And that goal by Ovechkin - he was Dach’s man - but Dach was a little too deep next to the goal to come out and pick him up in time. No big deal, kid will learn from it - but that’s hardly a function of a “bad system” or a of a blue line group that’s too old and slow.

I for one think this blue line looks much better than last season. de Haan is almost able to backstop most of Gus’ freewheeling/freelance antics. I’d like to see what a KK/de Haan pairing would look like - and let Gus watch a few games.
- Chief4Feathers

Dach even said the Ovechkin goal was on him post game.

Instead of the Captain I'd rather see Dach between these Saad and Kubalik

And that goal by Ovechkin - he was Dach’s man - but Dach was a little too deep next to the goal to come out and pick him up in time. No big deal, kid will learn from it - but that’s hardly a function of a “bad system” or a of a blue line group that’s too old and slow.

I for one think this blue line looks much better than last season. de Haan is almost able to backstop most of Gus’ freewheeling/freelance antics. I’d like to see what a KK/de Haan pairing would look like - and let Gus watch a few games.
- Chief4Feathers

What I noticed the past couple of games as opposed to last year is a significant decline in odd man rushes against. Also Washington is probably the heaviest team style wise in the league (Vegas is next), and I don't think the Hawks were" ragdolled" or shied away from contact at all (and that includes Nylander).

I think it’s worth a look.
- Chief4Feathers

I have been against Keith playing on the PK this year since the get go.

So now where going to excuse Crawford's goals allowed? The Crawford who helped this team win 2 Stanley cups is Mia.
Crawford just like Lehner are going to have to play lights out and make miraculous saves .

In Crawford's 4 starts he has only had 1 game that he allowed 1 goal or less and played phenomenal. Lehner has out played Crawford and his goals against speak for themselves.
- Taylorst1

Nope. We're gonna ask a simple question- which of the four goals he let in yesterday do you think he should have stopped?

What I noticed the past couple of games as opposed to last year is a significant decline in odd man rushes against. Also Washington is probably the heaviest team style wise in the league (Vegas is next), and I don't think the Hawks were" ragdolled" or shied away from contact at all (and that includes Nylander).
- LAHawk

Agreed. That heavy style really amplifies on the forecheck in the offensive zone. I had concerns that we were going to be watching the Hawks pinned down in their own zone for extended portions of the game. But, to their credit that wasn’t the case.

Nope. We're gonna ask a simple question- which of the four goals he let in yesterday do you think he should have stopped?
- mohel

Yeah, I don’t know how you watch last night’s game and come away with Crawford having a sub-standard performance?

Nope. We're gonna ask a simple question- which of the four goals he let in yesterday do you think he should have stopped?
- mohel

Don’t feed the troll.

Nope. We're gonna ask a simple question- which of the four goals he let in yesterday do you think he should have stopped?
- mohel

All 4 on defensive breakdowns in my book

All 4 on defensive breakdowns in my book
- BetweenTheDots

Technically every goal against any team is a defensive breakdown.

Yeah, I don’t know how you watch last night’s game and come away with Crawford having a sub-standard performance?
- Chief4Feathers

Sometimes people have trouble with the idea of a small sample size when looking at a stat like save percentage.

Washington goals, 1st goal - PK turnover, 2nd goal PP turnover, 3rd goal, Ovechkin has scored like 400 goals from that exact spot, 4th goal, breakdown in coverage, 5th goal, en. So you are going to tell me that a different defensive scheme would stop the Ovechkin goal (how many has he scored in his career?, and would never have a defensive breakdown?), I did not see many if any defensive zone coverage where I thought, geez our defense is way too slow.
- LAHawk

I'm not going to say a different scheme would help (because I am not well versed enough to know), but I do believe that better anticipation, communication and familiarity would.

Like on the shorty, if Crow can identify early what Gus is going to do to (and Gus actually commits to doing it) he would be in a much better position to make the stop. On Ovi's goal, he may ultimately not have been able to do anything (Ovi is pretty good after all), but Dach could have done a lot more to prevent that opportunity. This isn't putting the onus on a single player, but the group out there as a unit.

As others have stated, Crow and Lehner are different beasts, but they both need to know how the players in front of them will address various situations. I'm not absolving them of responsibility on the goals. It also is not solely their fault. Hopefully, with a number of games in close succession, they can get on a roll.

Dach and Nylander on the same line might be too much to ask of two rookies this season.
- DarthKane

Agree. And Toews being left handed feeds a sniper at RW much better than LW. He really needs a goal scorer on his RW. On his LW he does better with guys that get their goals in the dirty areas. (Caggiula, Saad)

I'm not going to say a different scheme would help (because I am not well versed enough to know), but I do believe that better anticipation, communication and familiarity would.

Like on the shorty, if Crow can identify early what Gus is going to do to (and Gus actually commits to doing it) he would be in a much better position to make the stop. On Ovi's goal, he may ultimately not have been able to do anything (Ovi is pretty good after all), but Dach could have done a lot more to prevent that opportunity. This isn't putting the onus on a single player, but the group out there as a unit.

As others have stated, Crow and Lehner are different beasts, but they both need to know how the players in front of them will address various situations. I'm not absolving them of responsibility on the goals. It also is not solely their fault. Hopefully, with a number of games in close succession, they can get on a roll.
- Chunk

What Gus did on that 2 on 1 gets you benched in Pee Wees

Sometimes people have trouble with the idea of a small sample size when looking at a stat like save percentage.
- mohel

I completely agree with your statement here, but you also cannot completely absolve the tender. Are they overplaying the shot or the pass, are they communicating with the D? Obviously much harder to discern from the stands or on TV, but it has to be taken into account as well.

I believe both of our points can be true at the same time.

Nope. We're gonna ask a simple question- which of the four goals he let in yesterday do you think he should have stopped?
- mohel

The Corey Crawford who just over 2 years ago made the saves that nobody thought could be made now , when this team needs a goaltender who can make those saves he isn't able to. His numbers reflect that.

This team went f4om being able to score In their top 6 and having a bottom 6 that was lackluster to a top 6 that seems to be struggling to muster up any sustained offensive threat and a bottom 6 that is doing the job we needed.

That goal Crawford gave up during the 4 minute power play , that's where Crawford needed to come up big that goal deflated any chance for any momentum. Sure their was a breakdown but with Crawford's pedigree he needs to himself play better giving up in 4 starts 3 of them 4 goals or more .

Agree. And Toews being left handed feeds a sniper at RW much better than LW. He really needs a goal scorer on his RW. On his LW he does better with guys that get their goals in the dirty areas. (Caggiula, Saad)
- -Doh-

On this team at least, who better than Kane or Kubalik?

I actually really like the idea of Toews between Saad and Kubalik IF Dach is eventually moved to center.

Saad-Toews-Kubalik
Caggiula-Dach-Kane
DeBrincat-Strome-Nylander
Shaw-Kampf-Carpenter

The Corey Crawford who just over 2 years ago made the saves that nobody thought could be made now , when this team needs a goaltender who can make those saves he isn't able to. His numbers reflect that.

This team went f4om being able to score In their top 6 and having a bottom 6 that was lackluster to a top 6 that seems to be struggling to muster up any sustained offensive threat and a bottom 6 that is doing the job we needed.

That goal Crawford gave up during the 4 minute power play , that's where Crawford needed to come up big that goal deflated any chance for any momentum. Sure their was a breakdown but with Crawford's pedigree he needs to himself play better giving up in 4 starts 3 of them 4 goals or more .
- Taylorst1

I believe Crow still has all of the tools to be what we expect. Look no further than his performance against the Oilers. He stopped McDavid and Draisaitl both point blank on breakaways - two of the best currently in the league. There isn't much continuity to the team right now. Goalies getting every other game, long layoffs between games, etc. This doesn't excuse poor performances, but it can contribute to hesitation which can lead to sloppy play and "bad" goals.

We're tied for the fewest number of games played in the league. No one wants to give away points, but I don't think it is as cut and dried as the goalie isn't good anymore.

I actually really like the idea of Toews between Saad and Kubalik IF Dach is eventually moved to center.

Saad-Toews-Kubalik
Caggiula-Dach-Kane
DeBrincat-Strome-Nylander
Shaw-Kampf-Carpenter
- SimpleJack

Hey, where's Smith?

Hey, where's Smith?
- Chunk

and Sikura?

Don’t feed the troll.
- Ogilthorpe2

Good point.

I completely agree with your statement here, but you also cannot completely absolve the tender. Are they overplaying the shot or the pass, are they communicating with the D? Obviously much harder to discern from the stands or on TV, but it has to be taken into account as well.

I believe both of our points can be true at the same time.
- Chunk

Chunk your correct. Both of our points are valid. I'm not giving the defense a pass they to need to clean up their act. My point was Crawford's numbers in 4 starts are awful in 3mof them he has given up 4 goals or more. Where as Lehner numbers are better.

If your the coach Sure your first option is Crawford based on respect his past accomplishments but looking at his numbers through the 4 starts and Lehner you have to bench Crawford and start Lehner.


Crawford's pedigree and history shows he has or had another level of play in him. That's what its going to take for this team to win alot of those games.

Technically every goal against any team is a defensive breakdown.
- LAHawk

Oh getting technical on me?

Well i don't think any of those goals were soft goals given up by the goalie

Grade aaaaaa scoring chances all 4

I completely agree with your statement here, but you also cannot completely absolve the tender. Are they overplaying the shot or the pass, are they communicating with the D? Obviously much harder to discern from the stands or on TV, but it has to be taken into account as well.

I believe both of our points can be true at the same time.
- Chunk

Oh, there's plenty of space to blame goalies, for sure. But I don't see how any of yesterday's goals can be pinned on him. Do we like an .862 save percentage? No, but I can't honestly say that he should have stopped any of them.

Oh, there's plenty of space to blame goalies, for sure. But I don't see how any of yesterday's goals can be pinned on him. Do we like an .862 save percentage? No, but I can't honestly say that he should have stopped any of them.
- mohel

The problem I have is with the word "should". When goalies do stop those shots, is it because they are lucky, more skilled, quicker, smarter, better team in front of them? This is why I spread the wealth on the reason(s) for failure.