NHL reffing is mired in an uglier than usual stretch. The leafs are far from the only team to see it.

It is what it is last night. Despite what those morons max and UG have to say people are allowed to not be happy with the reffing, if even seen some non troll buffalo fans state it was a poop show. It wasn't good.

But when the team doesn't show up for 45 minutes of the game, doesn't defend, and the goalie disappears after two periods... It's a moot point.

Yes the reffing was poop, you actually have to play a complete game for it to matter...
- joel878

true

Goals 4 and 5 don’t happen if the refs don’t call another BS penalty on the Leafs when they had the momentum. No penalty no 3rd goal.
- Steven_Seagull

Santo I was responding to this post which literally blamed the refs for the loss. So.....no one is blaming the refs?

Lol ok it too early. Reread it.

But that still make no sense. If they are able to develop players that gives them more ammunition to make trades for needs. Saying they can develop players now, when they previously couldn’t , and thus shouldn’t trade futures is ass backwards.
- burn

You don't trade multiple assets at a trade deadline sellers market where the buy is very high in a year where you have no shot anyway, was the point.

They've already dished out picks since the summer, time to calm down and realize this year is not a year in which adding another d man is going to put them over the top. We can see they aren't there, it's obvious. So do the right thing.

2nd and 3rd were directly attributed to garbage reffing.

Leafs too concerned with poopty call that put them down 3-2,
- burn

And then there was also this post which blamed the refs....

All fans complain about the refs. It's always easier to blame the refs, goalie or lack of puck luck than it is to give credit to your opponent beating you. That being said, teams get screwed all the time. It's not whining. It's true.

Leaf fans outnumber other teams fanbases so they're the loudest. Same with Habs fans. I've listened since 1982 Red Wings fans whining, making excuses for losses and outright lying about what happened in playoff games. So it isn't just Leaf fans complaining. It's everyone. Admitting the truth can be hard. It's much easier to point the finger than it is to look in the mirror.
- gergeswillems

Explain why the Leafs have been last in PP opportunities the past 3 years.

Refs are scared to call penalties on 5v4s, refs are scared to call multiple penalties on the same play.

The fact the Bruins get away with more and the Leafs don't get calls at all every year shows me something is wrong.

There is an obvious bias towards the Bruins because the way they play and it very well could be bias towards other teams as well for the same reasons. This causes inconsistency between teams and it causes a bunch of problems.

Santo I was responding to this post which literally blamed the refs for the loss. So.....no one is blaming the refs?
- fifty__missions

Whats the thought on Muzzin? I think some here call him Muffin?

Reports are a 4 year contract being worked out.

You do realize every teams fanbase claims that the NHL and the Refs are against them, right?

Last night wasn't anything egregious in terms of lopsidedness with penalties called.

The refs should frustrate you less than the team not showing up for most of that game.

The Leafs should have beat the pants off the Sabres, and it showed in those ten minutes the Leafs decided to play and tied the game.

The Leafs even show up for 20-25 minutes and they win that game, easily.
- ImThatGuy

Yes, and not every team has been at, or near, the bottom of the PP opportunities for a number of years now.

Explain why the Leafs have been last in PP opportunities the past 3 years.

Refs are scared to call penalties on 5v4s, refs are scared to call multiple penalties on the same play.

The fact the Bruins get away with more and the Leafs don't get calls at all every year shows me something is wrong.

There is an obvious bias towards the Bruins because the way they play and it very well could be bias towards other teams as well for the same reasons. This causes inconsistency between teams and it causes a bunch of problems.
- Santo_44

I can't explain it. You'd think a team like the Leafs who are skilled enough to have the puck alot of the time would draw more penalty calls.

Yes, and not every team has been at, or near, the bottom of the PP opportunities for a number of years now.
- Aetherial

Soft teams don't draw a lot of penalties.

-Adam French

Santo I was responding to this post which literally blamed the refs for the loss. So.....no one is blaming the refs?
- fifty__missions

andersen kept it 2-1 for a long time, and they DID tie it up. FYI.
-Burn

Then he says Andersen kept them in the game before that...

It doesn't seem like he is blaming the refs entirely he is just pointing out that the goals don't happen if the ref doesn't blow that call which is true....they scored 3 goals in 2 mins, one being on that PP.

Do the Leafs still lose that game if that penalty isn't called? Honestly probably but it was 2-2 and they had a burst of energy the game probably goes down to the wire.

I don't see anyone completely blaming the refs for the loss.

Yes, and not every team has been at, or near, the bottom of the PP opportunities for a number of years now.
- Aetherial

It's weird, you have the least penalties for an against this year.

Anomoly, i guess. Though it is odd.

Muzzin is not very good in this Leafs system - he cannot keep up with the Leafs' tempo and style of play.
If you want to go out and play such a game, he (and Holl) should not be in your top6 of d-men. (Holl could be a good #7 D).
So don't renew Muzzin - unless you're willing to adapt the playing style somewhat ..
- plantheparade

oh

I can't explain it. You'd think a team like the Leafs who are skilled enough to have the puck alot of the time would draw more penalty calls.
- gergeswillems

Part of the problem is they are easy to check along the boards. They don't force penalties in those situations. Their cycle game doesn't really exist. They hold on to the puck by ringing it around and moving it aloneg longer routes rather than a tight cycle game that draws penalties.

andersen kept it 2-1 for a long time, and they DID tie it up. FYI.
-Burn

Then he says Andersen kept them in the game before that...

It doesn't seem like he is blaming the refs entirely he is just pointing out that the goals don't happen if the ref doesn't blow that call which is true....they scored 3 goals in 2 mins, one being on that PP.

Do the Leafs still lose that game if that penalty isn't called? Honestly probably but it was 2-2 and they had a burst of energy the game probably goes down to the wire.

I don't see anyone completely blaming the refs for the loss.
- Santo_44

Ok, man. Have a nice day.

I can't explain it. You'd think a team like the Leafs who are skilled enough to have the puck alot of the time would draw more penalty calls.
- gergeswillems

Exactly.

There is frustration on missed calls and the stats show that they don't call many calls for the Leafs.

It is something worth reading into....The Flames complained about this years ago then they turned into one of the teams with the most PPs the next season. There are defenitivley biases towards teams depending on how they play.

The Bruins are a perfect example of it.

Ok, man. Have a nice day.
- fifty__missions

you as well

Soft teams don't draw a lot of penalties.

-Adam French
- Symba.007

It has become too convenient for people to have this narrative which doesn't actually explain anything. That narrative doesn't make it true. The Leafs get hooked, held, tripped and obstructed as much as any team. That has nothing to do with softness.

The first clue that there is a problem is that the situation has been going on for long enough that people are looking for explanations.

Exactly.

There is frustration on missed calls and the stats show that they don't call many calls for the Leafs.

It is something worth reading into....The Flames complained about this years ago then they turned into one of the teams with the most PPs the next season. There are defenitivley biases towards teams depending on how they play.

The Bruins are a perfect example of it.
- Santo_44

The fact that people have to look for explanations, suggests there is something not quite right about what has gone on.

If this was the past month, you could just brush it off, but this is an annual thing now.

It has become too convenient for people to have this narrative which doesn't actually explain anything. That narrative doesn't make it true. The Leafs get hooked, held, tripped and obstructed as much as any team. That has nothing to do with softness.

The first clue that there is a problem is that the situation has been going on for long enough that people are looking for explanations.
- Aetherial

everybody hates the Leafs?

Lol. Go and do some backreading. There was a dude I was responding to who literally blamed the loss on the officiating.
- fifty__missions

No one totally blames the loss on the refs. The Leafs played like poop, so they deserved every thing they got. But ya gotta admit when ya watch three or four missed calls against when the Leafs were just catching a little momentum and then bam, phantom call out of no where. It kinda makes ya
a bit. Unless ya don't care, then ya I get it...

everybody hates the Leafs?
- Symba.007

If I had to guess, I would suggest that this has become a sub-conscious bias.

I don't believe the refs or the league are out to get the Leafs. I liken this to the Kadri situation.

He had a couple years where he drew a lot of penalties, as soon as it became noticeable, the refs stopped calling infractions against him. It actually became pretty (frank)ing ridiculous.

This has become similar. Apparently the Leafs are not fighting through enough checks or going to enough ditry areas to draw penalties. Again, it isn't true, and it doesn't pass the eye test. The problem is that it is out there now, and perception becomes reality...

All fans complain about the refs. It's always easier to blame the refs, goalie or lack of puck luck than it is to give credit to your opponent beating you. That being said, teams get screwed all the time. It's not whining. It's true.

Leaf fans outnumber other teams fanbases so they're the loudest. Same with Habs fans. I've listened since 1982 Red Wings fans whining, making excuses for losses and outright lying about what happened in playoff games. So it isn't just Leaf fans complaining. It's everyone. Admitting the truth can be hard. It's much easier to point the finger than it is to look in the mirror.
- gergeswillems

Did you watch the Bruins v Leafs playoff series last season? The 2nd most penalized team in the league vs the least penalized team in the league. The Leafs also had the 2nd least PPOA that season.

Guess who, inexplicably, had more power play opportunities that series?

That is a microcosm of the reffing bias the Leafs routinely face.

andersen kept it 2-1 for a long time, and they DID tie it up. FYI.
-Burn

Then he says Andersen kept them in the game before that...

It doesn't seem like he is blaming the refs entirely he is just pointing out that the goals don't happen if the ref doesn't blow that call which is true....they scored 3 goals in 2 mins, one being on that PP.

Do the Leafs still lose that game if that penalty isn't called? Honestly probably but it was 2-2 and they had a burst of energy the game probably goes down to the wire.

I don't see anyone completely blaming the refs for the loss.
- Santo_44

"2nd and 3rd were directly attributed to garbage reffing.

Leafs too concerned with poopty call that put them down 3-2,"

-Burn

Btw Santo, can you please explain to me how the above post does not 'directly' blame the refs for the loss?

everybody hates the Leafs?
- Symba.007

Oh and the phantom (frank)ing calls are ridiculous at this point.

You can almost predict at this point exactly when the other team will get a PP.

And then there was also this post which blamed the refs....
- fifty__missions

You disputing facts?