location totally helps. they also had hayes come to them and sold high on him
- johnnykarate

Their biggest selling point

Which team will become a playoff contender first?
- VanHockeyGuy

Buffalo and Vancouver are probably better comparable’s, six drafts ago they both had few prospects and both teams finished poorly.

2014 draft - Canucks pick 6th Buffalo 2nd
2015 draft - Canucks pick 23rd Buffalo 2nd
2016 draft - Canucks pick 5th Buffalo 8th
2017 draft - Canucks pick 5th Buffalo 8th
2018 draft - Canucks pick 7th Buffalo 1st
2019 draft - Canucks pick 10th Buffalo 7th

Vancouver had 35 wins this year Buffalo 33, both have some great young players, be interesting to see how each team progresses from here.

why do we need to see how the season goes? in the last three drafts where they have been rebuilding they have had, in addition to aquiring prospects (largely from 2016 draft for some reason)

6 first round picks
3 second rounds
3 third round picks

is that not good?
- johnnykarate

Different rosters, circumstances, luck and approaches. I'm just curious which team turns the corner first.

Different rosters, circumstances, luck and approaches. I'm just curious which team turns the corner first.
- VanHockeyGuy

I think Pettersson will be a world class player. I can't wait to see what he does this year let alone in 5 years.

I think Pettersson will be a world class player. I can't wait to see what he does this year let alone in 5 years.
- VANTEL

he's pretty close already.

Different rosters, circumstances, luck and approaches. I'm just curious which team turns the corner first.
- VanHockeyGuy

Definitely

Different rosters, circumstances, luck and approaches. I'm just curious which team turns the corner first.
- VanHockeyGuy

agreed though i think nyr is at a slightly bigger advantage in general. a frequent complaint is that jimbo didnt get enough picks to rebuild so just on that metric, nyr seems to be doing pretty good.

now their picks might not pan out and they might not hit in later rounds but thats a whole other area where its hard to compare teams approach and development

I think Pettersson will be a world class player. I can't wait to see what he does this year let alone in 5 years.
- VANTEL

He was basically on a point-per-game basis his rookie year if he would have played the full 82 would have been 75-80 pts.

Willing to bet he is in the high 80's this season barring injuries.

He was basically on a point-per-game basis his rookie year if he would have played the full 82 would have been 75-80 pts.

Willing to bet he is in the high 80's this season barring injuries.
- LordHumungous

I like that they have provided him with better puck movement on the back end and on his left wing.

I like that they have provided him with better puck movement on the back end and on his left wing.
- VANTEL

Absolutely Benning has surrounded Petey with better players which was the plan. Hughes and Miller on the PP is gonna be big with Pettersson. If that's how it ahkes out.

Which team will become a playoff contender first?
- VanHockeyGuy

Canucks....but that's a strange benchmark as some would likely argue they were playoff contenders last season.

Canucks....but that's a strange benchmark as some would likely argue they were playoff contenders last season.
- belcherbd

You are so wrong . Benning had the final say. Many players want to play in their home town but if the GM does not want them on the team they can want all they want but it is not happening.
- VANTEL

Is this the latest in Benning hate? Somehow he didnt do a great job in signing Stecher?
Well he did, suck it haters!

Buffalo and Vancouver are probably better comparable’s, six drafts ago they both had few prospects and both teams finished poorly.

2014 draft - Canucks pick 6th Buffalo 2nd
2015 draft - Canucks pick 23rd Buffalo 2nd
2016 draft - Canucks pick 5th Buffalo 8th
2017 draft - Canucks pick 5th Buffalo 8th
2018 draft - Canucks pick 7th Buffalo 1st
2019 draft - Canucks pick 10th Buffalo 7th

Vancouver had 35 wins this year Buffalo 33, both have some great young players, be interesting to see how each team progresses from here.
- Pacificgem

Even just on draft picks that isn’t particularly close

Even just on draft picks that isn’t particularly close
- neem55

Colorado vs Van works out to be pretty damn close.

Bleakley, Rantanen, Jost, Makar, Kaut, Byram and Newhook

Virtanen, McCann, Boeser, Joulevi, Pettersson, Hughes, Podzolkin.

2014 23 vs 6 + 24
2015 10 vs 23
2016 10 vs 5
2017 4 vs 5
2018 16 vs 7
2019 4 + 16 vs 10

He’s still an NHL player, at least for now. They won’t demote him out of spite. Jim is too level headed for that.
- 1970vintage

Gagner got that treatment. He was still an NHL playerish like LE... and Canucks could fit him under the cap. No problem sending him off to AHL to be forgotten about.

- LordHumungous

Sure, good on the rangers for being successful but I don't really buy into the comparison. I prefer to look at what a team attempts to do and how successful they are at it vs trying to compare different teams with different rosters.

It's like comparing Gillis' drafting to Benning's, apple's to oranges.

Compare Gillis to Wilson or another competitive team or Benning to Colorado over the same time period.
- belcherbd

Without looking I'm going to guess Gillis still looks horribad compared to competitive teams. Six 1st rounders plus trading away one. So 7 first round opportunities only resulted in one NHL player for the Canucks.

Classic!

https://youtu.be/njHcAY5kq64

MTL has tried to offer sheet 3 players now and has been turned down by 2 of them. Guessing because they were too low.
- manvanfan

I hope Marner signs one of his offer sheets when the season starts. Leafs would be in even worse shape because they cant go over the cap by 10% like now.

Moby Richard
Chapter 12

Queequeg was a native of Rokovoko, an island far away to the West and South. It is not down on any map; true places never are.

When a new-hatched savage running wild about his native woodlands in a grass clout, followed by the nibbling goats, as if he were a green sapling; even then, in Queequeg's ambitious soul, lurked a strong desire to see something more of Christendom than a specimen whaler or two. His father was a High Chief, a King; his uncle a High Priest; and on the maternal side he boasted aunts who were the wives of unconquerable warriors. There was excellent blood in his veins- royal stuff; though sadly vitiated, I fear, by the cannibal propensity he nourished in his untutored youth.

A Sag Harbor ship visited his father's bay, and Queequeg sought a passage to Christian lands. But the ship, having her full complement of seamen, spurned his suit; and not all the King his father's influence could prevail. But Queequeg vowed a vow. Alone in his canoe, he paddled off to a distant strait, which he knew the ship must pass through when she quitted the island. On one side was a coral reef; on the other a low tongue of land, covered with mangrove thickets that grew out into the water. Hiding his canoe, still afloat, among these thickets, with its prow seaward, he sat down in the stern, paddle low in hand; and when the ship was gliding by, like a flash he darted out; gained her side; with one backward dash of his foot capsized and sank his canoe; climbed up the chains; and throwing himself at full length upon the deck, grappled a ring-bolt there, and swore not to let it go, though hacked in pieces.

In vain the captain threatened to throw him overboard; suspended a cutlass over his naked wrists; Queequeg was the son of a King, and Queequeg budged not. Struck by his desperate dauntlessness, and his wild desire to visit Christendom, the captain at last relented, and told him he might make himself at home. But this fine young savage- this sea Prince of Wales, never saw the Captain's cabin. They put him down among the sailors, and made a whaleman of him. But like Czar Peter content to toil in the shipyards of foreign cities, Queequeg disdained no seeming ignominy, if thereby he might happily gain the power of enlightening his untutored countrymen. For at bottom- so he told me- he was actuated by a profound desire to learn among the Christians, the arts whereby to make his people still happier than they were; and more than that, still better than they were. But, alas! the practices of whalemen soon convinced him that even Christians could be both miserable and wicked; infinitely more so, than all his father's heathens. Arrived at last in old Sag Harbor; and seeing what the sailors did there; and then going on to Nantucket, and seeing how they spent their wages in that place also, poor Queequeg gave it up for lost. Thought he, it's a wicked world in all meridians; I'll die a pagan.

And thus an old idolator at heart, he yet lived among these Christians, wore their clothes, and tried to talk their gibberish. Hence the queer ways about him, though now some time from home.

By hints I asked him whether he did not propose going back, and having a coronation; since he might now consider his father dead and gone, he being very old and feeble at the last accounts. He answered no, not yet; and added that he was fearful Christianity, or rather Christians, had unfitted him for ascending the pure and undefiled throne of thirty pagan Kings before him. But by and by, he said, he would return,- as soon as he felt himself baptized again. For the nonce, however, he proposed to sail about, and sow his wild oats in all four oceans. They had made a harpooneer of him, and that barbed iron was in lieu of a sceptre now.

I asked him what might be his immediate purpose, touching his future movements. He answered, to go to sea again, in his old vocation. Upon this, I told him that whaling was my own design, and informed him of my intention to sail out of Nantucket, as being the most promising port for an adventurous whaleman to embark from. He at once resolved to accompany me to that island, ship aboard the same vessel, get into the same watch, the same boat, the same mess with me, in short to share my every hap; with both my hands in his, boldly dip into the Potluck of both worlds. To all this I joyously assented; for besides the affection I now felt for Queequeg, he was an experienced harpooneer, and as such, could not fail to be of great usefulness to one, who, like me, was wholly ignorant of the mysteries of whaling, though well acquainted with the sea, as known to merchant seamen.

His story being ended with his pipe's last dying puff, Queequeg embraced me, pressed his forehead against mine, and blowing out the light, we rolled over from each other, this way and that, and very soon were sleeping.

Without looking I'm going to guess Gillis still looks horribad compared to competitive teams. Six 1st rounders plus trading away one. So 7 first round opportunities only resulted in one NHL player for the Canucks.
- boonerbuck

I agree, but the comparison holds more weight to me than the usual Benning vs Gillis.

SJS vs Van over the same period for reference.

Coyle, Hertl, Mueller
And
Hodgson, Schroeder, Jenson, Gaunce, Horvat.

2008 0 vs 10
2009 0 vs 22
2010 28 vs 0
2011 0 vs 29
2012 17 vs 26
2013 18 vs 9

That is my guess. I don't think Canucks reach arbitration with Goldy .
- VANTEL

I don’t think he filed for arbitration. So he either accepts the QO, or he doesn’t and his agent tries to negotiate a new deal.

Moby Richard
Chapter 12

Queequeg was a native of Rokovoko, an island far away to the West and South. It is not down on any map; true places never are.

When a new-hatched savage running wild about his native woodlands in a grass clout, followed by the nibbling goats, as if he were a green sapling; even then, in Queequeg's ambitious soul, lurked a strong desire to see something more of Christendom than a specimen whaler or two. His father was a High Chief, a King; his uncle a High Priest; and on the maternal side he boasted aunts who were the wives of unconquerable warriors. There was excellent blood in his veins- royal stuff; though sadly vitiated, I fear, by the cannibal propensity he nourished in his untutored youth.

A Sag Harbor ship visited his father's bay, and Queequeg sought a passage to Christian lands. But the ship, having her full complement of seamen, spurned his suit; and not all the King his father's influence could prevail. But Queequeg vowed a vow. Alone in his canoe, he paddled off to a distant strait, which he knew the ship must pass through when she quitted the island. On one side was a coral reef; on the other a low tongue of land, covered with mangrove thickets that grew out into the water. Hiding his canoe, still afloat, among these thickets, with its prow seaward, he sat down in the stern, paddle low in hand; and when the ship was gliding by, like a flash he darted out; gained her side; with one backward dash of his foot capsized and sank his canoe; climbed up the chains; and throwing himself at full length upon the deck, grappled a ring-bolt there, and swore not to let it go, though hacked in pieces.

In vain the captain threatened to throw him overboard; suspended a cutlass over his naked wrists; Queequeg was the son of a King, and Queequeg budged not. Struck by his desperate dauntlessness, and his wild desire to visit Christendom, the captain at last relented, and told him he might make himself at home. But this fine young savage- this sea Prince of Wales, never saw the Captain's cabin. They put him down among the sailors, and made a whaleman of him. But like Czar Peter content to toil in the shipyards of foreign cities, Queequeg disdained no seeming ignominy, if thereby he might happily gain the power of enlightening his untutored countrymen. For at bottom- so he told me- he was actuated by a profound desire to learn among the Christians, the arts whereby to make his people still happier than they were; and more than that, still better than they were. But, alas! the practices of whalemen soon convinced him that even Christians could be both miserable and wicked; infinitely more so, than all his father's heathens. Arrived at last in old Sag Harbor; and seeing what the sailors did there; and then going on to Nantucket, and seeing how they spent their wages in that place also, poor Queequeg gave it up for lost. Thought he, it's a wicked world in all meridians; I'll die a pagan.

And thus an old idolator at heart, he yet lived among these Christians, wore their clothes, and tried to talk their gibberish. Hence the queer ways about him, though now some time from home.

By hints I asked him whether he did not propose going back, and having a coronation; since he might now consider his father dead and gone, he being very old and feeble at the last accounts. He answered no, not yet; and added that he was fearful Christianity, or rather Christians, had unfitted him for ascending the pure and undefiled throne of thirty pagan Kings before him. But by and by, he said, he would return,- as soon as he felt himself baptized again. For the nonce, however, he proposed to sail about, and sow his wild oats in all four oceans. They had made a harpooneer of him, and that barbed iron was in lieu of a sceptre now.

I asked him what might be his immediate purpose, touching his future movements. He answered, to go to sea again, in his old vocation. Upon this, I told him that whaling was my own design, and informed him of my intention to sail out of Nantucket, as being the most promising port for an adventurous whaleman to embark from. He at once resolved to accompany me to that island, ship aboard the same vessel, get into the same watch, the same boat, the same mess with me, in short to share my every hap; with both my hands in his, boldly dip into the Potluck of both worlds. To all this I joyously assented; for besides the affection I now felt for Queequeg, he was an experienced harpooneer, and as such, could not fail to be of great usefulness to one, who, like me, was wholly ignorant of the mysteries of whaling, though well acquainted with the sea, as known to merchant seamen.

His story being ended with his pipe's last dying puff, Queequeg embraced me, pressed his forehead against mine, and blowing out the light, we rolled over from each other, this way and that, and very soon were sleeping.
- A_SteamingLombardi

YASSSSSS !!!!

(frank) the police !!!

I agree, but the comparison holds more weight to me than the usual Benning vs Gillis.

SJS vs Van over the same period for reference.

Coyle, Hertl, Mueller
And
Hodgson, Schroeder, Jenson, Gaunce, Horvat.

2008 0 vs 10
2009 0 vs 22
2010 28 vs 0
2011 0 vs 29
2012 17 vs 26
2013 18 vs 9
- belcherbd

...and the Horvat pick wasnt even from the back half of the draft like other competitive teams. It was a top 10 from NJ. They took Shink with their pick. So almost 100% fail in the first round over 6 years. Hodgsons 360+ games and Gaunce's 4rth line duties before he was given up on are the only things keeping Gillis' from 100% fail with his own 1st round picks in all that time.