Yesterday was a glorious day. TheCock is gone!!!!

WE have now clinched the playoffs.

exactly, he was and is as advertised. It is part of what made him successful... and part of why he wears out his welcome eventually.

"Mike Babcock is arrogant"

"Kyle Dubas is shyte at contract negotiations"

which one matters more going forward?
- BorjeFan4Ever

Kyle Dubas didn't have much leverage. He did well with the guys he actually had leverage on.

i only operate in hyperbole so no
- daeth

this is the worst hockey forum post i've EVER SEEN IN MY ENTIRE LIFE and it's not even close

this is the worst hockey forum post i've EVER SEEN IN MY ENTIRE LIFE and it's not even close
- TheMussel

that's the spirit!

Yesterday was a glorious day. TheCock is gone!!!!

WE have now clinched the playoffs.
- RogerRoeper

LOL.

Anybody want to take a moderate approach to all of this and say that maybe Babcock had a shelf life and it expired, but he wasn't a bad coach, just not working in Toronto? Can we say that while Keefe may not be everybody's first choice, it might be prudent to see what happens after he takes over? Anybody wanna admit that we don't have a stake in MLSE and we'll either have to see how it pans out or stop paying attention, and that we know very little if not nothing in terms of what happens behind closed doors?

Just throwing it out there. It's hockey, and if you're posting in here, chances are your security and livelihood don't depend on it.
- TheMussel

I hated Babs more than anyone on here and even I don't think he's a bad coach. He was clearly a horrible fit for how this team was built.

Yesterday was a glorious day. TheCock is gone!!!!

WE have now clinched the playoffs.
- RogerRoeper

count me out, i had nothing to do with any of this

LOL.
- Cousinskrid

We are this years Blues. We are going on such a run.

count me out, i had nothing to do with any of this
- daeth

I sit on my couch with my hands in my pants as the games are on.

I sit on my couch with my hands in my pants as the games are on.
- RogerRoeper

i don't wear pants while i watch games

or in general really, im a fox

I don't think he can really do much to address needs.

This team is completely handcuffed by the cap - and I don't think that's much of a criticism of Dubas. Sure, he overpaid a little on Marner, but not enough to make it the thing that makes the Leafs so tight to the cap.

The Leafs had an exceptional (for the Leafs it was historic) bulge of young players arriving at RFA status at the same time - so it's a good problem to have.

But trading anyone other than Tavares, Marner, Matthews, Nylander or Rielly isn't really going to move the needle that much. And I doubt Dubas makes that dramatic a move (maybe Nylander).

Like it or lump it, this is our team for the next three years. So they'd better find a way to win with the group they have.
- Atomic Wedgie

agreed completely.

but, Dubas can change the narrative substantially if he comes to the conclusion that you mentioned above... maybe Nylander.

moving Nylander would signal that he(Dubas) recognizes he made a mistake...and represents a chance to change the roster construction to a degree all in one go.

if on the other hand they are practically out of the playoff picture by end of January - and he starts moving Muzzin, Barrie and a couple of the other more peripheral contracts... that would signal simply move the deck chairs around on the titanic.

Do people really hate Torts? Or does the media just hate him? Where is the proof?

And the other coaches were coaches before the 20th century. It’s a different game.
- Santo_44

Sooooooo...., imagine you were a Columbus Blue Jacket last year:

Keys to success:
Play Matthews/Nylander 22 minutes a night. Play Tyson Barrie with Rielly and use Barrie on 1st unit PP every single time.

Do NOT obsessively line-match! Leave the 1st unit PP on more than 40 seconds.


DO NOT play the 4th line after every goal and not in the finals 3 minutes.

I don't think he can really do much to address needs.

This team is completely handcuffed by the cap - and I don't think that's much of a criticism of Dubas. Sure, he overpaid a little on Marner, but not enough to make it the thing that makes the Leafs so tight to the cap.

The Leafs had an exceptional (for the Leafs it was historic) bulge of young players arriving at RFA status at the same time - so it's a good problem to have.

But trading anyone other than Tavares, Marner, Matthews, Nylander or Rielly isn't really going to move the needle that much. And I doubt Dubas makes that dramatic a move (maybe Nylander).

Like it or lump it, this is our team for the next three years. So they'd better find a way to win with the group they have.
- Atomic Wedgie

From a cap perspective, I think Willie needs to go to fill other needs.

It was quite the odd thing here to happen to Toronto. They had (and did) have the ability to land Tavares, while also having Mathews, and Marner.

Id be hard pressed to find another team that wouldnt have done the same.

I think they are betting that the cap does in fact go up.

agreed completely.

but, Dubas can change the narrative substantially if he comes to the conclusion that you mentioned above... maybe Nylander.

moving Nylander would signal that he(Dubas) recognizes he made a mistake...and represents a chance to change the roster construction to a degree all in one go.

if on the other hand they are practically out of the playoff picture by end of January - and he starts moving Muzzin, Barrie and a couple of the other more peripheral contracts... that would signal simply move the deck chairs around on the titanic.
- BorjeFan4Ever

I don't think trading Nylander means he admits anything. It would be a cap move. Nylander is great value at 6.9. If anyone thinks differently, look at other contracts around the NHL

Yesterday was a glorious day. TheCock is gone!!!!

WE have now clinched the playoffs.
- RogerRoeper

its 10am... you shouldn't be drinking this early

From a cap perspective, I think Willie needs to go to fill other needs.

It was quite the odd thing here to happen to Toronto. They had (and did) have the ability to land Tavares, while also having Mathews, and Marner.

Id be hard pressed to find another team that wouldnt have done the same.

I think they are betting that the cap does in fact go up.
- mel_vin

Leafs fans are funny - if you suggest trading a guy, you get accused of saying the guy sucks.

Nylander is the obvious guy to trade because he's a good player (too soft, but what'evs), on a reasonable contract. We'd hopefully get back a good player.

Somebody earlier suggested exploring what you would get for Matthews. Hell, I'd be willing to listen. If it got us his equivalent on the blue line, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

16 of 31 NHL teams are currently within 500K of the cap. Vast majority have contracts they can't move. Leafs can move any contract right now. It's annoying for people to act like the Leafs are the posterboy for "Cap Hell" and Dubas is bad at managing the cap. It's simply not true

I don't think trading Nylander means he admits anything. It would be a cap move. Nylander is great value at 6.9. If anyone thinks differently, look at other contracts around the NHL
- RogerRoeper

this is such a subjectively dumb argument ... repeated SO MANY TIMES already in this thread.

you think Nylander at 6.9 is great - I think Nylander at 6.9 is average at best
my reference is Patrnak, signed for less one year earlier - and MOST IMPORTANTLY significantly better, more accomplished player
Nylander has 20+ games this year, all playing with Matthews where he has been statistically fine, but been an absolute mess or disinterested for substantial periods.

now that may be "enough" for you... that doesn't represent "great value" to me.

to make Nylander's contract "great" - please point out the guys who are paid more who contribute less?


and for the record, it was Dubas who said to Nylander he wouldn't trade him - so trading him would represent exactly the kind of contrition that a non-arrogant would do... I don't expect you to understand.

Leafs fans are funny - if you suggest trading a guy, you get accused of saying the guy sucks.

Nylander is the obvious guy to trade because he's a good player (too soft, but what'evs), on a reasonable contract. We'd hopefully get back a good player.

Somebody earlier suggested exploring what you would get for Matthews. Hell, I'd be willing to listen. If it got us his equivalent on the blue line, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
- Atomic Wedgie

Matthews is a franchise centre you build around and is 22. You never trade him.
Matthews will now get more TOI with Keefe. His stats will get even better.

Leafs fans are funny - if you suggest trading a guy, you get accused of saying the guy sucks.

Nylander is the obvious guy to trade because he's a good player (too soft, but what'evs), on a reasonable contract. We'd hopefully get back a good player.

Somebody earlier suggested exploring what you would get for Matthews. Hell, I'd be willing to listen. If it got us his equivalent on the blue line, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
- Atomic Wedgie

stop being do damn rational

this is such a subjectively dumb argument ... repeated SO MANY TIMES already in this thread.

you think Nylander at 6.9 is great - I think Nylander at 6.9 is average at best
my reference is Patrnak, signed for less one year earlier - and MOST IMPORTANTLY significantly better, more accomplished player
Nylander has 20+ games this year, all playing with Matthews where he has been statistically fine, but been an absolute mess or disinterested for substantial periods.

now that may be "enough" for you... that doesn't represent "great value" to me.

to make Nylander's contract "great" - please point out the guys who are paid more who contribute less?



and for the record, it was Dubas who said to Nylander he wouldn't trade him - so trading him would represent exactly the kind of contrition that a non-arrogant would do... I don't expect you to understand.
- BorjeFan4Ever

Everyone brings up Pastrnak what about Clayton Keeler? What about Brock Nelson, Kevin Hayes. 1 time 50 point players now get 6-7.15 per. Nylander is on his way to his 3rd 60+ point season in only 3 full years.

You honestly are not aware of guys scoring less making more?

Leafs fans are funny - if you suggest trading a guy, you get accused of saying the guy sucks.

Nylander is the obvious guy to trade because he's a good player (too soft, but what'evs), on a reasonable contract. We'd hopefully get back a good player.

Somebody earlier suggested exploring what you would get for Matthews. Hell, I'd be willing to listen. If it got us his equivalent on the blue line, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
- Atomic Wedgie

what about Rielly?

I saw this mentioned on twitter. looking at the Rapters...they traded DD, great player..but not perfect.

Rielly is great, but used as a #1 as he has been..has big holes in his defensive play

16 of 31 NHL teams are currently within 500K of the cap. Vast majority have contracts they can't move. Leafs can move any contract right now. It's annoying for people to act like the Leafs are the posterboy for "Cap Hell" and Dubas is bad at managing the cap. It's simply not true
- RogerRoeper

At worst, the only contract that would probably prove difficult to move would be Ceci. Even then I think it's movable as it's only a one year deal.

At worst, the only contract that would probably prove difficult to move would be Ceci. Even then I think it's movable as it's only a one year deal.
- Aaron_85

Leafs are not in a bad position at all.