The Pens gave a lot up for considering I think the deal the Flames had in place was Frolik and Jankowski if I recall.
- FlamesFan1230

I think they were desperate to offload Galchenyuk, so I think that played more of a part in the deal than anything else. Likely could have gotten it done for the prospect and a 2nd, but Galchenyuk was in the deal, they probably had to up it to a 1st.

That, and Rutherford apparently HATES drafting in the 1st round... lol He's moved more 1st rounders in the last 3 years than he's actually drafted...

thats what i thought it was too.

So are Flames gonna go in on a D man and/or top 6 guy or what??
- Squilliam-

Pitts paid a premium for Zucker though! A 1st and Addison.
Addison (a 2018 2nd round pick) was ranked at #79 on the Hockey Writers mid season top 100 prospects list.
Pelletier was ranked #48 and the Flames have no one else in the top 100.
I'm glad we weren't in on that as our prospect pool is weak.

I think they were desperate to offload Galchenyuk, so I think that played more of a part in the deal than anything else. Likely could have gotten it done for the prospect and a 2nd, but Galchenyuk was in the deal, they probably had to up it to a 1st.

That, and Rutherford apparently HATES drafting in the 1st round... lol He's moved more 1st rounders in the last 3 years than he's actually drafted...
- rmull905

We would have had to dump salary too though (at a price) to take on Zucker with no money retained.

We would have had to dump salary too though (at a price) to take on Zucker with no money retained.
- DEDDIE

Right - but I think Frolik (at the time) had a stronger rep than Galchenyuk does today. I think he was seen as a more useful player in their lineup. There's something off about AG's brand around the NHL and he seems to wear out his welcome fairly quickly these days.

Right - but I think Frolik (at the time) had a stronger rep than Galchenyuk does today. I think he was seen as a more useful player in their lineup. There's something off about AG's brand around the NHL and he seems to wear out his welcome fairly quickly these days.
- rmull905

Agreed but the price paid yesterday was too rich for our depleted prospect pool.
We cant afford to give up a 1st plus an A prospect or Pelletier and a 2nd for a guy like Zucker IMO.

McDavid our 2-3 weeks

Time for the oilers ship to sink
- Redmile247

Minor.

So looking at Trade possibilities with LA would you be willing to pay a premium for Toffoli and Martinez?

2020 1st Rnd Pick
2020 2nd Rnd Pick
Kylington
Gawdin

for

Toffoli - 50% salary retained
Martinez - 50% salary retained for this year

I know Flame's people are going to be saying that's WAY too much future to lose and LA Fans are going to say that's WAY low price considering what Zucker got for the Wild ..... I personally really like Kylington and would hate to lose him but for those 2 players they would be assets to the line up now and into playoffs even if everyone gets healthy.

So looking at Trade possibilities with LA would you be willing to pay a premium for Toffoli and Martinez?

2020 1st Rnd Pick
2020 2nd Rnd Pick
Kylington
Gawdin

for

Toffoli - 50% salary retained
Martinez - 50% salary retained for this year

I know Flame's people are going to be saying that's WAY too much future to lose and LA Fans are going to say that's WAY low price considering what Zucker got for the Wild ..... I personally really like Kylington and would hate to lose him but for those 2 players they would be assets to the line up now and into playoffs even if everyone gets healthy.
- buddy_doug

Flames aren’t going deep by adding those 2. If that’s what it cost then stand pat. At this point Treliving should be keeping as many picks as possible, you need the young guys on entry level deals to balance the cap. DON’T SUTTER OUR TEAM AGAIN!

So looking at Trade possibilities with LA would you be willing to pay a premium for Toffoli and Martinez?

2020 1st Rnd Pick
2020 2nd Rnd Pick
Kylington
Gawdin

for

Toffoli - 50% salary retained
Martinez - 50% salary retained for this year

I know Flame's people are going to be saying that's WAY too much future to lose and LA Fans are going to say that's WAY low price considering what Zucker got for the Wild ..... I personally really like Kylington and would hate to lose him but for those 2 players they would be assets to the line up now and into playoffs even if everyone gets healthy.
- buddy_doug

The Flames would do that in a heartbeat. Two solid pieces in a wide open year for a bunch of stuff they don't really care about or even want, but why would LA ever go for that? They're going to do much better trading each of them individually. Gawdin probably isn't an NHLer and Kylington hasn't looked better than a 6-7. The Kings will get probably at least a second-round pick and a better prospect than Gawdin for each of them. Could be more depending on how desperate teams get and if Kreider is available or not.

The Flames would do that in a heartbeat. Two solid pieces in a wide open year for a bunch of stuff they don't really care about or even want, but why would LA ever go for that? They're going to do much better trading each of them individually. Gawdin probably isn't an NHLer and Kylington hasn't looked better than a 6-7. The Kings will get probably at least a second-round pick and a better prospect than Gawdin for each of them. Could be more depending on how desperate teams get and if Kreider is available or not.
- Hunkulese

1st and Kylington for Toffoli

2nd and Gawdin for Martinez

A little over pay for Toffoli and a little under pay for Martinez but pretty close to your pricing. Gawdin is a point per game guy right now in the AHL. I am not saying he is on any top prospect lists but I think he has value.

The Flames would do that in a heartbeat. Two solid pieces in a wide open year for a bunch of stuff they don't really care about or even want, but why would LA ever go for that? They're going to do much better trading each of them individually. Gawdin probably isn't an NHLer and Kylington hasn't looked better than a 6-7. The Kings will get probably at least a second-round pick and a better prospect than Gawdin for each of them. Could be more depending on how desperate teams get and if Kreider is available or not.
- Hunkulese

1st and Kylington for Toffoli

2nd and Gawdin for Martinez

A little over pay for Toffoli and a little under pay for Martinez but pretty close to your pricing. Gawdin is a point per game guy right now in the AHL. I am not saying he is on any top prospect lists but I think he has value.
- buddy_doug

They'll be able to get better prospects than Kylington and Gawdin.

So looking at Trade possibilities with LA would you be willing to pay a premium for Toffoli and Martinez?

2020 1st Rnd Pick
2020 2nd Rnd Pick
Kylington
Gawdin

for

Toffoli - 50% salary retained
Martinez - 50% salary retained for this year

I know Flame's people are going to be saying that's WAY too much future to lose and LA Fans are going to say that's WAY low price considering what Zucker got for the Wild ..... I personally really like Kylington and would hate to lose him but for those 2 players they would be assets to the line up now and into playoffs even if everyone gets healthy.
- buddy_doug

Interesting proposal...
Paying up for someone to retain cap space in a deal is not something the Flames should do IMO. In fact, I would rather see the Flames retain salary in a deal to extract extra value from another team.
Martinez having another year on his deal after this year definitely has value but like K-man 25, I don't see this deal putting us over the top. Trading our first should be a non starter IMO. If the Flames rattle off 9/10 points between now and the deadline I might feel better about trading a 2nd, Kylington, Gawdin.

1st and Kylington for Toffoli

2nd and Gawdin for Martinez

A little over pay for Toffoli and a little under pay for Martinez but pretty close to your pricing. Gawdin is a point per game guy right now in the AHL. I am not saying he is on any top prospect lists but I think he has value.
- buddy_doug

I would not trade a 1st and Kylington for Krieder let alone TT!
2nd & Gawdin for Martinez I could get behind. I honestly dont know much about Gawdin but the fact he has not seen the NHL this year likely speaks volumes.

I would not trade a 1st and Kylington for Krieder let alone TT!
2nd & Gawdin for Martinez I could get behind. I honestly dont know much about Gawdin but the fact he has not seen the NHL this year likely speaks volumes.
- DEDDIE

This is the year for the Flames to go for it. The Pacific is wide open this year and depending on what everyone else does, adding Toffoli and Martinez probably gives the Flames the division and a great path to the conference final. They have a ridiculously easy schedule the rest of the way and Toffoli and Martinez address their biggest weaknesses. Getting a shot at resigning Toffoli also helps since UFAs aren't signing in Calgary. There's a realistic chance that Toffoli and Martinez could be Flames for the next 5 years if they trade for them.

Unless some kind of crazy Gaudreau trade happens in the offseason, the Flames are probably going to be worse next year, while the Oilers and Canucks will probably be better. Worrying about their prospect situation in five years over the current team is just going to make them mediocre forever. Trading away picks now will help them to be truly awful in 5-6 years so they can actually do a rebuild properly.

The Flames would do that in a heartbeat. Two solid pieces in a wide open year for a bunch of stuff they don't really care about or even want, but why would LA ever go for that? They're going to do much better trading each of them individually. Gawdin probably isn't an NHLer and Kylington hasn't looked better than a 6-7. The Kings will get probably at least a second-round pick and a better prospect than Gawdin for each of them. Could be more depending on how desperate teams get and if Kreider is available or not.
- Hunkulese

Based on what?

[quote=Hunkulese]This is the year for the Flames to go for it. The Pacific is wide open this year and depending on what everyone else does, adding Toffoli and Martinez probably gives the Flames the division and a great path to the conference final. They have a ridiculously easy schedule the rest of the way and Toffoli and Martinez address their biggest weaknesses. Getting a shot at resigning Toffoli also helps since UFAs aren't signing in Calgary. There's a realistic chance that Toffoli and Martinez could be Flames for the next 5 years if they trade for them.

Unless some kind of crazy Gaudreau trade happens in the offseason, the Flames are probably going to be worse next year, while the Oilers and Canucks will probably be better. Worrying about their prospect situation in five years over the current team is just going to make them mediocre forever.Trading away picks now will help them to be truly awful in 5-6 years so they can actually do a rebuild properly.

What the fck does this mean?

Based on what?
- The-O-G

Based on his ability to play hockey. He's similar to Czarnik. He's good enough to be a top offensive player in the AHL, but probably not quite good enough to be an offensive player in the NHL.

[quote=Hunkulese]This is the year for the Flames to go for it. The Pacific is wide open this year and depending on what everyone else does, adding Toffoli and Martinez probably gives the Flames the division and a great path to the conference final. They have a ridiculously easy schedule the rest of the way and Toffoli and Martinez address their biggest weaknesses. Getting a shot at resigning Toffoli also helps since UFAs aren't signing in Calgary. There's a realistic chance that Toffoli and Martinez could be Flames for the next 5 years if they trade for them.

Unless some kind of crazy Gaudreau trade happens in the offseason, the Flames are probably going to be worse next year, while the Oilers and Canucks will probably be better. Worrying about their prospect situation in five years over the current team is just going to make them mediocre forever.Trading away picks now will help them to be truly awful in 5-6 years so they can actually do a rebuild properly.

What the fck does this mean?
- The-O-G

It's silly to worry about giving up something like the 22nd pick this year. They'd be getting a player who's probably at least three years away and probably isn't going to be a high-end talent. Maybe he's a useful player in five years that'll make the Flames a little better, but you need high-end players to be competitive in the league. The easiest way to get those players is to be real bad for a couple years.

If the Flames don't make a move at the deadline this year, they've basically missed their window and will just be chasing mediocrity until Treliving is fired. Who cares about this year's first-round pick when there's a great route to the Western Conference final for whichever team makes the best moves at the deadline.

It's silly to worry about giving up something like the 22nd pick this year. They'd be getting a player who's probably at least three years away and probably isn't going to be a high-end talent. Maybe he's a useful player in five years that'll make the Flames a little better, but you need high-end players to be competitive in the league. The easiest way to get those players is to be real bad for a couple years.

If the Flames don't make a move at the deadline this year, they've basically missed their window and will just be chasing mediocrity until Treliving is fired. Who cares about this year's first-round pick when there's a great route to the Western Conference final for whichever team makes the best moves at the deadline.
- Hunkulese

22nd pick... counting your chickens much.
A rough stretch and that 22nd pick becomes # 10 in a hurry!
This team has been way too inconsistent this year to sell the future hoping you get in and get on a run. Lets start with LA and Anaheim this week as there are no free lunches in this league.

22nd pick... counting your chickens much.
A rough stretch and that 22nd pick becomes # 10 in a hurry!
This team has been way too inconsistent this year to sell the future hoping you get in and get on a run. Lets start with LA and Anaheim this week as there are no free lunches in this league.
- DEDDIE

A low first and second and two borderline NHLers isn't exactly selling their future. It also gives the Flames a chance to extend their window. The only chance the Flames have of signing a top six forward to a reasonable contract is if they trade for him and spend 2-4 months showing them how great a place to play it is.

Agreed but the price paid yesterday was too rich for our depleted prospect pool.
We cant afford to give up a 1st plus an A prospect or Pelletier and a 2nd for a guy like Zucker IMO.
- DEDDIE

Ok? Don't disagree, don't think I was suggesting we were in on this deal anyhow...

I don't get this playoff seeding tie breaker in the standings. A team can have less wins then you but still be ahead of you in the standings. For instance before the games on 2/11/20 Vegas and Flames each had 57 gp and 64 points. Flames had 29 wins to Vegas' 28 but Vegas was still ahead in the standings based on having more Regulation Wins (RW). Are total wins not that big of a deal when you can lose and still obtain these fake points from OT losses to help in the standings and different kinds of wins take precedence over others? I understand the RW column tie break but why total wins aren't looked at first before RW is baffling to me. Rant over

Based on his ability to play hockey. He's similar to Czarnik. He's good enough to be a top offensive player in the AHL, but probably not quite good enough to be an offensive player in the NHL.
- Hunkulese

How many Stockton games have you watched this year?


It's his second year pro, we haven't even seen him up with the big club yet, and you are declaring him unfit for the NHL. Thanks for your insight!