It's got nothing to do with this being a deep draft or "can't miss prospects".

The exact problem we're dealing with right now is that the Isles prospect pool is filled with either garbage or a couple guys that have high ceilings but also have moderately high risk of not reaching those ceilings.

My point is mainly that by trading a first, and obviously not having that selection to make this year, we're not adding any assets into that sub-par bank of futures that we can trade down the line. I don't think there's a rental player out there worth a 1st round pick, so trading our 1st out of desperation is just throwing away a pick that we could've used to draft a guy that we could trade down the line (or give us the depth to trade someone else) to acquire someone when there really is a truly talented rental player out there.

That said, trading it for someone young and cost-controlled (ie: Labanc) is checking boxes for the current season and many beyond. I'm fully on-board for something like that, but flipping a 1st for a few months of Pageau would be poor asset management and reek of desperation.
- eichiefs9

I’m not saying throw a first at any particular player I’m saying if there’s a player worth a first that’s available or becomes available that meets the criteria then you do it. By all reports Pageau’s perceived value is a 2nd and a prospect. Maybe that value gets driven up at some point but that’s what we have to work with at this point. Also, we have enough of a hard time attracting FA’s here any player traded for obviously has some value to us so it’s kind of like an extended interview process for the team and the player. Also, you say draft a player and potentially use him as trade bait later on. What do you think we’ll get for Holmstrom right now? We drafted him and what good is he doing for us as far as him being a trade asset? Obviously zero.

I can care less if any move “reeks of desperation” not sure why that’s a factor at all for you? If it helps the team I’m all for it.

https://www.nhl.com/standings/2019/league I think a few of you should look at this and calm down a bit. You would think we were in last place reading this thread. .. we should definitely make a big move, because we are definitely THAT close..
- niteislander

I don’t think anyone is at the point where they need to calm down.

Also, what in the world happened to Hickey? Any talk of adding D probably ends if he's around in case someone else goes down. Feels like the guy's been hurt for months but I don't know if anyone ever said what happened to him. Is he done for the season? Will he be back in a couple of weeks? Another month?

Eh...they're never going to be in a perfect position, but one key player plugged into the right spot makes a lot of other pieces fall into place better. And true value is relative.

I don't know, you can wait for the stars to align absolutely perfectly so there's virtually no risk at all, which is never going to happen, or you can try something a little different from the "shucky dang darn, we left no stone unturned but we really like our group" trade deadline boilerplate speech we're used to. I think they have a good squad with the right attitude, but I also think things are going maybe just a little stale. With the right shot in the arm, I think they can reach another gear.

As for the trickle down effect, maybe...but, again, the death grip they've historically had on the first round pick hasn't seemed to result in a flood of assets to trade now, when they could use some help.
- UIF

1000%. There will always be a reason for them not to make a move and a built in excuse to support it. Said exactly that I’m an earlier post. We do nothing every year let’s try something different for once.

That is the definition of a prospect.
- JimmyP

Yeah, to varying degrees....like everything on earth.

At one point Bode Wilde and Noah Dobson were both prospects, drafted in the same year. Would you have said that they had the same likelihood of fulfilling all of their potential last year?

Yeah, to varying degrees....like everything on earth.

At one point Bode Wilde and Noah Dobson were both prospects, drafted in the same year. Would you have said that they had the same likelihood of fulfilling all of their potential last year?
- eichiefs9

Is this in reference to Travis Zajac?

Eh...they're never going to be in a perfect position, but one key player plugged into the right spot makes a lot of other pieces fall into place better. And true value is relative.

I don't know, you can wait for the stars to align absolutely perfectly so there's virtually no risk at all, which is never going to happen, or you can try something a little different from the "shucky dang darn, we left no stone unturned but we really like our group" trade deadline boilerplate speech we're used to. I think they have a good squad with the right attitude, but I also think things are going maybe just a little stale. With the right shot in the arm, I think they can reach another gear.

As for the trickle down effect, maybe...but, again, the death grip they've historically had on the first round pick hasn't seemed to result in a flood of assets to trade now, when they could use some help.
- UIF

Of course there's never a perfect position, but the point is that there are exactly zero players who are likely to be available to us as rentals that are going to be worth a 1st round pick. Who do you honestly believe is out there that's actually worth using our 1st on? The only guy I can think of was already traded to the Coyotes.

Is this in reference to Travis Zajac?
- Cptmjl

Yes, please standby for further instruction

I don't know, if it's the right rental, I say trade the first. Why not? Hell, I think the only time in the last 10 years they did part with it was the draft they ended up getting Barzal and Beau anyway

I get it...it's a gamble and you might end up moving a first with little to show for it, which isn't the best thing for the future. All I'm saying is, hanging onto it like it's the most precious thing in the universe won't help them this season, and it hasn't exactly resulted in an embarrassment of riches as far as prospects and tradable assets. If there's a solid player that's going to fill a need, score some goals, and fit the team identity, I'm down for taking the risk, trading the pick, and worrying about an extension later.
- UIF

My issue is the cupboard is bare right now and they need to restock a bit. I'm all for a gamechanger but not if he walks after the season. This team even with pageau probably isnt getting tonthe finals

I don't think they're in a position to trade 1st's for the rental, again -- rental, players that are out there. I don't think they're one piece away from being likely Cup contenders. I definitely don't think anyone that's been talked about as available has a true-value that is a 1st and maybe more.

That has a major trickle-down effect on having assets in later years to acquire assets when they may actually be in that contender category.
- eichiefs9

Or this

Or this
- Upstate_isles

I mean, it's not like I'm sitting here saying under no circumstances whatsoever should we be trading our first round pick. But the premier pending-UFA has already been dealt and I don't believe anyone else out there is worth it and I don't think overpaying just so we can check the box of "welp, we traded our first for the best of what was left and it still didn't lead to a Cup" is a smart way to go about conducting business as an organization.

Trading our 1st for a quality pending RFA? I'm in...obviously depending on who

Trading our 1st for a young-ish guy with term that we can fit under the cap moving forward? Done, do it.

Trading our 1st because the Coyotes dealt with a rash of injuries and completely fell apart and are now trading Taylor Hall? I'm all in

I’m not saying throw a first at any particular player I’m saying if there’s a player worth a first that’s available or becomes available that meets the criteria then you do it. By all reports Pageau’s perceived value is a 2nd and a prospect. Maybe that value gets driven up at some point but that’s what we have to work with at this point. Also, we have enough of a hard time attracting FA’s here any player traded for obviously has some value to us so it’s kind of like an extended interview process for the team and the player. Also, you say draft a player and potentially use him as trade bait later on. What do you think we’ll get for Holmstrom right now? We drafted him and what good is he doing for us as far as him being a trade asset? Obviously zero.

I can care less if any move “reeks of desperation” not sure why that’s a factor at all for you? If it helps the team I’m all for it.
- Cptmjl

Hear, hear!

The biggest risk is they trade the pick, fall out of the playoffs, and that pick hits the lottery. I'm not sure we should even be thinking like that, though (even though it'd be a completely Islander thing to happen). The most likely risk is you may miss out on a good player in the first round, even if it's a late first. That's where you have to consider the risk/reward.

I'm not so sure about the risk being that the prospect pool is that doomed down the road. If you trade your 1st, 2nd, and 3rd away, then sure, that'll cause some problems. Or if you're trading your 1st away every year. But we're not talking about dumping an entire draft...it's one pick; one player, who may or may not be worth a whole lot in the end.

I arguing for a trade and maybe a little bit of recklessness, and Ses is arguing for standing pat. What is going on today?
- UIF

You have no idea how much it hurts me not wanting Lou to wheel and deal. Just does not seem to be in the cards.

I mean, it's not like I'm sitting here saying under no circumstances whatsoever should we be trading our first round pick. But the premier pending-UFA has already been dealt and I don't believe anyone else out there is worth it and I don't think overpaying just so we can check the box of "welp, we traded our first for the best of what was left and it still didn't lead to a Cup" is a smart way to go about conducting business as an organization.

Trading our 1st for a quality pending RFA? I'm in...obviously depending on who

Trading our 1st for a young-ish guy with term that we can fit under the cap moving forward? Done, do it.

Trading our 1st because the Coyotes dealt with a rash of injuries and completely fell apart and are now trading Taylor Hall? I'm all in
- eichiefs9

I agree this is my point too. I think lou wants to make a move but one that doesnt mortgage the future for a guy that might make us a little bit better

I agree this is my point too. I think lou wants to make a move but one that doesnt mortgage the future for a guy that might make us a little bit better
- Upstate_isles

This is the key. Does not seem to be that player available that puts the Isles over the top. We are talking about 3rd line type players. Pageau and Toffoli and nice pieces if the prices are reasonable but either one of these players do not make the Isles Eastern Conference finals favorites.

I agree this is my point too. I think lou wants to make a move but one that doesnt mortgage the future for a guy that might make us a little bit better
- Upstate_isles

Pageau is about the only rental out there that you can even kinda make an argument for being worth one and it's my personal opinion that he's not.

I'm fine with some sort of conditional 1st, although that's nearly impossible to talk about. You want to tell Ottawa "we'll give you a conditional 1st and Otto Koivula for Pageau - If the Isles are eliminated in the first or second round then the 2020 1st becomes a 2020 2nd, but if they reach the ECF and/or the Stanley Cup finals it becomes a 1st" then I think I'm OK with that. But there's way too much randomness in hockey for me to feel that trading a 1st for a middle-six defensive forward rental is a smart decision.

https://www.nhl.com/standings/2019/league I think a few of you should look at this and calm down a bit. You would think we were in last place reading this thread. .. we should definitely make a big move, because we are definitely THAT close..
- niteislander

Agreed, St. Louis won the Stanley Cup last year. Where were they at this point in the season last year. 1ST objective for every team is to make the PO's. From there on any team can win. Ask Tampa and the Leafs.

I don’t think anyone is at the point where they need to calm down.
- Cptmjl

Maybe calm down was the wrong words... the meaning was..we are top 5 in the league and it feels like we are last. .. nothing more.. .

If we get 1 top 6 players and start playing the right way again we can beat anyone.. period. Look at playoffs last years.

Lightening, Leafs, Pens and Caps were top teams in league talent wise... they all lost in first round.

Malkin on home crowd booing Murray: It was stupid.

I’m not understanding our fans. Muzz won two Cups for us. You boo him — why? If you come to the arena, support our team. All of us. We try. We play so hard this year. We work so hard through injuries. We play good hockey. Maybe not last couple games, not early this game. But we try.

I understand: You pay money for ticket, you do what you want. But it’s tough to sit on bench and hear that. I don’t like it. We hear that in Philly, not Pittsburgh.

Agreed, St. Louis won the Stanley Cup last year. Where were they at this point in the season last year. 1ST objective for every team is to make the PO's. From there on any team can win. Ask Tampa and the Leafs.
- nyisles7

All about team buying in and playing for each other in the playoffs. We have that on this team. They all just need to get back to playing right way.

Maybe calm down was the wrong words... the meaning was..we are top 5 in the league and it feels like we are last. .. nothing more.. .

If we get 1 top 6 players and start playing the right way again we can beat anyone.. period. Look at playoffs last years.

Lightening, Leafs, Pens and Caps were top teams in league talent wise... they all lost in first round.
- niteislander

It's a lot of pressure expecting players like Bailey and Eberle to bring it every game in the playoffs and produce. That is what it is going to take. Having a nice first round against the Pens and doing nothing against the Canes will not cut it. Teams like Tampa, Pens, and Caps are not going to lose in the 1st round all the time. Isles had everything going for them last year with top teams losing and still only won a round. I just do not believe in the current roster in terms of being able to go on a long playoff run. Hope I'm wrong.

Malkin on home crowd booing Murray: It was stupid.

I’m not understanding our fans. Muzz won two Cups for us. You boo him — why? If you come to the arena, support our team. All of us. We try. We play so hard this year. We work so hard through injuries. We play good hockey. Maybe not last couple games, not early this game. But we try.

I understand: You pay money for ticket, you do what you want. But it’s tough to sit on bench and hear that. I don’t like it. We hear that in Philly, not Pittsburgh.
- niteislander

Pens fans have very little to complain about. Even with the 1st round lost last year. Fans have had plenty of great moments.

Of course there's never a perfect position, but the point is that there are exactly zero players who are likely to be available to us as rentals that are going to be worth a 1st round pick. Who do you honestly believe is out there that's actually worth using our 1st on? The only guy I can think of was already traded to the Coyotes.
- eichiefs9

You named one if he actually becomes available. Who knows who will become available between now and then?

You named one if he actually becomes available. Who knows who will become available between now and then?
- Cptmjl

Sadly trade deadline is a letdown most years. Very few Butch Goring trade type impacts.

My issue is the cupboard is bare right now and they need to restock a bit. I'm all for a gamechanger but not if he walks after the season. This team even with pageau probably isnt getting tonthe finals
- Upstate_isles

Well to be fair there isn’t any one team that’s “probably” getting to the finals. I’m not even saying that sarcastically. We all know anything can happen. Though this team hasn’t been playing well lately we’ve been in the top five of the league the entire season.