who is the current coach of this team. We can scream and moan about schemes and missed assignments, but they would be happening under any coach with this collection. Q, Trotz, Cooper, etc. would all have the same issues with this squad. They are not built to compete right now. Especially after the two centers went down, they knew it would be tough to compete.

I'm a sunshine and rainbows kind of guy. I always am looking for that strange "feel good" story of the underdog winning, while expecting/knowing the reality of the situation. I'm still going to watch and hope for wins, development and who the team will build around.

Sorry for the tangent there. I tend to get distracted easil... Squirrel!!

You are right there. I was really hoping Strome could find a little extra motor to keep his feet moving quicker, but he just continues to lag behind.

Kubalik is definitely missing the chemistry he had with Toews/Saad. The Hawks lacked possession of the puck on the attack for long stretches and they really need to get someone going that can feed Kubalik some open chances to shoot.
- breadbag

Strome is playing against Bolts top line, he more than held his own, made some nice defensive plays, nice passes to get out of the d zone, did well at the dot, if anyone deserves criticism its Cat, his hands are becoming stone

There will undoubtedly be some growing pains with Mitchell, Boqvist, Carlsson, Beaudin and the other young defensemen that will lead to some odd man breaks, break downs in coverage and other mistakes leading to goals, but with Keith, DeHaan, Murphy and Zadorov it should be better. You really need to question why it isn't. While none of them are necessarily top pairing defensemen anymore (or never have been), all of them are arguably 2nd pair worthy. That points to system, style of individual play, or mismatched pairings, being the issue. For example, Keith and Murphy are both capable D-men, they just don't seem to play well together, leading to more chances against than you would assume.

To add to that, the Goaltending will really need someone to step up and earn a spot. Subban made some nice saves, but the majority of them were after the game was decided. This team will not have the ability to dig themselves out of big holes, or survive soft goals in a tight game.
- TheTrob

I agree with all of that.....count me as a guy hoping they get a top 3 pick. The better the picks they have, the better the player they get (hopefully), and the quicker this turns around.

IMO....this team will be no differently defensively than what we saw last year.....the biggest difference is we had 2 legit #1s in goal bailing out this defense when prime chance after prime chance was given up. So 2 goalies , also rarely let in a soft goal.

Without their 2 top centers, there is really no point in being surprised this team doesnt score, and the defensive woes will be more glaring.

Again, just want to see individual steps forward by younger guys possibly identified as long term building blocks even if the team is a dumpster fire.

You are right there. I was really hoping Strome could find a little extra motor to keep his feet moving quicker, but he just continues to lag behind.

Kubalik is definitely missing the chemistry he had with Toews/Saad. The Hawks lacked possession of the puck on the attack for long stretches and they really need to get someone going that can feed Kubalik some open chances to shoot.
- breadbag

I thought Shaw was very noticeable last night and maybe he is valuable come deadline time for a contending team.

I don't get STrome......a depth winger, OK.....but again, he wasn't a huge priority for Bowman to ink given the long time it took to happen....maybe Stan was hoping somebody would take a run at him.

I do agree with #2, it's my concern as well, remember when Oduya came here and it took him the traded year to figure out how coach Q wanted him to play,

It's a bit troublesome when a forward skates in a dman picks him up and follows the forward out to the blue line, there's no protecting the house more like burning down the house in this D
- BetweenTheDots

HAHAHA....the "pizza man".....I remember watching games 3/4 at the UC as Oduya looked lost. Great call on that.

Yeah, I don't know what they are trying to do defensively and forcing a system on a team when you don't have the right players is just insanity.

I am surprised he got extended as well. I am far from convinced he is not the answer to lead these guys. Time will tell but I predicted he would be the first coach fired this season. However the situation he is in is a tough one with all the key injuries. The season outlook is horrendous at present.
- joegreif17

It's really not that surprising. He was on the last year of his contract and it's a compressed season with zero expectations of success and the loss of Toews and Dach just ensured that. Teams typically don't like lame duck coaches. A 2 year extension just means that his "hot seat" won't be turned on until next season, which will hopefully be a full one. Say what you will but Colliton has not had a "normal" season yet. Took over for Q mid-season, League shutdown 2nd season, Compressed season with no pre-season 3rd year. Not to say the guy is a genius, but I would tend to give him a little more leash due to circumstances.

I've been trying to say this gently for a while now, but it does not make much difference who is the current coach of this team. We can scream and moan about schemes and missed assignments, but they would be happening under any coach with this collection. Q, Trotz, Cooper, etc. would all have the same issues with this squad. They are not built to compete right now. Especially after the two centers went down, they knew it would be tough to compete.

I'm a sunshine and rainbows kind of guy. I always am looking for that strange "feel good" story of the underdog winning, while expecting/knowing the reality of the situation. I'm still going to watch and hope for wins, development and who the team will build around.

Sorry for the tangent there. I tend to get distracted easil... Squirrel!!
- Chunk

No rant at all, nice to have a sunny disposition. Your right for sure it would not matter with this group. Toews is a great captain and just missing him is bad news. Back to the coach though even with a healthy team I do not like his decision making. Similarily as a Flyer fan primarily when Hakstol and Hextall were running my team I called for their heads two years in advance for a variety of reasons (especially the trading of Schenn) Funny thing I was right, the team is solid now that the two goofs are gone. I think the top priorety right now is finding a goalie for the future as the cupboard is bare, Subban can back up but that is all he can handle. All the Subbans decline with age or wear out their welcome. I really feel for Kane being in this mess and Kubalik is going to suffer as well..........

I just want to say, i know we are in a rebuild, i know to have lower expectations, i agree with all this.

Now when i say what i say its not because we traded Nik for him, blah blah blah

He's just a bad defenseman , i speak of Murphy he's been in this league for how long? Just going to point out 3 things last night

Murphy finally gets the puck on his stick in his own end after a long battle, there's a wide open forward misses him like Mitch misses with the deep pass, icing, lose faceoff back of our net

2, 1 deflected goal he's standing in front of Subban while the forward is in front of the net, covered him like the Bears zone defense

3 they are on a PK and the he gets caught to far up ice which allows a 2 on 1 which is miffed by the opponent

He's just a bad defenseman he has zero intuition, blah blah blah he trains really hard , but it's really no coincidence the Hawks since he's been here haven't sniffed the playoffs
Not saying it's all his fault just saying he does nothing to help you win games
- BetweenTheDots

I totally agree with you. He's so slow and doesn't seem to think the game quick. Is a huge reason they get pinned on their end a lot. He's not very good. I wish they'd trade him and DeHaan and let Carlsson and other play. Keep Keith until he decides otherwise.

Hmm, sounds like to me the young defensemen with much less coaching got it more right and the old defensemen with much more coaching got it more wrong. Go ahead, blame it on the coach, not the old guys cruising.

Strome is playing against Bolts top line, he more than held his own, made some nice defensive plays, nice passes to get out of the d zone, did well at the dot, if anyone deserves criticism its Cat, his hands are becoming stone
- BetweenTheDots

I really think they need to play debrincat on the right wing. He doesn't have the agility or hands to make a move at the line or in the offensive zone to play his off wing. When he and Kane gained entry on the powerplay they were each on their strong side and debrincat was able to stick handle through traffic to enter the zone. I know everyone will go on about him being a left winger so he can one time it blah blah blah. He's not that good at it and can still try that useless tactic on the PP

Hmm, sounds like to me the young defensemen with much less coaching got it more right and the old defensemen with much more coaching got it more wrong. Go ahead, blame it on the coach, not the old guys cruising.
- rpeters01

Not sure if it was cruising or being too concerned about covering for their partners (that they might not yet trust), but point made. They do need better communication overall, and Boqvist and ADB both need to be much more aware of their surroundings when they try their drop passes on the PP. They were picked off twice last night and almost got caught three other times.

I've been trying to say this gently for a while now, but it does not make much difference who is the current coach of this team. We can scream and moan about schemes and missed assignments, but they would be happening under any coach with this collection. Q, Trotz, Cooper, etc. would all have the same issues with this squad. They are not built to compete right now. Especially after the two centers went down, they knew it would be tough to compete.

I'm a sunshine and rainbows kind of guy. I always am looking for that strange "feel good" story of the underdog winning, while expecting/knowing the reality of the situation. I'm still going to watch and hope for wins, development and who the team will build around.

Sorry for the tangent there. I tend to get distracted easil... Squirrel!!
- Chunk

Good points, Chunk. Trotz himself said that defense is about commitment, and that the impact of schemes is overblown. But, what does he know about defense? JC has lots of players to plug in, and the ability to sit those who do not commit to defense. Judging him on his willingness to do that seems fair.

The team was outplayed out hustled and out coach. Again the biggest problem is defensive zone play that falls on the veteran d and coaching. Subban was left out to dry imo except for one goal the rest he had no chance. Hawks be lucky to win 15 games this year. But were stuck with bowman and JC for 2 more years yea.