Yes, the MVP and best offense, in the super bowl, because that’s where those teams are almost every, single, year
- sbroads24

Yea, the Panthers lost to a team with average QB play, a strong running game, and a strong defence.

But hey they did make the Super Bowl. I’m sure they celebrate and rejoice about it....

Yea, the Panthers lost to a team with average QB play, a strong running game, and a strong defence.

But hey they did make the Super Bowl. I’m sure they celebrate and rejoice about it....
- Pegullaville

Yes, having a strong defense and good running game is one way to win football games. I’m not arguing this. It is not THE way to win football games.

Yes, having a strong defense and good running game is one way to win football games. I’m not arguing this. It is not THE way to win football games.
- sbroads24

It's the only way for teams without an elite QB to win games. Which constitutes over 50% of the teams in the league.

It's the only way for teams without an elite QB to win games. Which constitutes over 50% of the teams in the league.
- Michael Pachla

Alright. I’m not sure I or anyone really disagreed with that.

I’d argue that you can still win with an elite passing offense that isn’t solely placed on the back of an elite QB

I have 0 doubt Tennessee could win one and they can throw for 300 or rush for 200 on any given game.

The Eagles that won the SB were not a ground and pound and play field position and great defense team. They led the league in TD passes and had their backup go off through the air because they were really well coached

Alright. I’m not sure I or anyone really disagreed with that.

I’d argue that you can still win with an elite passing offense that isn’t solely placed on the back of an elite QB

I have 0 doubt Tennessee could win one and they can throw for 300 or rush for 200 on any given game.

The Eagles that won the SB were not a ground and pound and play field position and great defense team. They led the league in TD passes and had their backup go off through the air because they were really well coached
- sbroads24

Good. Now try to convince beady that it's not about the absolute extremes of pass vs. running/defense so he and Pegulaville can take a breather.

I'm happy we have Josh Allen and don't need to rely solely on running and defense

Bills aren't exactly the best example.
- Michael Pachla

The Bills are a perfect example. Last year they had the second best defense behind only an historic one. This year, they're dogpoop, and if we relied on them we'd be 3-8 instead of 8-3.

The Chiefs had the worst defence in football when they lost to the Pats in the 2018 AFC Championship.

They came back the next year with a defence that allowed 13 PPG across the 2nd half of the season last year and was a big part of their Super Bowl win.

If it was only as simple as having an Elite QB I think Rodgers and Brees would have more then one ring.

Phillip Rivers definitely seems deserving of one as well no ? How many years did the Chargers have an elite overall offence and went nowhere ?
- Pegullaville

Exactly. No one said you automatically win a SB. Going to the AFC Championship is an amazing accomplishment. 31 teams are disappointed at the end of the year. Even as dominant as the Pats had been for 19 years they "only" won 6.

Like I've said about 362 times, it's about odds and the long game. A great QB gives you way better odds for longer. Full stop.

The Bills are a perfect example. Last year they had the second best defense behind only an historic one. This year, they're dogpoop, and if we relied on them we'd be 3-8 instead of 8-3.
- Wetbandit1

Yet even with Josh Allen being elite, it will the running game and defence (just like today) that will determine how far the Bills go in the playoffs.

Ditto Russell Wilson and Aaron Rodgers.

There’s one Super Bowl anytime recently where I can say there wasn’t a great or elite QB playing. Baltimore and San Fran.

Kurt Warner went to 3
Brady has been in 8
Roethlisberger 2
Rodgers 2
Peyton 4
Eli 2
Brees 2
Cam Newton went when he was MVP
Russell Wilson - 2

Great QB’s go to Super Bowls

Phillip Rivers is the exception
- sbroads24

Even then you had a guy that was nigh unstoppable. Albeit for a very short period of time. And Flacco went because of an incredibly clutch play against the Broncos.

And our OL is terrible and half of them were out with injuries and we have 1 starting CB on defense? Funny how those things only apply to the Chargers but not to us. You're clearly bias against the Bills.
- 3rd GM's the charm

Josh Allen didn’t play the bills defense

Even then you had a guy that was nigh unstoppable. Albeit for a very short period of time. And Flacco went because of an incredibly clutch play against the Broncos.
- Wetbandit1

Yeah. You need to have at least an above average offense to even be close to SB caliber unless your defense is generational

The Eagles/49’ers/Rams SB teams were offenses that beat you both running and passing and we’re well coached. Not necessarily elite QB’s.

It’s not either have an elite QB or have an elite D. There’s multiple ways

There’s one Super Bowl anytime recently where I can say there wasn’t a great or elite QB playing. Baltimore and San Fran.

Kurt Warner went to 3
Brady has been in 8
Roethlisberger 2
Rodgers 2
Peyton 4
Eli 2
Brees 2
Cam Newton went when he was MVP
Russell Wilson - 2

Great QB’s go to Super Bowls

Phillip Rivers is the exception
- sbroads24

Those guys have each only played in 1 Super Bowl just sayin'

Good. Now try to convince beady that it's not about the absolute extremes of pass vs. running/defense so he and Pegulaville can take a breather.

I'm happy we have Josh Allen and don't need to rely solely on running and defense
- Michael Pachla

Whoa guy, I'm not on here every (frank)ing day puffing my chest saying I'm right about elite QB's every time one of them wins a football game throwing for 400 yards. The whole thing started today because Flaccoville comes on here every single time a team wins with their running game with his cock in his hand saying "see I'm right" and then makes stuff up about the Chiefs winning last year because they "ran it all over the 49ers" when it's simply not true.

He literally, L I T E R A L L Y, comes on every time a team wins on a strong running performance and acts like elite RBs get you to the Super Bowl... Here's a fact: THEY DON'T.

There have been over 50 Super Bowls. I already did this a while back, but there's something like 5 or 6 of them that didn't have a HoF or elite QB in them, you LITERALLY need an elite QB to get to the Super Bowl pretty much since the NFL/AFL merger. Dude comes on here acting like Barry Sanders won multiple Super Bowls - He hardly played in the playoffs, let alone never even sniffing a Super Bowl.

Even back in the 60's, 70's and 80's, you didn't win with a run game, you won by having a dominant defense that could shut down the opposing QB and with a run game that complimented that defense. No one talks about the 1985 Bears and how they ran the ground and pound to the Super Bowl and won with a scrub QB. No one talks about how OJ Simpson rushed for 2,000 yards in a 14-game season and single-handedly won the Super Bowl (we won like 5 games that year).

It's actually insane, the dude comes on here boasting every time Derrick Henry rushes for 150 yards and the Titans win, saying "I'm right again, the run game is how you win in the NFL" and repeatedly gets proven wrong when he pulls examples of Super Bowl wins by elite QB's and claims it was the running attack that got them their ring.

I can think of maybe 1 team in the Super Bowl era that had a dynasty built around a RB and that's Dallas with Emmit Smith and even then, Aikman was no slouch, they had Michael Irving, Deon Sanders, the best offensive line in football and an elite defense. They were one of the most well-rounded teams of all-time and if the Bills didn't celebrate the win before they even played the game just ONE of those seasons, we might have something to look back on as fans but those jamokes couldn't get out of their own way 4 god damn years in a row.

Holy crap man, imagine if I was on here after every Dolphins win gloating about how I said "watch out for Miami" a couple of times and not just one post, but multiple posts "Oh man I was so right" and "Didn't I tell you guys to watch out for Miami?" over and over again?

And then his team gets all of their scrub QB's suspended and he whines and cries about it and runs and hides when we ask him why they didn't just ground and pound to a victory today?

Try to convince me? Sorry, but I took exception to that statement. Anyone who claims Super Bowls are won by a fresh running attack is a complete moron. They never have been and they never will be. History shows that having one of the best QB's in the game is pretty much the only way to get there in the first place.

John Elway didn't lose 3 Super Bowls before "finally having a running back" because his teams couldn't run, he lost because he played the Giants, Washington and San Francisco - 3 of the most dominant teams of the era and in the ONE game where a running back rushed for over 100 yards (204 to be exact), against Washington, Doug Williams played out of his mind for the era, throwing for 340 yards and 4 TD's, becoming the first African-American QB to win a Super Bowl. They didn't win because of their run game, they won because their defenses DOMINATED and their offenses went buck-wild, the same formula that San Fran and New York won with - Elite defensive play and HoF quarterbacks that played flawlessly.

FFS, they only won by a single touchdown when they beat Green Bay and Terrell Davis ran for 150 yards, sure, but the next year, Elway threw for almost 350 and Davis didn't even break 100 in a rout of Atlanta... Which game is the outlier there? Barely winning when your back carries 30 times or throwing it all over the opposing team and routing them?

I can go all night but don't try to call me out like I'm the one on here doing this every single day. Most Super Bowls are won by elite QB's. Some Super Bowls are won with a strong defense and good running game. Over half of all Super Bowls had a QB as the MVP. Most of the other half is dominated by WR's and defensive players. A few running backs have won Super Bowl MVP.

I'd say Flaccoville is a moron after looking up the facts but what do I know, I've been perma-banned 3 times for going full beady.

Josh Allen didn’t play the bills defense
- Sabretooth9

I think the Browns stink
- sbroads24

Browns 8-3 = “stink”
Gabe Davis with 19catches = “very good”

Put down the pipe dude

The reason I got the Flacco nickname in the first place had everything to do with my belief that you can win the big prize with average QB play as long as you have a formidable run game and defence.

I never once said you can win with a practice Squad WR turned QB as long as you run the ball or with bottom 10 QB play.

The Cleveland Browns and the LA Rams are teams that have average QB play, run the ball well, and play pretty good defence. Could probably include the Saints and Steelers as well as Brees and Big Ben are good but I’m not sure if they are top 10 QB’s at the moment.

It’s funny how you’re calling me out for how much I talk about this yet can’t even comprehend the original message and twist my words.

Tom Brady had average statistical seasons in 3 of his 6 Super Bowl victories.

Peyton Manning had a 11-13 playoff record as an “Elite” QB before 2015 where he was terrible yet carried to a second super bowl win.

Joe Flacco has as many rings as Drew Brees and Aaron Rodgers.

Elite QB play gets you to the playoffs and that’s essentially it unless you can run the ball and have a top quartile defence. Which is exactly the reason why the Chiefs lost in the AFC Championship game to the Pats in 2019 despite having the best QB in the world.
- Pegullaville

Dude,
U waste a lot of time on this point

You’re not wrong necessarily,
but you don’t have to have a strong running game & defense to win

It obviously helps... but it’s not the only way


And good luck with getting trolled....
Dude is psychotic

Good. Now try to convince beady that it's not about the absolute extremes of pass vs. running/defense so he and Pegulaville can take a breather.

I'm happy we have Josh Allen and don't need to rely solely on running and defense
- Michael Pachla

Good luck!

Goff 282 yards passing a game this year
- homiedclown

That really doesn’t mean much
Bottles had a 4,000yard season
Something Kelly never did

Just bc you throw a lot,
doesn’t mean you’re necessarily good

IMO Goff is alright
Probably in the middle of the pack IMO....
so IMO “average” is an appropriate way to describe him

All IMO of course
Hopefully my opinion doesn’t trigger u like it does with others

bills won.

Aikman was no slouch

the same formula that San Fran and New York won with - Elite defensive play and HoF quarterbacks that played flawlessly.

- 3rd GM's the charm

Aikman is in the HOF because he won Super Bowls. His regular season numbers are ugly and honestly he has no business being in the HOF.

165 GP
165 GS
94-71 W-L
61.5% comp %
32,942 (199.6 ypg)
165-141 td-int
81.6 qb rating

Phil Simms beat the Bronco’s, won the SB MVP and he isn’t in the HOF. Although his regular season numbers are very similar to Aikman’s.

164 GP
159 GS
95-64 W-L
55.4% comp%
33462 yds (204 ypg)
199-157 td-int
78.5 qb rating

Both more of game managers IMO.

Aikman is in the HOF because he won Super Bowls. His regular season numbers are ugly and honestly he has no business being in the HOF.
61.5% comp
2745 yds (199.6 ypg)
13.75-11.75 td-int
81.6 qb rating

Phil Simms beat the Bronco’s, won the SB MVP and he isn’t in the HOF. Although his regular season numbers are very similar to Aikman’s.
- dadeadhead

Joe Flacco has the record for most Road playoff wins for a QB in NFL history with 8.

He has as many SB rings as Brees and Rodgers.

He is 10th all time in QB playoff wins with 10.

His 10-5 record in the playoffs (.667%) is top 10 for winning percentages in the playoffs.

Says all you need to say about the “Elite” argument.

I’ll take the elite defence over the elite QB 9 times out of 10 with the one time being Mahomes putting together a God-Like performance with 8 minutes left to win.

All of these elite QB’s will make the playoffs but will need their defences in order to get anywhere near the SB.

Is it better to have an Elite QB ? Absolutely.

However without a top 10 defence the odds are you aren’t winning anything regardless even if you have an elite QB.

Unless all you care about is making the playoffs or losing in the SB then yes, all you need is an Elite QB.

Can’t imagine being a Saints fan has been too enjoyable though the past 5 years despite having one of the best QB’s to play.

one thing on the Defense and super bowl caliber teams


there is a big correlation with that team's offense

the chiefs put up a lot of points early more often then not
so the other team is coming from behind early and throwing their game plan out the window and running a 2 minute offense


we are seeing that a lot lately with the bills, see yesterday, rams game, seattle game, etc

Browns 8-3 = “stink”
Gabe Davis with 19catches = “very good”

Put down the pipe dude
- jdfitz77

Awe, noticed you weren’t around all day when Davis made 2 excellent catches and a TD. 3 for 79 yards and a TD. Very, very good for the rookie

Is anyone really arguing that an elite QB is ALL that is needed?

In today's NFL, what would you rather have for your team:

A) Top 5 Defense, Top 5 Passing Attack & Average (No. 16), Running Attack
Or
B) Top 5 Defense, Average (No. 16) Passing Attack, Top 5 Running Attack

Joe Flacco has the record for most Road playoff wins for a QB in NFL history with 8.

He has as many SB rings as Brees and Rodgers.

He is 10th all time in QB playoff wins with 10.

His 10-5 record in the playoffs (.667%) is top 10 for winning percentages in the playoffs.

Says all you need to say about the “Elite” argument.

I’ll take the elite defence over the elite QB 9 times out of 10 with the one time being Mahomes putting together a God-Like performance with 8 minutes left to win.

All of these elite QB’s will make the playoffs but will need their defences in order to get anywhere near the SB.

Is it better to have an Elite QB ? Absolutely.

However without a top 10 defence the odds are you aren’t winning anything regardless even if you have an elite QB.

Unless all you care about is making the playoffs or losing in the SB then yes, all you need is an Elite QB.

Can’t imagine being a Saints fan has been too enjoyable though the past 5 years despite having one of the best QB’s to play.
- Pegullaville

The way you talk is like there are 8 Super Bowls a season

Two QB’s dominated an entire conference for over a decade. They made 12 (frank)ing SB’s.

You also act like it’s cool for Flacco to only make 1 SB because he’s got a great postseason record, but it’s a criticism for the other QB’s to only make one SB.

This argument is seriously so stupid

You need a good team to win the SB

The most important part of a good team is the QB

You probably won’t win one relying on the QB for 100% of your success

You also probably won’t win one relying solely on “running and playing defense”