You know he's UG right?
- gravyface

No he’s not..

UG can’t stand me.. JFJ is pretty chill.. if he was UG, he wouldn’t be able to hide is disdain for me.

Sorry, still dont want him at that contract at that age. The comparables you listed, pronger fell off at 36. Chara is his own unique animal..guy can be slow as (frank) but hes so damn big. And lidstrom is arguably one of the best dmen not named orr of all time. And neidermayer was done at 36.
I mean i understand you are willing to take that risk, but i sure as hell wont.
- mykokes

Its cool cause neither of you have to take that risk....not your money or team.
So if elite dmen like doughty fall off at 36, that would mean a team would have a slow doughty for 1 year but a great dman in his prime for several.
If the leafs could afford that trade theyd do it in a heartbeat.
Unfortunately we are already overpaying am and mm.
No money right now

If Matthews walks?

Imagine how tough it’ll be signing him with a 35 year old Doughty making 11 million.

Give it a rest.
- Santo_44

5 years from now.
At the current rate the cap goes up that could be 10m more than the current cap.
Everyone is tradable, weve seen bad contracts traded
If doughty helps you get a cup....who cares how tough it would be.
Its 5 years away.

It was Dermotts 3rd game and he was flying.

He will be in the top 4 soon enough, he is only going to get more fresh.

Then you have Holl playing great, awesome 3rd pairing guy for cheap.

Help is coming for Rielly, soon.
- Santo_44

I always thought great players lifted others up

Reilly seems to always need help

I always thought great players lifted others up

Reilly seems to always need help
- Fakepartofme

That's a bit unfair now.

He's managed to perform admirably despite being partnered with pretty bad players through the years.

That's a bit unfair now.

He's managed to perform admirably despite being partnered with pretty bad players through the years.
- Scabeh

Oh no, hes played well.
Fo' shizzle

I always thought great players lifted others up

Reilly seems to always need help
- Fakepartofme

Hainsey?

He carried Hainsey through some tough mins...as I’ve mentioned before Hainsey was and still is great at defending the rush and on his own blue line. Something Rielly really has struggled with...that pairing worked but Rielly carried him.

Ceci struggles in the same area, it’s frustrating to watch that pairing but it won’t be together for long.

I’d like Holl to get a shot while Dermott is getting into shape but I doubt we see that.

Doughty, like the others listed, is the best of his generation and that's not going to stop at 30. It may seem that way because he's stuck on a poop team but he's far, far from finished.

Even if he falls off a cliff at 36 or 37, that's a small price to pay for what he could produce from 30-35 which is a Stanley Cup. That's worth it especially when you consider there's nobody else out there in the Leafs system or available anywhere else.

The Leafs were patient and rebuilt but at some point they have to roll the dice and make a big move to fix the defense and there aren't many better rolls to take than this one.
- JohnFergusonJr

at what cost?
and it has to be money in, money out to cover the 11m cap hit.

Nylander and Ceci would cover it I guess.

JFJ carpet bombing this thread with facts.
- Arctic_AARDVARK

Niedermayer - Norris at 30, Cup and Conn Smythe at 34.
Chara - Norris at 31, Cup at 33, two more Final appearances at 35+.
Pronger - Final at 32, Cup at 33, Final at 36.
Lidstrom - Norris at 35, 36, 37 and 40. Cup at 37, Final at 38.
Keith - Norris at 31, Cup and Conn Smythe at 32.

Elite defensemen don't fall off a cliff in their 30s. Some play very well into their 40s. The Norris Trophy has been awarded since 1955. 30 out of 64 went to somebody 30 or older. Giordano just won it last year at 35.

If anything, you don't want Tavares at 30+ because goal scoring takes a dip at 30 but he's here until he's 35+ too. What mitigates that is him playing with Marner, the same way Rielly would mitigate Doughty's age.

The positives far outweigh the negatives with Doughty. He's still in his prime, he's an elite RHD, he plays two-way hockey, he's a proven winner and he brings experience that the Leafs don't have. He hits, he blocks shots, he kills penalties, he shuts down top players and he can skate for days. He's not 20 but he's not 40 either.
- JohnFergusonJr

not saying that anything you've posted here is wrong... but there is another consideration, which I believe is particularly pertinent to Doughty.

the league overall is significantly faster now than it was even in 2013-2014 - and while I don't think we'll see that level of change again in the 4-5 years, I don't see the league as a whole slowing down.

all the HoF guys you mentioned played the prime parts of their careers when the game was slower and more physical.

Doughty is a great skater - although not the quickest anymore - I believe that's a mileage issue.

My assertion is that you will see a degradation in Doughty's ability to effect games particularly if he's playing in a system like the Leafs seem to want to deploy -wide open, limited support from the forwards (if any at all ) . Doughty's style fits perfectly with how the Kings want to play, slower, structured, I'm not sure he'd be as effective in a different system.

I always thought great players lifted others up

Reilly seems to always need help
- Fakepartofme

Id say he is lifting others up. He's being dragged down by playing with obvious lower tier dmen. He hasnt been great this year, but he's been injured as well, who knows what the injury was.

So Holl has been pretty decent.

So Holl has been pretty decent.
- senstroll

You're just saying that because you want him to fill your Holl.

at what cost?
and it has to be money in, money out to cover the 11m cap hit.

Nylander and Ceci would cover it I guess.
- zazzle

Exactly

Nylander + Ceci

for

Jenner, Anderson, Savard

You're just saying that because you want him to fill your Holl.
- AdamFrench

Good one..

Good one..
- Arctic_AARDVARK

This Justin, gaping Holl found between Cory Schneider's legs.

not saying that anything you've posted here is wrong... but there is another consideration, which I believe is particularly pertinent to Doughty.

the league overall is significantly faster now than it was even in 2013-2014 - and while I don't think we'll see that level of change again in the 4-5 years, I don't see the league as a whole slowing down.

all the HoF guys you mentioned played the prime parts of their careers when the game was slower and more physical.

Doughty is a great skater - although not the quickest anymore - I believe that's a mileage issue.

My assertion is that you will see a degradation in Doughty's ability to effect games particularly if he's playing in a system like the Leafs seem to want to deploy -wide open, limited support from the forwards (if any at all ) . Doughty's style fits perfectly with how the Kings want to play, slower, structured, I'm not sure he'd be as effective in a different system.
- BorjeFan4Ever

I can agree with this.

You're just saying that because you want him to fill your Holl.
- AdamFrench

maybe

Why is everyone else having such a hard time scoring on Rask?

He's terrible!

not saying that anything you've posted here is wrong... but there is another consideration, which I believe is particularly pertinent to Doughty.

the league overall is significantly faster now than it was even in 2013-2014 - and while I don't think we'll see that level of change again in the 4-5 years, I don't see the league as a whole slowing down.

all the HoF guys you mentioned played the prime parts of their careers when the game was slower and more physical.

Doughty is a great skater - although not the quickest anymore - I believe that's a mileage issue.

My assertion is that you will see a degradation in Doughty's ability to effect games particularly if he's playing in a system like the Leafs seem to want to deploy -wide open, limited support from the forwards (if any at all ) . Doughty's style fits perfectly with how the Kings want to play, slower, structured, I'm not sure he'd be as effective in a different system.
- BorjeFan4Ever

I agree with you.. Doughty is still really good. Our forwards, or rather, our system is designed to create offense using our speed. You can see that our forwards don't really support our defensemen game in-game out.

Is Doughty still able to skate his way out of trouble?

Why is everyone else having such a hard time scoring on Rask?

He's terrible!
- Scabeh

Lol..

You’re only allowed to talk about Leaf topics in here.. (frank) rask, (frank) the Bruins or whoever else the Habs recently played and you observed. That’s what the Habs thread is for.

Why is everyone else having such a hard time scoring on Rask?

He's terrible!
- Scabeh

Lol..

You’re only allowed to talk about Leaf topics in here.. (frank) rask, (frank) the Bruins or whoever else the Habs recently played and you observed. That’s what the Habs thread is for.
- Arctic_AARDVARK

Fine.

Why are the Leafs having such a hard time beating the Bruins and Rask? He sucks!

I blame Nylander, Kadri, the Refs and Babock.

Better?

Fine.

Why are the Leafs having such a hard time beating the Bruins and Rask? He sucks!

I blame Nylander, Kadri, the Refs and Babock.

Better?
- Scabeh

Didn’t Halak play them last time? 🤔

Bruins are good. They have a very balanced lineup and their players have courage, and play the right way.

Boston is the best sports city in the world atm..

Why is everyone else having such a hard time scoring on Rask?

He's terrible!
- Scabeh

It would be awesome if we behaved more like bonobos...then instead of coming to blows, we'd be blowing to come.