Not a very good reply.

You do know that Wuhan is the most populated city in central China. Wuhan is considered the political, economic, financial, commercial, cultural, and educational center of Central China. It is a major transportation hub, with dozens of railways, roads and expressways passing through the city and connecting to other major cities. It's not controlled by some local city council. It's controlled by the Chinese communist government just like everything is. Nothing gets out unless they want it to.

Do you know that the wet markets in Wuhan are now open with business as usual? Only now they have security which will not allow any media or pictures taken.
- MJL

Just out of curiosity, have you ever lived in any part of the 3rd world for any length of time? The answer is obvious - you have absolutely no clue how they work. Otherwise we won't even be having this discussion.

It is not possible in Asia (or anywhere in the 3rd world), outside of small places like Hong Kong and Singapore, or developed countries like Japan, Taiwan or to a lessor extent, South Korea, to implement the kind of micro-control you are describing.

Huabei is a huge province ina huge country. It is also a 3rd world country in and of itself. Provinces get enormous autonomy. Beijing is about as remote, conceptually and in reality, as Manhattanis to a small town shopkeeper in rural Montana. Local bosses control everything, bribery is rampant.

The bosses who botched things were sacked.

https://www.scmp.com/news...th-officials-removed-over

It could well be a face-saving exercise, or maybe not. But it makes zero sense for the Chinese government response to be part of some evil plan - they have paid a heavy price and will pay a bigger one. They screwed up, big time.

This is just another big strawman argument. None of what you state here refutes what he is suggesting or has anything to do with the culpability of the Chinese communist government in this global pnademic.

For the second paragraph, China does all that for their own benefit. You act like China is being so gracious to the world and is some benevolent caring nation. They're not. They want to conquer the US and take over the world. That is their goal.

Its you who doesn't understand Chinese politics and trust me, that is being polite.
- MJL

Thanks for setting me straight. I will remain forever indebted to you, Mr. banker.

Now, please explain to me the trajectory of the Higgs boson. Is it parabolic or does it have an elliptical bobble?

Just out of curiosity, have you ever lived in any part of the 3rd world for any length of time? The answer is obvious - you have absolutely no clue how they work. Otherwise we won't even be having this discussion.


- PT21

Really just an absurd and ridiculous statement by you. As if you have to have actually lived there to educate yourself and be informed on how they operate. Honestly, not to be impolite but why do you embarrass yourself like this?

The three world model is an outdated model from the cold war. By the way, China was considered a 2nd world country by some. It was an ever evolving and changing meaning. Have you ever lived there?

It is not possible in Asia (or anywhere in the 3rd world), outside of small places like Hong Kong and Singapore, or developed countries like Japan, Taiwan or to a lessor extent, South Korea, to implement the kind of micro-control you are describing.


- PT21

You're wrong. It's all very well documented how they hid this from the world for a significant period of time.

Huabei is a huge province ina huge country. It is also a 3rd world country in and of itself. Provinces get enormous autonomy. Beijing is about as remote, conceptually and in reality, as Manhattanis to a small town shopkeeper in rural Montana. Local bosses control everything, bribery is rampant.


- PT21

There is no such thing as autonomy in a communist government.

The bosses who botched things were sacked.

https://www.scmp.com/news...th-officials-removed-over

It could well be a face-saving exercise, or maybe not. But it makes zero sense for the Chinese government response to be part of some evil plan - they have paid a heavy price and will pay a bigger one. They screwed up, big time.
- PT21

It's well documented that people were arrested and disappeared that were trying to warn the outside world of the situation. That they denied access to their top scientists. That they hid the fact that it could be spread with human to human contact for well over 6 weeks.

Thanks for setting me straight. I will remain forever indebted to you, Mr. banker.

Now, please explain to me the trajectory of the Higgs boson. Is it parabolic or does it have an elliptical bobble?
- PT21

I'm not a banker.

Another strawman. What does that have to do with the coronavirus? You're so busy trying to make yourself look smart that don't realize how foolish you're making yourself look.

Again, when someone sets you straight, you move off on some unrelated tangent.

Do you watch the Big Bang Theory?

I completely agree with you that a crashed economy is far more dangerous and will cost more lives than the corona virus will. That being said, I think your standard of reasonably safe is off base. Wearing masks and even using hand sanitizer is not enough at that level. Read what all the experts are saying. By far the best mitigation factor is social isolation and staying home. That public behavior is the only thing that is going to change the course of the pandemic. That is why the social distancing guidelines have been extended to April 30th. It will need to be more than reasonably safe for events like hockey games with fans to continue. An increase in infections due to events like that could kill millions.
- MJL

Where exactly did I give a definition of "reasonably safe" in my prior comments? I did not. My inference was that as soon as medical and government authorities said that it was OK to move forward with adequate precautions that it would be a good idea to have hockey games with the fans wearing masks. That's not that hard to envision. It's merely the next phase step in a wind down out of this nightmare to a normal life again. We're not all going to sit in our houses until one day the government sounds the "all clear alarm" that the Chinese virus is all gone and we're free to go about our business. This will be a transitional period that will require some uncommon measures to reduce risk. Wearing masks in social situations is one of those unusual measures,

It will be a social norm to wear masks out for a while once social distancing is eased.

It already happens in Asia....it’s gonna be weird here for a bit.

Where exactly did I give a definition of "reasonably safe" in my prior comments? I did not. My inference was that as soon as medical and government authorities said that it was OK to move forward with adequate precautions that it would be a good idea to have hockey games with the fans wearing masks. That's not that hard to envision. It's merely the next phase step in a wind down out of this nightmare to a normal life again. We're not all going to sit in our houses until one day the government sounds the "all clear alarm" that the Chinese virus is all gone and we're free to go about our business. This will be a transitional period that will require some uncommon measures to reduce risk. Wearing masks in social situations is one of those unusual measures,
- Letterkenney

I'm just getting a read off of what you've been posting. It's very hard to envision. For the liability reasons I posted earlier and for the reasons Bendecko posted. The league will have to feel that people can attend games without wearing protective devices for that to happen in my opinion.

100% agree.

Anyway, the masks really don't protect the wearer so much as protect people in proximity to the wearer getting exposed to wearer's droplets. People's mouths are spray machines. Everybody spits tiny droplets of saliva when the speak, even if it can't be seen. This is the case for doctors wearing them. It's not so much to keep them from getting exposed (face shields are for that purpose), it's to keep them from spreading their germs onto their patients, especially when conducting a medical procedure such as an operation.

If anything, masks protects the casual wearer the most by keeping them inadvertently touching their mouths and noses.

But that's all dependent on them being worn correctly. I see too many numbnuts wearing them too loosely so that the corners of their mouths are exposed. Or worst yet, I see them only covering their mouths but not their noses.

So like MJL says, what happens when this occurs in large gatherings? Whose going to make sure everyone is wearing them correctly at all times? Let's say this is a hockey game. You'll also have to prohibit all concessions and people bringing their own food and drinks; masks can't be pulled aside for that in this kind of setting. You'll also have to keep people from getting too excited where they scream and shout, as the masks aren't designed for that kind of use. Whose going to enforce all of this? The PA announcer admonishing the crowd isn't going to cut it.

Like MJL also says, social distancing and the ban on large gatherings is the only effective way to keep everyone safest from being exposed and possibly infected.
- Bendecko

Yup, and more and more I’m guessing this season gets scrapped and we don’t see another game that counts until October. Welp, at least we didn’t move any top picks or prospects at the trade deadline, lol.

Just out of curiosity, have you ever lived in any part of the 3rd world for any length of time? The answer is obvious - you have absolutely no clue how they work. Otherwise we won't even be having this discussion.

It is not possible in Asia (or anywhere in the 3rd world), outside of small places like Hong Kong and Singapore, or developed countries like Japan, Taiwan or to a lessor extent, South Korea, to implement the kind of micro-control you are describing.

Huabei is a huge province ina huge country. It is also a 3rd world country in and of itself. Provinces get enormous autonomy. Beijing is about as remote, conceptually and in reality, as Manhattanis to a small town shopkeeper in rural Montana. Local bosses control everything, bribery is rampant.

The bosses who botched things were sacked.

https://www.scmp.com/news...th-officials-removed-over

It could well be a face-saving exercise, or maybe not. But it makes zero sense for the Chinese government response to be part of some evil plan - they have paid a heavy price and will pay a bigger one. They screwed up, big time.
- PT21

No one but the craziest kooks suggest it's part of an evil plot. But, PT, if you think the ChiCom bosses in this, including Xi, are just innocent bureaucratic victims, you're woefully ignorant about how totalitarian communist POS's work. We've had 100 years of history that teach us about them. There are no redeeming qualities of those animals.

If they were a free democratic society, then locals having control over local issues is absolutely possible. Like here, we have a federal government, but the states control their own destiny (look up federalism). China is way different. They have millions of cameras all over the streets to assess behavior and assign social scores. What kind of that crap do you want to live under or excuse for their crimes against humanity by hiding the truth? I don't get it.

It will be a social norm to wear masks out for a while once social distancing is eased.

It already happens in Asia....it’s gonna be weird here for a bit.
- Wingdestroyer

'
Yes, CDC is already sending out trial balloons today to get people ready for it.

I'm just getting a read off of what you've been posting. It's very hard to envision. For the liability reasons I posted earlier and for the reasons Bendecko posted. The league will have to feel that people can attend games without wearing protective devices for that to happen in my opinion.
- MJL

While that may be true, the fact remains that hockey games will be just one of many things that happen when the economy opens up again. Simply taking extra measures of precaution to safeguard the health and safety of people is NOT an unreasonable thought. Particularly if they are going to be expecting an secondary outbreak when the fall and winter set upon us again. We cannot sit in our homes forever. We MUST get back to regular economic activity and life as soon as possible for everyone.

While that may be true, the fact remains that hockey games will be just one of many things that happen when the economy opens up again. Simply taking extra measures of precaution to safeguard the health and safety of people is NOT an unreasonable thought. Particularly if they are going to be expecting an secondary outbreak when the fall and winter set upon us again. We cannot sit in our homes forever. We MUST get back to regular economic activity and life as soon as possible for everyone.
- Letterkenney

No, it's not an unreasonable thought. I agree that the world has to move on but only when appropriate. Unfortunately, we don't know when that will be yet. That's why it's so important that the social distancing is adhered to for the next 30 days. To allow the economy to get going again. I'm disheartened when traveling around in my job activities and seeing far too many people out and about around Philly.

No, it's not an unreasonable thought. I agree that the world has to move on but only when appropriate. Unfortunately, we don't know when that will be yet. That's why it's so important that the social distancing is adhered to for the next 30 days. To allow the economy to get going again. I'm disheartened when traveling around in my job activities and seeing far too many people out and about around Philly.
- MJL

Yeah I’ve been down in SC for like 4 weeks (watched the Boston game here). It’s way chiller down here but all my friends and family say that people aren’t “getting the message”

Yeah I’ve been down in SC for like 4 weeks (watched the Boston game here). It’s way chiller down here but all my friends and family say that people aren’t “getting the message”
- Wingdestroyer

They're not getting the message right now, but they will. Here's the data on PA:

https://www.health.pa.gov...onavirus/Pages/Cases.aspx

No, it's not an unreasonable thought. I agree that the world has to move on but only when appropriate. Unfortunately, we don't know when that will be yet. That's why it's so important that the social distancing is adhered to for the next 30 days. To allow the economy to get going again. I'm disheartened when traveling around in my job activities and seeing far too many people out and about around Philly.
- MJL

All of those people "out and about" in Philly should be wearing masks. Is it a cure all? Maybe not, but it's a HELL of a lot better by scientific evidence than not wearing makes at all, Again, why do healthcare workers ALL wear masks? They do it because it radically reduces chances of transmission to others or to one's self. And doing so at public gatherings once things open up is 100% a viable option to get the economy and certainly less importantly, the hockey season, going.

All of those people "out and about" in Philly should be wearing masks. Is it a cure all? Maybe not, but it's a HELL of a lot better by scientific evidence than not wearing makes at all, Again, why do healthcare workers ALL wear masks? They do it because it radically reduces chances of transmission to others or to one's self. And doing so at public gatherings once things open up is 100% a viable option to get the economy and certainly less importantly, the hockey season.
- Letterkenney

That's the problem. Some think if they wear a mask they can go out and about. You're way too hung up on wearing a mask. That is down the list. Social distancing and isolation is what is going to save us. Masks won't.

They're not getting the message right now, but they will. Here's the data on PA:

https://www.health.pa.gov...onavirus/Pages/Cases.aspx
- Letterkenney

Here is something I found interesting. Look at the results from today in Philly? Is that because it is trending down or they just didn't test many people.


https://www.phila.gov/pro...e/monitoring-and-testing/

Here is something I found interesting. Look at the results from today in Philly? Is that because it is trending down or they just didn't test many people.


https://www.phila.gov/pro...e/monitoring-and-testing/
- MJL

Check tomorrow, maybe it’s just unreported data and it will be added with the next day?

That's the problem. Some think if they wear a mask they can go out and about. You're way too hung up on wearing a mask. That is down the list. Social distancing and isolation is what is going to save us. Masks won't.
- MJL

You’re not wrong, but he’s not either.

I think he’s more talking about when it’s “time” to go outside? There is gonna be a period in between “shelter in place” and “Roots Picnic”

That's the problem. Some think if they wear a mask they can go out and about. You're way too hung up on wearing a mask. That is down the list. Social distancing and isolation is what is going to save us. Masks won't.
- MJL

Masks are what enable social gatherings to let the economy get going again. We cannot all stay in complete isolation until the siren sounds all clear. That's a foolish fantasy. At some point, the cost of isolation outweighs the cost of the risk of contracting the virus. THAT is when the NHL season can commence, and in order to mitigate the possibility of continued spread, masks are 95% - 100% effective in that effort to mitigate spread. Why this is an argument is puzzling. We don't ban driving because 50,000 Americans die in car crashes every year. We don't ban air travel because planes crash and kill hundreds of people at a time. What I am saying is the risk of death from any number of causes will never be zero. The point at which it's reduced is the time to open up the season and institute mask wearing as an additional means of reducing transfer. To say that wearing masks does not stop transfer flies in the face of scientific fact and the evidence of what is going on in other countries. Mark my words, the CDC will come out soon recommending masks as a significant measure to take to reduce the spread.

You’re not wrong, but he’s not either.

I think he’s more talking about when it’s “time” to go outside? There is gonna be a period in between “shelter in place” and “Roots Picnic”
- Wingdestroyer

THIS!

Check tomorrow, maybe it’s just unreported data and it will be added with the next day?
- Wingdestroyer

They update every day at noon, or thereabouts.

Here is something I found interesting. Look at the results from today in Philly? Is that because it is trending down or they just didn't test many people.


https://www.phila.gov/pro...e/monitoring-and-testing/
- MJL

That's potentially good news. I actually suspect that we're going to start seeing similar trends replicating across the country. It could not not happen as isolated as we all have been. The question is whether or not we can continue this way for another week or 2 to completely turn that into a nothing. At that point is when social gatherings with masks comes into play. Including Flyer games with Flyer logos on the masks for promo and health combined.

That's potentially good news. I actually suspect that we're going to start seeing similar trends replicating across the country. It could not not happen as isolated as we all have been. The question is whether or not we can continue this way for another week or 2 to completely turn that into a nothing. At that point is when social gatherings with masks comes into play. Including Flyer games with Flyer logos on the masks for promo and health combined.
- Letterkenney

Flyers games with masks is never going to happen.

... with all the companies joining in to make masks now, that shortage will decline quickly and the recommendation for everyone to wear them will start coming. You'll see. Probably will not be made into law in most places, but the recommendations will be there for the public just as social distancing is the recommendation.


- Letterkenney

Masks and continued social distancing are the keys to opening back up many parts of the economy. This is desperately needed.