If the Devils are going for it, they could conceivably sign Gardiner with enough left over to sign their two RFAs. I think that would make them a really tough team and it could also make the draft picks they traded away a lot less valuable.

If the Devils are going for it, they could conceivably sign Gardiner with enough left over to sign their two RFAs. I think that would make them a really tough team and it could also make the draft picks they traded away a lot less valuable.
- Hockey66

Many have speculated this point but Jake’s ask, desires destination, and back issues are all possible sticking points

My guess is that Vegas was only going to send Gusev east. Nobody else out east has the cap space. Ottawa doesn’t make sense. Montreal does but they already need to move someone

Many have speculated this point but Jake’s ask, desires destination, and back issues are all possible sticking points

My guess is that Vegas was only going to send Gusev east. Nobody else out east has the cap space. Ottawa doesn’t make sense. Montreal does but they already need to move someone
- WSCTeton17

For just $4.5 per, I think a lot of other teams could have swung it (CBJ, PHI, NYI, DET). BOS, too, if they moved out a cheap contract.

Okay, so next question:

Are the Pens better off today if JR rides off into the sunset after the second cup and the reigns are handed to Botterill?

Okay, so next question:

Are the Pens better off today if JR rides off into the sunset after the second cup and the reigns are handed to Botterill?
- Za Warudo

I believe that beyond a shadow of the doubt, although there are a handful of people on here that will roll their eyes at that.

For just $4.5 per, I think a lot of other teams could have swung it (CBJ, PHI, NYI, DET). BOS, too, if they moved out a cheap contract.
- Hockey66

I think most would agree it’s too early for Detroit. Philly could’ve made it work but they’re already thin on picks moving forward and if someone gets hurt and they need to replace him the they’ll need those picks. Provorov is likely taking their attention. I think Philly with AV would’ve been a great fit. I think Boston likes their forwards, their cap space will go to Mac and Carlo. NYI has two RFAs to sign and some highly paid forwards, also not flush with picks

Teams should’ve been willing to take the risk and it’s too bad we weren’t that team. It’s done now, looking forward to seeing how it plays out

I believe that beyond a shadow of the doubt, although there are a handful of people on here that will roll their eyes at that.
- Victoro311

I wouldn't go that far as the jury is still out on Botterill but I would make that trade. I would rather overpay top-end talent than overpay low-end "talent."

I believe that beyond a shadow of the doubt, although there are a handful of people on here that will roll their eyes at that.
- Victoro311

Gotta kinda figure that means we’d have Skinner on our team. Not sure what that means about Brass, Cole, or Oleksiak

Gotta kinda figure that means we’d have Skinner on our team. Not sure what that means about Brass, Cole, or Oleksiak
- WSCTeton17

Not to be overlooked, we might not have JJ and Guds ($7.25 per combined) and we probably don't give Tanev that ridiculous contract.

There are a few moves that JR made that didn't turn out well but I don't blame him for making them. Brassard was a good target but I think they should have addressed 3C way before then.

Not to be overlooked, we might not have JJ and Guds ($7.25 per combined) and we probably don't give Tanev that ridiculous contract.

There are a few moves that JR made that didn't turn out well but I don't blame him for making them. Brassard was a good target but I think they should have addressed 3C way before then.
- Hockey66

I’m wary of the general idea that, on a Championship team, 3C needs to be more than a replacement-Level guy.

I don’t get triggered and while these movies you guys keep listing aren’t bad it’s the most normy bullpoop guy movie list of all time. All around boring. A bullpoop blogger’s opinion doesn’t change anything. A Ryan Reaves will always have a better career than a Brian Gibbons or Mark Arcobello. Keep it a Canadian.

I don’t get triggered and while these movies you guys keep listing aren’t bad it’s the most normy bullpoop guy movie list of all time. All around boring. A bullpoop blogger’s opinion doesn’t change anything. A Ryan Reaves will always have a better career than a Brian Gibbons or Mark Arcobello. Keep it a Canadian.
- Grinder47

Lol Normie.

If the hipsters are too cool for Wes Anderson, the Before Trilogy, and David Lynch now I don’t even wanna know what they’re into these days.

I’m wary of the general idea that, on a Championship team, 3C needs to be more than a replacement-Level guy.
- Za Warudo

I don't think you need a guy like Staal or a former 2C level player like Brassard, but if you can swing it, it's a very important position that can lead to significant mismatches. Ideally, I think you should have at least a bona fide 3C and not some 4C playing above his head or what I think of as "replacement-level" which is an NHL/AHL tweener. If you mean "replacement-level" as an average 3C (but definitely a 3C and not less), then I agree with you.

I’m wary of the general idea that, on a Championship team, 3C needs to be more than a replacement-Level guy.
- Za Warudo

Blues just won with Bozak and we won in 2017 with a really underachieving Bonino. You don’t need an elite 3C if you’ve got other things going for you.

Blues just won with Bozak and we won in 2017 with a really underachieving Bonino. You don’t need an elite 3C if you’ve got other things going for you.
- Victoro311

It's not necessary, but it doesn't hurt to have one either. Our other 2 recent Cup winners had them with Staal and how great Bonino was for that first run.

Is Brassard even in the NHL anymore?

I believe that beyond a shadow of the doubt, although there are a handful of people on here that will roll their eyes at that.
- Victoro311

Nah... I roll my eyes when people try to give Botts rather than JR the credit for the two cup wins.

At this point, I agree Botts would have avoided JJ, Reaves and Gudbranson. He wouldn't have signed Tanev to that absurd term either.....so yes, the Pens would probably be in better shape. But let's be honest, Bott's hasn't exactly killed it in Buffalo yet and there's absolutely no way of knowing what he would have done at the reigns of the Pens.

FWIW.... I don't hate Reaves and Guddy.

It's not necessary, but it doesn't hurt to have one either. Our other 2 recent Cup winners had them with Staal and how great Bonino was for that first run.
- Tojo.

Championship Teams have competitive advantages at certain positions. Sometimes it’s goal, sometimes it’s 3C, sometimes it’s 2nd D pairs. No two are the same.

The Pens have had a rather obsessive focus on 3C going back to Jordan Staal and have probably missed opportunities to build competitive advantages in other areas as a result.

Nah... I roll my eyes when people try to give Botts rather than JR the credit for the two cup wins.

At this point, I agree Botts would have avoided JJ, Reaves and Gudbranson. He wouldn't have signed Tanev to that absurd term either.....so yes, the Pens would probably be in better shape. But let's be honest, Bott's hasn't exactly killed it in Buffalo yet and there's absolutely no way of knowing what he would have done at the reigns of the Pens.

FWIW.... I don't hate Reaves and Guddy.
- madmike71

I agree with this. Not to dredge up an old argument, but I didn't mind the deal that brought Reaves here (not great, not terrible at the time IMO because Sundqvist wasn't doing anything and we only moved down 20 spots for the best enforcer on a cheap contract who isn't a horrible hockey player). I think if JR knew Sully wasn't going to play him, he wouldn't have made the trade.

As for Guddy, JR went chasing bottom six production and used an expensive expiring contract (Hags) to try to get it. When Pearson didn't work out, we ended up with a 3rd pairing D making $4 mil per for 3 more years. He has turned out better than expected, but the difference between him and Ruhwedel is probably not much and the cap savings would have been $3.3 mil which would have gone a long way into signing someone more impactful than Tanev. But, hindsight is always 20/20 and every GM has his warts.

Championship Teams have competitive advantages at certain positions. Sometimes it’s goal, sometimes it’s 3C, sometimes it’s 2nd D pairs. No two are the same.

The Pens have had a rather obsessive focus on 3C going back to Jordan Staal and have probably missed opportunities to build competitive advantages in other areas as a result.
- Za Warudo

Ehhh, I think our poor drafting / poor draft position and farm system that didn't produce any quality centers led to what some might consider an "obsessive" 3C focus. Teams that have centers tend to keep them. Teams that don't have them need to find them and usually pay a premium for them.

There was the failed Sutter experiment, then Bonino who was cheap and very much under-the-radar, and then we went without a 3C for a while until we got Brassard and that sucked. And then we got Brassard and that sucked some more. I wouldn't call it obsessive, but rather just trying to fill an important position without an in-house option.

I think if we were truly obsessive about a 3C we would be looking to acquire a center better than Bjug right now.

Okay, so next question:

Are the Pens better off today if JR rides off into the sunset after the second cup and the reigns are handed to Botterill?
- Za Warudo

Didn’t you know that Botterill was the reason for the cups in the first place? He also could talk to Phil Kessel like a human. Whatever the f uck that means.

I’m wary of the general idea that, on a Championship team, 3C needs to be more than a replacement-Level guy.
- Za Warudo

I mean, in the pens case, they had Phil on the 3rd line when they won. If the 3C isn't very good, you can get away with it but you still need at least one talented/play-driver on the 3rd line.

So now Jay Beagle is better than Brandon Sutter?

Kunitz officially retires and joins Chicago's staff. Surprised Pens didn't give him that opportunity.

Kunitz officially retires and joins Chicago's staff. Surprised Pens didn't give him that opportunity.
- YouMeAndDupuis9

Me too.