What? have you looked at his stats and workload?

Crawford is one slight glancing of the head away from a long term sit....maybe for good given his young kid at home.
- SteveRain

Whatever Stan does with Lehner we will say it was a mistake. That's just how it goes.

Also to comment on a premise I have seen on these boards. You are out of your minds if you want the Hawks to sign Lehner to a deal for more than 2 years. His body is going to break down and quick at his size. I wouldn't pay him any more than he is making now, either.


If it were me, I wouldn't sign Tubby at all.
- Elbows15

So, a guy with a career 91.9 Save % and 2.68 career GAA, and you don’t like him? 93.0% LY and 93.8% this season, and you want to get rid of him?

I remember Gump Worsley being somewhat rotund. Did keep him from stopping pucks.

EDIT: Lehner has the 9th highest career save percentage in the history of the NHL. I’ll admit they didn’t track save % in the early years, but 9th ever is pretty good.

Here are your projected points

Kane 107
DeBrincat 64
Strome 58
Saad 46
Toews 43

Once again, its always on 88 to make this team go offensively, and again....I point squarely at 19....10.5 cap hit for a rapidly declining asset outside of a mirage last year, and a guy incapable of making his line mates any better.

Saad at 46 is all well and fine if your top guys are producing, but as guy getting paid 6 AAV pretty sad numbers, and save me from all the "small things" he does. Those small things don't justify a 6 AAV cap hit.....unless he's scoring

Strome at 58...if hes asking for big money, happy trails......He's replaceable with Dach having an offseason of goodman to get him bigger, stronger, faster and you can save that money you'd blow on 17 elsewhere.

Bottom line.....outside of Kane and the 2 goalies, this entire team needs to look in the mirror and find their games, or else Bowman needs to get off his @ss and start selling high as he can on some of these guys. Im not talking about DeBrincat….he's having an off year.....Strome was a ghost in Arz and back to being a ghost here.

Whatever Stan does with Lehner we will say it was a mistake. That's just how it goes.
- rpeters01

Of course...because god forbid we acknowledge he may be better then Crawford right now and be the more logical place to invest $$ for the next 2-3 years.

Hey team - I'm back from vacation and will have a blog out later today. Sorry for the delay!
- Tyler Cameron

Slacker

Here are your projected points

Kane 107
DeBrincat 64
Strome 58
Saad 46
Toews 43

Once again, its always on 88 to make this team go offensively, and again....I point squarely at 19....10.5 cap hit for a rapidly declining asset outside of a mirage last year, and a guy incapable of making his line mates any better.

Saad at 46 is all well and fine if your top guys are producing, but as guy getting paid 6 AAV pretty sad numbers, and save me from all the "small things" he does. Those small things don't justify a 6 AAV cap hit.....unless he's scoring

Strome at 58...if hes asking for big money, happy trails......He's replaceable with Dach having an offseason of goodman to get him bigger, stronger, faster and you can save that money you'd blow on 17 elsewhere.

Bottom line.....outside of Kane and the 2 goalies, this entire team needs to look in the mirror and find their games, or else Bowman needs to get off his @ss and start selling high as he can on some of these guys. Im not talking about DeBrincat….he's having an off year.....Strome was a ghost in Arz and back to being a ghost here.
- SteveRain

Not knowing what Strome will ask for (Strome finished last year with 58 points)

But - Last year Gustav Nyquist - 60 points 4 years $5.5 mil. Ryan Dzingel 56 points 2 years AAv $3.37 mil (hope they can sign Strome for this, about the same they are paying Zach Smith). Other 55-60 point forwards Evander Kane, Brock Bosser (3 years $5.875), E. Kane 56 pts. Josh Bailey 56 pts., kevin Hayes 55 pts. (and we all know how overpaid he is).

Strome is going to get a nice salary increase. I also don't think he has been a ghost. Streaky yes, a ghost no.

I do agree that the Hawks are in big trouble if your first line consists of 2 guys making $16.5 AAV) at 40 something points, and a rookie with about 30-35 points (that most agreed would be happy if Nylander reached that point total this year), you need more production, especially if the bottom 6 is goal challenged.

Too late already done (missed the bad attitude though)

SimpleJack
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Chicago , IL
Joined: 05.23.2013

Yesterday @ 2:01 AM ET
Cat and Strome = complete garbage

This season they look like 3rd liners. Zero high end skill. Slow, can’t shoot, and can’t pass.

Schmautz has very similar numbers playing center on the #1 line with Kessel and Keller. He got $5.8mil for 7 years for his half year with the Yotes last year.
- LAHawk

Yea there's a big difference between the 2, Cat is a hockey player, Schmaltz isn't yet and may never be, TT became one, we'll see

Slacker
- SaskHawkFan

Here are your projected points

Kane 107
DeBrincat 64
Strome 58
Saad 46
Toews 43

Once again, its always on 88 to make this team go offensively, and again....I point squarely at 19....10.5 cap hit for a rapidly declining asset outside of a mirage last year, and a guy incapable of making his line mates any better.

Saad at 46 is all well and fine if your top guys are producing, but as guy getting paid 6 AAV pretty sad numbers, and save me from all the "small things" he does. Those small things don't justify a 6 AAV cap hit.....unless he's scoring

Strome at 58...if hes asking for big money, happy trails......He's replaceable with Dach having an offseason of goodman to get him bigger, stronger, faster and you can save that money you'd blow on 17 elsewhere.

Bottom line.....outside of Kane and the 2 goalies, this entire team needs to look in the mirror and find their games, or else Bowman needs to get off his @ss and start selling high as he can on some of these guys. Im not talking about DeBrincat….he's having an off year.....Strome was a ghost in Arz and back to being a ghost here.
- SteveRain

Is being one of the best defensive forwards on the team a small thing? I always find it funny when people think that keeping pucks out of our net is a small, and less important, aspect of a players game.

Correct me if I am wrong in assuming this is what you are referring to.

He had mad skills, at one time was compared to Beliveau.
- LAHawk

He was. Reay turned him into a shadow.

I also remember John Ferguson battling Hull with a little extra rough stuff while he had the wired jaw, and Montreal fans booed one of their own for it.
- Angotti

Hull fought Ferguson with a broken jaw.

I will always contend that if Hull had half the meanness of Howe, it would have been Hull's records that Gretz was breaking.

I mean on the ice. Off ice is another issue.

So, a guy with a career 91.9 Save % and 2.68 career GAA, and you don’t like him? 93.0% LY and 93.8% this season, and you want to get rid of him?

I remember Gump Worsley being somewhat rotund. Did keep him from stopping pucks.

EDIT: Lehner has the 9th highest career save percentage in the history of the NHL. I’ll admit they didn’t track save % in the early years, but 9th ever is pretty good.
- scottak

That is all nice and all but it won't make me like him. I would trade him in a heartbeat.

FYI

18/23=.782

82 games by .782=64.17

64.17 is not 70
- SteveRain

FYI. I know what the numbers are. I don't assume a guy who has done nothing but score goals his whole life is going to forget how.

FYI
64 and 58 points are definitely numbers worthy of top 6.

Is being one of the best defensive forwards on the team a small thing? I always find it funny when people think that keeping pucks out of our net is a small, and less important, aspect of a players game.

Correct me if I am wrong in assuming this is what you are referring to.
- Chunk

Problem with Saad is that goal production doesn't equate the salary. Hard to float a guy on a 6 AAV contract, when other parts aren't producing OR you don't have the cap space.

Defensive forwards are nice....Bolland (before his big pay day), KRuger, Madden, Frolik, and on it goes....those were all nice when slotted right against the cap. When not, its really tough to justify them.....Notice all of them are usually the 1st to go when push comes to shove vs salary cap OR they are pushing for a raise.

The Hawks best players need to start producing or else Bowman has to really think about putting some of these guys on the block come the deadline or draft or later this upcoming summer...…..to keep icing the same roster built around the same key guys and expecting different results is insanity.

FYI. I know what the numbers are. I don't assume a guy who has done nothing but score goals his whole life is going to forget how.

FYI
64 and 58 points are definitely numbers worthy of top 6.
- Elbows15

If you are referencing 12 with your 1st paragraph I don't disagree. Snipers run on confidence and when they lose it, they struggle.

The problem with the Hawks is, and really has been since Hossa "retired" is that they are a 1 line team.....and that line is whatever line 88 is on. Why? Because 19 can't carry a line by himself OR make those around him better. That's the issue.

Hell at this point they could make 17.77 the top 2 pivots and I'd be fine with it, much like the Canadians used to do in the Olympics...Very rarely did Toews play top 6 minutes but instead was in a glorified 3rd line role.....

19 is a large reason why this team can't overcome some short comings, and IMO if he doesn't start producing I would trade his @ss asap. Thank you for the glory years but starting in 2013-14 production went down every year.....up until last year's mirage, and now he's back to not showing up on the stat sheet.....thus, putting all the scoring onus on Kane and his linemates.

Lehner is a damn good goalie....hawks would be sniffing a lottery pick without him right now.

Not knowing what Strome will ask for (Strome finished last year with 58 points)

But - Last year Gustav Nyquist - 60 points 4 years $5.5 mil. Ryan Dzingel 56 points 2 years AAv $3.37 mil (hope they can sign Strome for this, about the same they are paying Zach Smith). Other 55-60 point forwards Evander Kane, Brock Bosser (3 years $5.875), E. Kane 56 pts. Josh Bailey 56 pts., kevin Hayes 55 pts. (and we all know how overpaid he is).

Strome is going to get a nice salary increase. I also don't think he has been a ghost. Streaky yes, a ghost no.

I do agree that the Hawks are in big trouble if your first line consists of 2 guys making $16.5 AAV) at 40 something points, and a rookie with about 30-35 points (that most agreed would be happy if Nylander reached that point total this year), you need more production, especially if the bottom 6 is goal challenged.
- LAHawk

I don't disagree.....I just grow tired of the defense of how Toews/Saad do this great defensive game and the team gives up a CRAP ton of goals against, but then it's spun again to another metric to deflect the criticism of either.

Saad.....if you have 2 lines who can produce consistently, he's the best 3rd line wing in the game. Hands down. Problem is the hawks haven't had that production since he's been back.

Toews....go look up his stats....its' sad. Since 2013-14 to last year he dipped in points every year (1 year he matched the out put of 58 points) until last year's mirage...and now we are back in the same trend of him dipping. Why is it?

Everyone points to Seabrook's deal as some albatross.....I don't disagree but in fairness everyone needs to start looking at 19's realizing he's a 10.5 cap hit and giving you low 2nd line player/high 3rd line player production.

Lastly, the PK still sucks regardless of coaching and so does the PP.....so if the constant variable is the players since we have had 2 different head coaches and god knows how many assistant's going back to 2010-11......have to wonder what is going on...….

Problem with Saad is that goal production doesn't equate the salary. Hard to float a guy on a 6 AAV contract, when other parts aren't producing OR you don't have the cap space.

Defensive forwards are nice....Bolland (before his big pay day), KRuger, Madden, Frolik, and on it goes....those were all nice when slotted right against the cap. When not, its really tough to justify them.....Notice all of them are usually the 1st to go when push comes to shove vs salary cap OR they are pushing for a raise.

The Hawks best players need to start producing or else Bowman has to really think about putting some of these guys on the block come the deadline or draft or later this upcoming summer...…..to keep icing the same roster built around the same key guys and expecting different results is insanity.
- SteveRain

I can't stand projecting stats for the year on the first quarter, but it's not like he is useless offensively. 6/7/13 in 23 games is about 20-25 goals and about 50 pts, plus defensive ability, strong board play, etc for $6M AAV. That is about the current going rate (if not a slight bargain).

Of course...because god forbid we acknowledge he may be better then Crawford right now and be the more logical place to invest $$ for the next 2-3 years.
- SteveRain

I said this in July and got killed here. "How can you push HOF Crow out..." Nevermind he'll be 36 next season, one Nerf puck in the head from being done, hasn't played a full season in two years if ever, falling down stairs or whatever it was?

I can't stand projecting stats for the year on the first quarter, but it's not like he is useless offensively. 6/7/13 in 23 games is about 20-25 goals and about 50 pts, plus defensive ability, strong board play, etc for $6M AAV. That is about the current going rate (if not a slight bargain).
- Chunk

Would you pay Saad more then 6.4 AAV? Say for 3-4 years after next year?

I said this in July and got killed here. "How can you push HOF Crow out..." Nevermind he'll be 36 next season, one Nerf puck in the head from being done, hasn't played a full season in two years if ever, falling down stairs or whatever it was?
- rpeters01

Welcome to the world of being a "Cro hater"

Im sure, where's the red font, that having Lehner a legit 1 and also playing very well has nothing to do with CC playing very good......friendly competition is good.

The amount of point blank chances opposition gets game in and game out on the PP, or 5 on 5 is insane....Its almost as a fan I expect either of these goalies to make grade A save after save after save because we have seen it early on this season...…

I still think this is a fringe playoff team when everyone is doing their part......but right now the biggest bust of the year is 19.

Would you pay Saad more then 6.4 AAV? Say for 3-4 years after next year?
- SteveRain

No

No
- LAHawk

Ok...that's 12s cap hit after this year.....

If Bowman can lock up Saad for the same cap hit, Im fine with it. I highly doubt it happens, and if Bowman isn't.....then Saad becomes quite a trade chip if this team isn't in the playoff window this spring, or you revisit this summer.....I also don't see how 56 is on this team long term.....They need a PP qb and he's 1 of a few, if the only one, on the back end with a plus offensive game....but his d zone play for a defensemen is a train wreck.

If you are referencing 12 with your 1st paragraph I don't disagree. Snipers run on confidence and when they lose it, they struggle.

The problem with the Hawks is, and really has been since Hossa "retired" is that they are a 1 line team.....and that line is whatever line 88 is on. Why? Because 19 can't carry a line by himself OR make those around him better. That's the issue.

Hell at this point they could make 17.77 the top 2 pivots and I'd be fine with it, much like the Canadians used to do in the Olympics...Very rarely did Toews play top 6 minutes but instead was in a glorified 3rd line role.....

19 is a large reason why this team can't overcome some short comings, and IMO if he doesn't start producing I would trade his @ss asap. Thank you for the glory years but starting in 2013-14 production went down every year.....up until last year's mirage, and now he's back to not showing up on the stat sheet.....thus, putting all the scoring onus on Kane and his linemates.

Lehner is a damn good goalie....hawks would be sniffing a lottery pick without him right now.
- SteveRain

How much longer until all you said about Toews hits the fan and is magnified in media?

I do not foresee playoffs or starting to turn things around until some new young forwards and dmen join the team. Some should get planted and grow next season, but the dmen will take root and begin to blossom the season after next.

A new center would likely have to arrive via trade or the draft

In house Barrett might become a productive center like Strome but a yapper! !and better effort defensivy. Barrett needs to improve his skating though

Welcome to the world of being a "Cro hater"

Im sure, where's the red font, that having Lehner a legit 1 and also playing very well has nothing to do with CC playing very good......friendly competition is good.

The amount of point blank chances opposition gets game in and game out on the PP, or 5 on 5 is insane....Its almost as a fan I expect either of these goalies to make grade A save after save after save because we have seen it early on this season...…

I still think this is a fringe playoff team when everyone is doing their part......but right now the biggest bust of the year is 19.
- SteveRain

I would love to keep Cro, at a salary commensurate with a #2 goaltender. I don't think the market will be that great for him anyways. Currently the big UFA's would be Holtby, and Lehner. The Kings want to trade Quick in the worst way to make way for Cal Peterson. You have Greiss, Halak and Khudobin that are the same age as Corey, not had the injuries that Crow has had, and frankly will fit in as a number 2 salary wise with the hard cap era.

Kelly Hrudey said the reason why young goalies replace older ones, is not necessarily because the younger ones are better. but they are cheaper, and have less wear and tear on them, less prone to injury. Look at the NHL today, there are more 1A 1B goalie tandems than ever. The days of a Brodeur playing 70 games is over.

Do you think Crow would be as sharp if he played 16 of the 23 games, how would Delia have done in the remaining 7? Look what happened in Toronto with their goalie situation.

Love Crow, but this is a business, not a video game. If he wants to sign a Cam Ward type contract 1 year $3 mil. no movement, I would be glad to give him that, otherwise, good luck and we will see you back next year with a great video tribute.

How much longer until all you said about Toews hits the fan and is magnified in media?

I do not foresee playoffs or starting to turn things around until some new young forwards and dmen join the team. Some should get planted and grow next season, but the dmen will take root and begin to blossom the season after next.

A new center would likely have to arrive via trade or the draft

In house Barrett might become a productive center like Strome but a yapper! !and better effort defensivy. Barrett needs to improve his skating though
- jhawk59

Hope you are well hockeypuck….

Dach may have been drafted for that purpose....replacing 19....I don't know.

The way I look at it

50 or 40 wont be here next year and Delia likely will.....that saves you 4 to 5 million and then subtract new AAV...should net something here

I don't see 56 being here next year...guessing 27 takes his place

Offensively....they need to add more scoring.....20/65 are nice chip in guys but not something to count on consistently.....see what a year of 92 brings and 77 should take a big leap next year after a year under his belt and a full offseason getting bigger/stronger.

I mean if you could find a talented winger ie Hossa type to play with 19, slot 12-17-88 and 20-77-65 together....you have a very good top 9.

Only other issue I see is the back end.....going to need to find another top 4 d man to play with 5.....and 2 is probably better suited for 2nd pairing and 7 for the 3rd pairing. Maybe 2/6 becomes a quasi 4/27 from the hey-day.