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Forums :: Blog World :: Tyler Cameron: The trip that broke the camel's back
Author Message
Elbows15
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: I was going to do the math on this but I don't think it will help., IL
Joined: 08.04.2013

Feb 14 @ 2:26 PM ET
A clear description that the goal isn't just to make the playoffs, but rather to rebuild to a cup contending team again.
- Return of the Roar

WTF do you think One Goal means?
Elbows15
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: I was going to do the math on this but I don't think it will help., IL
Joined: 08.04.2013

Feb 14 @ 2:32 PM ET
This might be one of those crossroads moments when an opportunity presents itself and the response is as illustrative of the decision makers as it is about the decision itself. Stan's handling of the pre-TDL trade season will separate the wheat from the chafe.

The most obvious trade chip is Gustafsson. Regardless of his brain-fart moments in the d-zone - he is a legit second-pairing d-man by the minutes he can play without physically slowing down, by playing QB on the PP, by having good offensive capabilities and instincts in the o-zone and does score goals. If predictability is a good thing - he is predictable with the occasional bone head play and the occasional brilliant play. In between he's not as bad as advertised defensively. The point is he is what he is but he's certainly worth 1/2 his salary when Stan retains 50% of his $1.2M salary cap hit . And, he's UFA so he's the perfect TDL pickup for a team in the hunt who wouldn't mind adding a depth d-man like Gustafsson to the lineup for a paltry pro-rated $600K cap hit. He would at least be a pretty good cheap #7 depth d-man heading into the playoffs. Get it done Stan. I don't even care a whole lot what he gets in return - just get it done.

One more thing - I'll ask the question - is Gustafsson a vital piece of the plan moving forward - an asset that should be re-signed rather than traded? I'll answer the question - NO! If Stan makes the mistake of thinking differently - thinking that Gustafsson is one of the pieces in the master plan - then he better re-sign him and be consistent in his madness because if Gustafsson just strolls into the sunset after the season ends - Stan better be going out with him.

This pre-TDL trading season will tell us as much about Stan the GM and his capability to get the Hawks back into legitimate contending status than anything else that comes to mind. Hopefully Stan's choices and results, at the very least, get's him get a stay of execution. If not - don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya.

- EbonyRaptor


I can't take anything you say seriously after the whole Dave Clark 5 over the Beatles thing.
HawkintheD
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Sick Bay, MI
Joined: 02.22.2012

Feb 14 @ 2:33 PM ET
WTF do you think One Goal means?
- Elbows15


You're only allowed to reference the marketing slogan when mocking the team because they've failed to achieve said goal.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Feb 14 @ 2:34 PM ET
This might be one of those crossroads moments when an opportunity presents itself and the response is as illustrative of the decision makers as it is about the decision itself. Stan's handling of the pre-TDL trade season will separate the wheat from the chafe.

The most obvious trade chip is Gustafsson. Regardless of his brain-fart moments in the d-zone - he is a legit second-pairing d-man by the minutes he can play without physically slowing down, by playing QB on the PP, by having good offensive capabilities and instincts in the o-zone and does score goals. If predictability is a good thing - he is predictable with the occasional bone head play and the occasional brilliant play. In between he's not as bad as advertised defensively. The point is he is what he is but he's certainly worth 1/2 his salary when Stan retains 50% of his $1.2M salary cap hit . And, he's UFA so he's the perfect TDL pickup for a team in the hunt who wouldn't mind adding a depth d-man like Gustafsson to the lineup for a paltry pro-rated $600K cap hit. He would at least be a pretty good cheap #7 depth d-man heading into the playoffs. Get it done Stan. I don't even care a whole lot what he gets in return - just get it done.

One more thing - I'll ask the question - is Gustafsson a vital piece of the plan moving forward - an asset that should be re-signed rather than traded? I'll answer the question - NO! If Stan makes the mistake of thinking differently - thinking that Gustafsson is one of the pieces in the master plan - then he better re-sign him and be consistent in his madness because if Gustafsson just strolls into the sunset after the season ends - Stan better be going out with him.

This pre-TDL trading season will tell us as much about Stan the GM and his capability to get the Hawks back into legitimate contending status than anything else that comes to mind. Hopefully Stan's choices and results, at the very least, get's him get a stay of execution. If not - don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya.

- EbonyRaptor


I enjoyed the post, ER. I think the TDL will also show us whether Rocky and McD will let him do. I told ROR above that I understand why they won't admit to being in a rebuild (as is clear here every day, some fans won't tolerate it well). But a TDL without maximizing assets would be malpractice, imo.
HawkintheD
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Sick Bay, MI
Joined: 02.22.2012

Feb 14 @ 2:35 PM ET
I can't take anything you say seriously after the whole Dave Clark 5 over the Beatles thing.
- Elbows15


I always thought he was one of the most rational posters here til I read that.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Feb 14 @ 2:35 PM ET
I can't take anything you say seriously after the whole Dave Clark 5 over the Beatles thing.
- Elbows15


poop, I forgot about that......
Rota's Rooter
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 06.23.2017

Feb 14 @ 2:40 PM ET
I think after his tenure with Toronto, Hunter is very happy being co-owner of the Knights, and have no one to answer to but himself.
- LAHawk

Along with his brother Dale and Basil Mcrae.

https://londonknights.com/staff-dhunter
Chunk
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Why did I move back here again?, IL
Joined: 11.06.2015

Feb 14 @ 2:44 PM ET
This is where you are wrong. It absolutely matters. It's about integrity.

It is an admission that changes bigger than have been attempted are required, and replaces the need to market around a crap product on the ice by pretending they are better then they are for fear of losing revenue.

I for one, a fan since 1969 who hasn't gone to a game in over four years unless the odd free tickets came my way, would actually see reason to support the team again if they were honest with me, and set believable expectations built around a thoughtful plan for legitimate contention.

- Return of the Roar


In your eyes, I am wrong. I personally think that fans are smarter than that. They can see what this team is and they can extrapolate where the direction is depending on the moves. Whether or not one agrees with that direction is another topic altogether.

How many other teams have ever done what the Rangers did. Is it "nice" that the Rangers were totally open with their fans? Sure. But their moves stated exactly the same thing.

You are obviously well within your rights to not put any money into their coffers, and I do not begrudge you one bit. If I still lived in CHI, I would not buy a ticket to a game either. At the end of the day, Rocky, McD, etc. are responsible for making money. We can all hate them for doing what they do, but at the end of the day, it's their team.
Toew Drags 4 Daze
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Charlotte, NC
Joined: 06.19.2017

Feb 14 @ 2:46 PM ET
Let's not. He has the job. You want him fired, but have no idea how he compares to other GM's. I'd fire him tomorrow if there's a better candidate available. I don't see one, and so far you don't either.
- mohel


Right, and you don't know how he compares either because you don't know whose available. What you do know, is that the last 3 years have been a trainwreck.

The way I see your argument, it's like staying with your girlfriend/wife whose been cheating on you the past few years because you had some great times together and you don't know who else is out there. You don't need to know what's out there to know what she's doing is wrong. Time to move on.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Feb 14 @ 2:50 PM ET
Right, and you don't know how he compares either because you don't know whose available. What you do know, is that the last 3 years have been a trainwreck.

The way I see your argument, it's like staying with your girlfriend/wife whose been cheating on you the past few years because you had some great times together and you don't know who else is out there. You don't need to know what's out there to know what she's doing is wrong. Time to move on.

- Toew Drags 4 Daze


Oh, my.....

There's no need to have a girlfriend. You can pick single. A team needs a GM. The way I see your argument is that you are frustrated and want to can the guy before finding out if you have a better option. That's fine, but you'll be right back in search mode shortly. Like the Kings.....
Toew Drags 4 Daze
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Charlotte, NC
Joined: 06.19.2017

Feb 14 @ 3:01 PM ET
Let's not. He has the job. You want him fired, but have no idea how he compares to other GM's. I'd fire him tomorrow if there's a better candidate available. I don't see one, and so far you don't either.
- mohel


Also, if you disagree with letting Stan go that's perfectly fine. But don't act like there aren't valid reasons to consider it. That's all I'm saying.

Either way I'm over this argument, it's fu**ing exhausting. I'm sure everyone will be thrilled lol.
Hawkytalk
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Frankfort, IL
Joined: 06.26.2012

Feb 14 @ 3:08 PM ET
As expected. How can we take seriously your critique of Stan if you're unable to identify who would do the job better? These things are judged in comparison to others doing the job.
- mohel


Wow.....this wreaks of laughable stupidy
LOL. Get real !!
pdx2ord
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Portland, OR
Joined: 09.02.2015

Feb 14 @ 3:12 PM ET
Something else to talk about for everyone with a greater knowledge of the NHL at large than I have: trade proposals submitted to The Athletic - would you do any of them? Which are realistic proposalsl?

The Blackhawks send Erik Gustafsson and David Kampf to Vegas for forward Cody Eakin, a 2020 first-round pick, and a 2021 second-round pick (acquired from St. Louis). Second-rounder is conditional on Gustafsson signing an extension or Vegas winning the Stanley Cup. — Brandon (@StrateWhiteMail)

The Blackhawks send Erik Gustafsson to the Islanders for forward Josh Ho-Sang. — Andreas (@shuttervibe)

The Blackhawks send Erik Gustafsson and Alex Nylander to Toronto for winger Kasperi Kapanen a second-round pick. — Prime (@rushbaby1980)

The Blackhawks send Erik Gustafsson to Carolina for left wing Warren Foegele, find another defenseman in the offseason and sign Foegele. — @agonisti

The Blackhawks send Dylan Strome to Boston for second- and fourth-round picks. — @sikwitit03

The Blackhawks send Brandon Saad (retaining $500,000) to Edmonton for forward Sam Gagner, defensive prospect Dmitri Samorukov, a 2020 second-rounder and a 2021 second-rounder. The 2020 second-rounder would be upgraded to a first-rounder with some “stingy, performance-based” conditions. — Sam (@Roviet_Sussia)

The Blackhawks send Alex Nylander to Edmonton for Jesse Puljujarvi, and Connor Murphy to Toronto for Kasperi Kapanen — Brandon (@bwalk01)
The Blackhawks send Alex Nylander to Edmonton for Jesse Puljujarvi, and send Gustafsson to a contender for a first- or second-rounder. Try to get someone to overpay — Ben (@bkuchler23)
The Blackhawks send Brandon Saad to Edmonton for Jesse Puljujarvi and a second-rounder — @hockey_guy_81

The Blackhawks send Robin Lehner and Dylan Sikura to Carolina for a 2020 first-round pick (whichever of Carolina’s two is better), Jake Bean or Dominik Bokk, and a 2021 second-round pick (which would become a first if Lehner re-signs in Carolina). — Emily (@_emily_gilbert)
A league source said Thursday he believed Lehner could be available at the deadline if the Blackhawks sell. “Lehner is in play,” the source said. “(The Blackhawks) were taking another run at signing him, but …”. -EEK

The Blackhawks send Duncan Keith to Florida for defenseman Mike Matheson, a 2020 second-rounder and a 2020 third-rounder. — Sam (@Roviet_Sussia)

The Blackhawks send Dylan Strome and Alex Nylander to Anaheim for Josh Manson — @chad_reynolds1
EbonyRaptor
Joined: 03.28.2013

Feb 14 @ 3:14 PM ET
I can't take anything you say seriously after the whole Dave Clark 5 over the Beatles thing.
- Elbows15


Then please allow me a mulligan shot at clarifying my position - I prefer the DC5 over the Beatles in the mid 60's "Mod Era". During the 64-66 period I would put up the DC5 catalog against anyone including the Beatles (but secretly it's not about a song vs song contest - it's really about the counter culture thing).
Return of the Roar
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Solidly grounded in reality, IL
Joined: 07.27.2009

Feb 14 @ 3:14 PM ET
WTF do you think One Goal means?
- Elbows15


It used to mean they had a plan to get there.

Now they don't, as the data show rather clearly. This year may actually be the worst one since 2015.

So today, it's a hollow slogan.
GPHawksfan
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: AB
Joined: 01.26.2018

Feb 14 @ 3:15 PM ET
Ask yourself this question to get the answer:

Are there 2.0 versions of Toews, Kane, Keith, Hossa, Crawford etc in the pipeline today?

Mic drop.

- Return of the Roar

Pick it back up and hit yourself in the nuts repeatedly until you can't reproduce.
HawkintheD
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Sick Bay, MI
Joined: 02.22.2012

Feb 14 @ 3:16 PM ET
Wow.....this wreaks of laughable stupidy
LOL. Get real !!

- Hawkytalk


Pot...meet kettle.
Return of the Roar
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Solidly grounded in reality, IL
Joined: 07.27.2009

Feb 14 @ 3:16 PM ET
Pick it back up and hit yourself in the nuts repeatedly until you can't reproduce.
- GPHawksfan


Just love the facts don't matter crowd.....
tvetter
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Burkesville, KY
Joined: 12.16.2015

Feb 14 @ 3:17 PM ET
Ask yourself this question to get the answer:

Are there 2.0 versions of Toews, Kane, Keith, Hossa, Crawford etc in the pipeline today?

Mic drop.

- Return of the Roar

Catching up here, so may have been addressed already, but...Dach, no, Boqvist, UFA, Gravel.

Mic handed back
EbonyRaptor
Joined: 03.28.2013

Feb 14 @ 3:19 PM ET
I enjoyed the post, ER. I think the TDL will also show us whether Rocky and McD will let him do. I told ROR above that I understand why they won't admit to being in a rebuild (as is clear here every day, some fans won't tolerate it well). But a TDL without maximizing assets would be malpractice, imo.
- mohel


I care a lot less about their words than I do about their actions. Stan can get up in front of microphones and BS to his hearts content - it isn't important. What's important are actions with favorable results.
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Feb 14 @ 3:25 PM ET
When one disagrees with someone's opinion, isn't that saying you think the other person is wrong?

If I say Hossa was waaaay overrated, you'd rightfully tell me I've suffered a head injury or something. Wouldn't that be telling me I'm wrong?

- mohel


It’s a blog. You and others ridiculed John and i liked John but he also had some points that were valid and some others that the narrative was overplayed. If you or Paul read that link, he’s not entirely off in his line of thinking. Nor is he entirely speaking from a non biased point of view.

Nobody here has a direct line to anyone in the organization. or else they’d be spending their time best suited to help the club. The game of telephone or sources or what have you is overplayed. I don’t see anyone challenging Tyler on his sources like they did John? How does anyone here know Tyler’s said sources are 100% factual or not another circus with the intent to embarrass somebody like some did in years past with John? That’s where this board is heavily divided and these posts go no where.

It’s not necessarily saying your right and he’s wrong. It’s a difference of opinion. He believes in his and you believe in yours.

The elitist attitude that comes off at times is exactly what a radio host in Chicago portrays and his ratings decline every year because of it. What makes you or elbows or Paul or me any more more educated then pe or 6628 or whoever else?

That’s what is driving people off this board. If it doesn’t fit a certain narrative people are shamed and the clique cackles along.

Calling a very good goalie lard ass just because or hoping a guy gets injured is the most immature thing on here. Apparently the said Gm you and others defend to the death like both and have liked smith for awhile according to the hawks themselves.

But he, Smith, sucks.

Same old song and dance each and every blog in the comments section. Nothing new.
Savard2Secord
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Round Lake, IL
Joined: 12.12.2016

Feb 14 @ 3:27 PM ET
I'm sorry, but why in the F*** would the Hawks NOT use the cap space they have right now when they're in the playoff mix NOT to use that cap space to improve this team NOW??? especially when the the cap space goes away in the summer?? oh and you can get players at pro-rated deals???

Tank?.... Shoot for a lottery pick?

Give me a break, if Bowman doesn't use this cap space then he should be fired - and I have been the biggest Bowman advocate over the last 10 years - but the man has lost his mind if he doesn't use this cap space....

Out of any bubble team the Blackhawks have the best opportunity to improve the team.... If Bowman can make the right acquisitions The Hawks could contend.... And on the flip-side of the coin I want to see these kids get experience and excel, however the Blackhawks have an opportunity to really stock up with talent and they have the ability to become a real force down the stretch, if they can add a couple of forwards and a couple of defensemen - and they have the space.....

It appears tho that some (not all) Hawks fans want to sell off assets to continue the rebuild another 2-3 years....... NO, NO, NO...... This isn't going to be 1997 all over again.

Look, my point it that the Hawks are in a fantastic position to really put themselves in a position to make a "power move", change the team, add assets and finish the season strong.



squishy24
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 11.08.2019

Feb 14 @ 3:27 PM ET
Also, if you disagree with letting Stan go that's perfectly fine. But don't act like there aren't valid reasons to consider it. That's all I'm saying.

Either way I'm over this argument, it's fu**ing exhausting. I'm sure everyone will be thrilled lol.

- Toew Drags 4 Daze


don't worry, this trainwreck has been slowed enough that its another year before we hit that pole

lol
HawkintheD
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Sick Bay, MI
Joined: 02.22.2012

Feb 14 @ 3:31 PM ET
It used to mean they had a plan to get there.

Now they don't, as the data show rather clearly. This year may actually be the worst one since 2015.

So today, it's a hollow slogan.

- Return of the Roar


Well...factually, they won the Cup in 2015 so not quite sure how that rates up there as one of their worst years.

Also, even when they had a plan and were getting there, I don't recall you ever really being on board. The slogan if memory serves has always been hollow for you win or lose...so factually there's that.
SteveRain
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Connor Murphy Sucks, IL
Joined: 05.07.2010

Feb 14 @ 3:33 PM ET
You're only allowed to reference the marketing slogan when mocking the team because they've failed to achieve said goal.
- HawkintheD



Well they set the marketing slogan themselves. They get the good and the bad associated with it.

When you set high expectations you are tied to them.

So what has one goal meant since April or 2017?

And have you not noticed the authentic fan propaganda to get people emotionally attached and still showing up?

My personal expectations for this team since 2016 were subtle. Everyone was all excited for 2016-17 playoff run and I was chastised for suggesting they were flawed even though they were “best in the conference” how did that work out?

They have failed to figure out what exactly they want to do. That’s the issue. They are stuck in an ongoing neutral position which hasn’t worked and now it’s time to finally tear it down. They operated in an insane world for 3 years now and it’s not working.
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